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  1. #211
    Moderator Hidden Mew's Avatar Forum Head
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pikacuh View Post
    Well Totodile wasn't weak either, plus you got to remember there wasn't very many Gyms were he could have been used in, and just because he didn't have a Gym battle does not mean that was a weak pokemon either. I do believe Cyndaquil evolving was due to the HG/SS games even if they been out for 9 months, but Quilava will hopefully have more battles later on. Ash's Johto team was great in some of the battles they did have and the pacing was okay but it could had been a little bit more better.
    It could have been used in a few Gym battles at least like maybe against Pryce or Morty. It isn't the fact that it didn't win a Gym battle that makes me think that Totodile was weak. It's the fact that it had few victories under its belt compared to Bayleef and Cyndaquil. Considering that Quilava isn't marketing relevant, I can't really see it getting too many battles later on. The most we can hope for is being used in a future League, but it probably won't get that much even if that does happen. I still don't think Quilava evolving was due only to the HG/SS games. That probably was a factor, but considering that we didn't even see its first battle after evolving and it didn't even win, I don't think it was to promote the remaks. Ash's Johto team had some good battles, but it was still pretty underdeveloped as a whole.

  2. #212
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    I think Johto and Unova are his worst teams overall. Johto's problem was that it was bogged down by fillers, and really the Johto Pokemon didn't really do much of anything in them beside blast TR off.

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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Masurao View Post
    I think Johto and Unova are his worst teams overall. Johto's problem was that it was bogged down by fillers, and really the Johto Pokemon didn't really do much of anything in them beside blast TR off.
    I'd still give his Johto Pokemon an edge with most of them having more personality than his Unova team and they actually won Gym battles without being so forced or cheap.

  4. #214
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Masurao View Post
    I think Johto and Unova are his worst teams overall. Johto's problem was that it was bogged down by fillers, and really the Johto Pokemon didn't really do much of anything in them beside blast TR off.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hidden Mew View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pikacuh View Post
    Well Totodile wasn't weak either, plus you got to remember there wasn't very many Gyms were he could have been used in, and just because he didn't have a Gym battle does not mean that was a weak pokemon either. I do believe Cyndaquil evolving was due to the HG/SS games even if they been out for 9 months, but Quilava will hopefully have more battles later on. Ash's Johto team was great in some of the battles they did have and the pacing was okay but it could had been a little bit more better.
    It could have been used in a few Gym battles at least like maybe against Pryce or Morty. It isn't the fact that it didn't win a Gym battle that makes me think that Totodile was weak. It's the fact that it had few victories under its belt compared to Bayleef and Cyndaquil. Considering that Quilava isn't marketing relevant, I can't really see it getting too many battles later on. The most we can hope for is being used in a future League, but it probably won't get that much even if that does happen. I still don't think Quilava evolving was due only to the HG/SS games. That probably was a factor, but considering that we didn't even see its first battle after evolving and it didn't even win, I don't think it was to promote the remaks. Ash's Johto team had some good battles, but it was still pretty underdeveloped as a whole.
    I think Ash's Johto and Unova teams were handled perfectly well, as for Totodile maybe it could have been been used in the Morty Gym, not for sure how it would have done in the Pryce Gym battle. I do think Quilava evolving was due to the HG/SS games being out at the time, but i do think Quilava will be seen again in battle. I do believe the Johto team had great development as whole.

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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pikacuh View Post
    I think Ash's Johto and Unova teams were handled perfectly well, as for Totodile maybe it could have been been used in the Morty Gym, not for sure how it would have done in the Pryce Gym battle. I do think Quilava evolving was due to the HG/SS games being out at the time, but i do think Quilava will be seen again in battle. I do believe the Johto team had great development as whole.
    I really don't think either team was handled perfectly well. His Johto team was particularly underdeveloped since the only ones that came out looking pretty good were Bayleef and Cyndaquil. Totodile was underused and didn't have that many victories to begin with, Noctowl was seriously underused since it didn't really do much after learning Confusion, Heracross left too early and all of its strength was accomplished off-screen and Phanpy was introduced too late to where it couldn't really do much to stand out. His Unova team is just plain lackluster with too many Pokemon to stand out personality wise, only a small handful even get development and most of them are pretty weak. If their only reason to evolve Cyndaquil in DP was to promote HG/SS, even though they had been out for nine months, I still think that they would have shown its first battle and actually let it be the one that won the match for Ash, instead of going with Heracross. As an evolved form of one of the starters in the remakes, they would have wanted to make it look really good, but instead, it's battle is mostly on screen and it ends in a draw. If it was to promote HG/SS, they messed up on it pretty badly. It might be seen again in battle, but it's not too likely and even if it did, that doesn't really justify the treatment it got in the Sinnoh League. Plus, it's best chance to appear again would be in a future League, which wouldn't be for another couple of years or so at the earliest.

  6. #216
    Because I can. Caseydia's Avatar
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Masurao View Post
    I think Johto and Unova are his worst teams overall. Johto's problem was that it was bogged down by fillers, and really the Johto Pokemon didn't really do much of anything in them beside blast TR off.
    I do have to admit that I find his Unova team a bit more stronger. In Johto he had to rely on his kanto team a lot but in Unova he at least had some strong reserves that he caught. As far as development goes they both suffer but BW is a short series and too many pokemon, so it's no wonder. As far as Johto is concerned, they could have dumped his Kanto ones earlier. If not then don't catch all those pokemon and not use them in all of those fillers to help develop those pokemon.

  7. #217
    Registered User Pikacuh's Avatar
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Masurao View Post
    I think Johto and Unova are his worst teams overall. Johto's problem was that it was bogged down by fillers, and really the Johto Pokemon didn't really do much of anything in them beside blast TR off.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hidden Mew View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pikacuh View Post
    Well Totodile wasn't weak either, plus you got to remember there wasn't very many Gyms were he could have been used in, and just because he didn't have a Gym battle does not mean that was a weak pokemon either. I do believe Cyndaquil evolving was due to the HG/SS games even if they been out for 9 months, but Quilava will hopefully have more battles later on. Ash's Johto team was great in some of the battles they did have and the pacing was okay but it could had been a little bit more better.
    It could have been used in a few Gym battles at least like maybe against Pryce or Morty. It isn't the fact that it didn't win a Gym battle that makes me think that Totodile was weak. It's the fact that it had few victories under its belt compared to Bayleef and Cyndaquil. Considering that Quilava isn't marketing relevant, I can't really see it getting too many battles later on. The most we can hope for is being used in a future League, but it probably won't get that much even if that does happen. I still don't think Quilava evolving was due only to the HG/SS games. That probably was a factor, but considering that we didn't even see its first battle after evolving and it didn't even win, I don't think it was to promote the remaks. Ash's Johto team had some good battles, but it was still pretty underdeveloped as a whole.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hidden Mew View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pikacuh View Post
    I think Ash's Johto and Unova teams were handled perfectly well, as for Totodile maybe it could have been been used in the Morty Gym, not for sure how it would have done in the Pryce Gym battle. I do think Quilava evolving was due to the HG/SS games being out at the time, but i do think Quilava will be seen again in battle. I do believe the Johto team had great development as whole.
    I really don't think either team was handled perfectly well. His Johto team was particularly underdeveloped since the only ones that came out looking pretty good were Bayleef and Cyndaquil. Totodile was underused and didn't have that many victories to begin with, Noctowl was seriously underused since it didn't really do much after learning Confusion, Heracross left too early and all of its strength was accomplished off-screen and Phanpy was introduced too late to where it couldn't really do much to stand out. His Unova team is just plain lackluster with too many Pokemon to stand out personality wise, only a small handful even get development and most of them are pretty weak. If their only reason to evolve Cyndaquil in DP was to promote HG/SS, even though they had been out for nine months, I still think that they would have shown its first battle and actually let it be the one that won the match for Ash, instead of going with Heracross. As an evolved form of one of the starters in the remakes, they would have wanted to make it look really good, but instead, it's battle is mostly on screen and it ends in a draw. If it was to promote HG/SS, they messed up on it pretty badly. It might be seen again in battle, but it's not too likely and even if it did, that doesn't really justify the treatment it got in the Sinnoh League. Plus, it's best chance to appear again would be in a future League, which wouldn't be for another couple of years or so at the earliest.
    Well i thought Totodile was used fairly often in some battles it did have, Cyndaquil was used in a whole lot of Gym battles and did perfectly well in them, Bayleef had some great battles aswell, as for Noctowl it was shift in the bird department.

    As for wether or not Quilava will be used again in another Pokemon League only time will tell, besides the fact Ash have a whole lot of pokemon that hasn't been used in a very long time, but i do think that his Unova team were handled really great. I do believe his Johto team was strong and handled really well even though he did call on his Kanto team sometimes to help him out.
    Last edited by Pikacuh; 5th August 2013 at 09:09 AM.

  8. #218
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    Johto is as flawed as any region. That's all I have to say.

    Yes, there was an excess of filler episodes. Yes, someone were as boring as watching paint dry, but some were very funny and interesting as well.
    Last edited by Pokémon Master Ash; 9th August 2013 at 10:17 PM.

  9. #219
    Registered User Pikacuh's Avatar
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    Default Re: To what degree was Johto flawed?

    True. Johto did have some flaws like any other region, there was some good interesting fillers and there was some that were uninteresting and boring.

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