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  1. #46
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    At the beginning I could tolerate Yamamoto's style, but around volume 14 it got kinda bad. I like Mato's earlier style better, of course, but I think Yamamoto's RS style was a better approach than the late GSC one overall. Late Emerald and HGSS can get kinda cringe-inducing, though, but those arcs were obviously rushed at the end (and this isn't just because I happen to hate them the most :P).

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    F***ing Fabulous Lysandre's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1dbad View Post
    I'm so glad to hear you enjoy it and that you really like the new art style. :3 Especially since you're stuck with it from now on. ^^; But going in with low expectations was a good idea, but I really don't get why you expected Satoshi's art to be so bad. I mean I can understand liking Mato's and having nostalgia with it, but really, his artwork isn't that bad at all. In fact, it's actually my favorite for the series since I believe it fits the seriousness of the series a lot more, and works a lot better for the battle scenes and what not.

    I doubt it's intentional too, but I wouldn't be so sure Mato didn't know. Mato's artwork was slowly but surely decreasing as it went along, so she actually may have known it would eventually overpower her. She may not have, but it is a possibility. But back to your point about the odd coincidence -- I had never thought of it that way. =o But that's a very clever thing you picked up on there, and it makes a lot of sense. How oddly befitting and symbolic in a way.

    And hey, speaking of all of this, can I ask you a question? I know Mato quit because of the illness in her hands, but do you know exactly what disease she has/got? You mentioned that it hit (I'm guessing you mean as in it 'spread to'?) her hands which got me curious, and you seem like you actually know some about it. So I thought it was at least worth asking since I've never been able to find out EXACTLY what the disease is/was, besides that it affected her hands and forced her to quit.
    Honestly, I never managed to find that either. I'm just going based on what I've read in extended searches that have given no definite results. She seems very private about it (and in general) so I'm not sure if a direct answer is currently out there.

    I was only expecting the worst because I had heard bad things about the newer arcs as a kid from people who had imported them. Mainly just Mato fanboys who couldn't stand any change I suppose. I found the art thoroughly enjoyable once I gave it a chance.

    And thanks for your positive comments on my analysis, I'm glad someone else finds the connection interesting.

  3. #48

    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eitaro View Post
    I think the reason why Crystal looks that way was because Yamamoto tried to copy Mato's art style (or so I've heard)...
    Quote Originally Posted by ★Burning Soul★ View Post
    Yes, and starting with the RS arc they told him he could use his own style.
    Yes, that's exactly it. Since Mato got to where she couldn't draw anymore and had to quit in the middle of GSC; I remember reading that Kusaka and Yamamoto decided to try to pay tribute to her for the rest of the arc in his art. Which makes a lot of sense, and it's especially apparent on people Mato drew before him, because you can see he's trying to stay "true" to how she designed them more. Plus, you can tell that on people like Crystal, Claire, Eusine, Morty, ect. that Mato never got around to drawing, he ended up taking a few more liberties with them and draws them more in his own style.

    And that's exactly right, ★Burning Soul★. ^^ You and Eitaro sure know your stuff. ;P Right after GSC ended they said that that Yamamoto could use his own style for everything since he was there from the beginning for that arc. (you can tell in the artwork too) They just paid tribute to Mato during GSC since she did the first two volumes of that arc. :p

    Quote Originally Posted by Kenshi View Post
    At the beginning I could tolerate Yamamoto's style, but around volume 14 it got kinda bad. I like Mato's earlier style better, of course, but I think Yamamoto's RS style was a better approach than the late GSC one overall. Late Emerald and HGSS can get kinda cringe-inducing, though, but those arcs were obviously rushed at the end (and this isn't just because I happen to hate them the most :P).
    Really? I know you prefer Mato, but honestly I didn't think any part of GSC looked bad. If anything I thought it (like all of his art in general) got better as he went along since he got more used to drawing for the series. Not to mention it honestly doesn't look that different from the earlier parts of GSC he drew. I will agree with you though that the RS arc-onward had the best Yamamoto art, since he got to use his own style for everything and didn't have to keep trying to pay tribute to the previous art for the whole arc. And I don't think so. The Emerald and HGSS didn't look too different compared to any other arc either; I just think people who dislike those arcs just decide to hate the whole thing. Yes, I will give you that Emerald, and especially HGSS was rushed, but it's not really that bad. Not any worse than any of his other art for the series. If anything I think a better complaint would be the scenery was more boring, since for the most part those arcs took place in just like one or two locations. Sure in HGSS we got a bit more of Johto, but in Emerald we were basically just at the Frontier the whole arc.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeanLuc Pika-Q View Post
    Honestly, I never managed to find that either. I'm just going based on what I've read in extended searches that have given no definite results. She seems very private about it (and in general) so I'm not sure if a direct answer is currently out there.

    I was only expecting the worst because I had heard bad things about the newer arcs as a kid from people who had imported them. Mainly just Mato fanboys who couldn't stand any change I suppose. I found the art thoroughly enjoyable once I gave it a chance.

    And thanks for your positive comments on my analysis, I'm glad someone else finds the connection interesting.
    Ah, I see. But hearing that she's private about it (and in general) makes things make a bit more sense as to why it's so hard to find out. I could never find out anything so at least now I know the reason why it's so hard to find out. (because of her not really saying it and being so private) So thanks for telling me everything you know. It may not be much but it still helps a lot. Huh, maybe instead of trying Mato someone who knows Japanese should try asking the official Japanese site. Satoshi and Hidenori both respond to questions and comments there, and maybe they would be a bit more apt to give us some more info about it. (unless Mato told them not to)

    Ah, I see. I can definitely understand that then. ^^ But I'm glad you still gave it a chance anyway and ended up liking it. I really think any fan of the series who's open-minded would. And as someone who is up-to-date with the series in Japan I can definitely there is nothing to worry about with future Satoshi art. The new art is actually really good, and it actually gets better as it goes along. So even if it's not Mato's you should still be able to enjoy it no problem. ^^ But yeah, that's probably it. No offense to them, but I've noticed that a lot of Mato fan's tend to over-exaggerate about the new artist just because it's not Mato. (and doesn't have that same nostalgia attached) I mean I can understand preferring Mato and all that, but really, the new art is not that bad. To be honest it's not too different from any other anime/manga out there in the world, so if a person can enjoy and tolerate the art of countless other animes/mangas, they should be able to tolerate Satoshi's. Especially since it's accompanied by such great stories as well. ^^

    And you're welcome! I found it very interesting; and I can always appreciate a good analysis by a fellow fan. ;] If you have any other analysis or theories definitely feel free to share them!
    Last edited by 1dbad; 27th December 2010 at 08:02 AM.

  4. #49
    Happy NintendoDay Europe! Joshawott's Avatar Forum Head
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Well, I wonder if Mato asked all who knew to keep quiet about it? Obviously, it must have crushed her to be told that she wouldn't be able to draw again, so she probably wanted it brushed under the carpet to help her move on from it.

  5. #50

    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu Shoji View Post
    Well, I wonder if Mato asked all who knew to keep quiet about it? Obviously, it must have crushed her to be told that she wouldn't be able to draw again, so she probably wanted it brushed under the carpet to help her move on from it.
    That's very possible. From what people have said Mato seems to be a very private person; and like you said it's definitely understandable why she wouldn't want to talk about it either.

    I just wish we knew a bit more about it since all we know is that it affected her hands, made it where she couldn't draw, and she had to quit. An answer that vague does leave you wondering; especially since there are actually a few different things it could have been.

    Either way though I hope that at the very least she's feeling much better now. ^^

  6. #51
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1dbad View Post
    Ah, I see. But hearing that she's private about it (and in general) makes things make a bit more sense as to why it's so hard to find out. I could never find out anything so at least now I know the reason why it's so hard to find out. (because of her not really saying it and being so private) So thanks for telling me everything you know. It may not be much but it still helps a lot. Huh, maybe instead of trying Mato someone who knows Japanese should try asking the official Japanese site. Satoshi and Hidenori both respond to questions and comments there, and maybe they would be a bit more apt to give us some more info about it. (unless Mato told them not to)
    Well, I doubt there is much chance they would feel comfortable replying, but perhaps it's worth a try. I guess I just kind of doubt with her even hiding her real name (unless her first and last name is actually Mato, heheh) on everything she publishes and her own site that anyone else would be able to provide details about particularly tragic parts of her life. I did, however, find her personal site (http://www1.odn.ne.jp/ginta/mato/). May not do any good but worth a shot? I also don't see any published manga past 2001 under "Works" on there, so it looks like either she never improved or gave up on it when she did :(

  7. #52
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Well, the final few rounds in Emerald were either volume-only or serialized in miscellaneous Pokiman magazines (while DP had to be serialized normally), so they were obviously not up to the usual alley the main magazine chapters were at. Good point with the scenery, though; we got, like, a cave, some buildings, and water for the most part when we spent 4 volumes in that mess of an island, whereas with others, especially Kanto (kinda), Hoenn and Sinnoh, we saw a bit more (if we actually had more to look in Johto-only locations like Mt. Silver, Blackthorn, etc., it'd be up there, too).

    And as we see with the artist's change in drawing Gold and Red (the former in particular), yeah, the imitation of Mato's artwork where it was hitting a slump with the early Johto volumes doesn't really live up to those two characters' later appearances in FRLG and onwards. Just my opinion, though.

  8. #53

    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeanLuc Pika-Q View Post
    Well, I doubt there is much chance they would feel comfortable replying, but perhaps it's worth a try. I guess I just kind of doubt with her even hiding her real name (unless her first and last name is actually Mato, heheh) on everything she publishes and her own site that anyone else would be able to provide details about particularly tragic parts of her life. I did, however, find her personal site (http://www1.odn.ne.jp/ginta/mato/). May not do any good but worth a shot? I also don't see any published manga past 2001 under "Works" on there, so it looks like either she never improved or gave up on it when she did :(
    That's true too. They probably wouldn't since they are probably trying to respect Mato's privacy, and plus I'm sure Satoshi would feel sad if someone asked about the old artist instead of him. But it might still be worth a try since I really want to know. I'll see if I can talk one of my friends who knows Japanese into posting the question the official site later, haha. :p I don't know if I'll be able to convince her or if we'll even get a reply, but if I find out anything I'll be sure to let you guys know. And really? She doesn't even say her real name on her site? (I never knew since I don't read Japanese) I figured she'd still use Mato some since that is her pen name (and maybe it's her first name?), but I'm kind of surprised she doesn't include her real/full name as well. Huh. But yeah, you're right; the fact that she never says on her official site and that no one has ever been able to find out after all this time says we're probably never going to find out. Ah well. Thanks for the site though; but I'm actually already familiar with it thanks to Bulbapedia, but I still do appreciate it. ^^ And I noticed that as well. Even other manga sites don't have anything listed for her beyond 2001. And that's probably true; that either she still can't draw or no longer has any desire to. Which is sad. :( Believe it or not that's actually one of the reasons I want to know so bad, so we can know whether it's a disease she can recover from or something she'll always have, so we could know which one is correct. Because I've read both theories on two different sites and would like to know which one is true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kenshi View Post
    Well, the final few rounds in Emerald were either volume-only or serialized in miscellaneous Pokiman magazines (while DP had to be serialized normally), so they were obviously not up to the usual alley the main magazine chapters were at. Good point with the scenery, though; we got, like, a cave, some buildings, and water for the most part when we spent 4 volumes in that mess of an island, whereas with others, especially Kanto (kinda), Hoenn and Sinnoh, we saw a bit more (if we actually had more to look in Johto-only locations like Mt. Silver, Blackthorn, etc., it'd be up there, too).

    And as we see with the artist's change in drawing Gold and Red (the former in particular), yeah, the imitation of Mato's artwork where it was hitting a slump with the early Johto volumes doesn't really live up to those two characters' later appearances in FRLG and onwards. Just my opinion, though.
    The final few rounds of Emerald were released as volume-only. They weren't released in any magazines because they decided in the middle of Emerald to start focusing on DP. And I disagree actually. I would think if anything being volume-only releases they should have been much better, since Satoshi could take his time with the art more due to a less strict deadline. Special's current release schedule is four volumes a year on average; which would mean he could take his time with the last few chapters compared to rushing them out in a bundle of two-three chapters every month. And I actually thought it really showed too. Like that two page spread in volume 29 where Red, Blue, Green, Yellow, Gold, Silver, Crystal, Ruby, Sapphire and Emerald all fight the Battle Frontier rental Pokemon? Awesome. And the giant pseudo-Kyogre water beast destroying the Frontier? Also awesome. Really well done and full of so much detail, even for him. But again, I guess it's just a matter of opinion. I do appreciate that you like/agree with my point about the scenery. I think that's one of the main things a lot of people didn't like about those arcs were that it didn't show off all the areas as well as the paired game arcs usually do. But the thing was they had already showed pretty much all of Kanto, Johto, Hoenn and Sinnoh, so in other arcs with those regions they decided to focus and showcase areas they hadn't really showed before. And, they didn't really think they had to show them again since they had already done it before. And really? You don't think we saw enough of Johto? I think we saw quite a bit actually, definitely enough to include it at the very least. (especially if you have Kanto on your list) And actually we did get to see Mt. Silver in GSC (Red and Sabrina healing themselves in the hot springs anyone?) and we even got to see a bit of Blackthorn and the Dragon's Den thanks to Claire. I do agree though it would have been nice to have seen Blackthorn City as a whole though compared to just random bits and pieces. I bet it would have looked awesome.

    So wait, I'm not quite getting this last paragraph. Are you saying you liked how Satoshi did Red and (especially) Gold better when he was paying tribute to Mato in GSC or liked how they looked better in FRLG and onwards? (where he used his own style) Because on me personally, I don't believe there is much to complain about with them in GSC. If anything, most Mato fans I know loved that arc because Red, Gold, Silver, Yellow and Green (the guy) looked pretty much just like Mato drew them herself. (but in non-chibi form) In fact, I thought Satoshi did such a good job of imitating her style for GSC that I swear if I didn't know better I would have thought that she drew some of the characters there, lol. Which was very impressive, especially since her style is so different to his own. But personally I prefer how Red and especially Gold looked in FRLG-onward better. Gold just looked so awesome in Emerald and HGSS, and Red looked pretty great in FRLG and Emerald as well.
    Last edited by 1dbad; 28th December 2010 at 11:58 AM.

  9. #54
    F***ing Fabulous Lysandre's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    I do have uplifting news: it looks like Mato is doing better enough to draw again!

    It took some sleuth work (and a lot of Google Translate) but it looks like she's illustrated several books from 2009 to the present.

    Click on the blue link in the sidebar of her website, then click on the pink link. It's a list of hardcover books she's illustrated, including newer ones.

    Now go here:

    http://shop.kodansha.jp/bc2_bc/search_view.jsp?b=285163

    Now click the little blue button with arrows under the book cover on this page. A new window should open up for browsing part of the book. Click on the left page to go forward (this is read Japanese style after all!)

    As you can see, there's enough of her old style in her character's profile views to see it's her, but she's actually really improved aside from that (unless she wasn't trying very hard during Pokemon Adventures). She may not be doing manga, but she is still doing what she loves, and doing it better than ever before :)

  10. #55
    BattleFanatic Eitarou's Avatar Archives StaffBulbapedia Editorial BoardModerator
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    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    That's not really news

    But it is a good thing she's better

  11. #56

    Default Re: Pokemon Adventures Volume 10 Review Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeanLuc Pika-Q View Post
    I do have uplifting news: it looks like Mato is doing better enough to draw again!

    It took some sleuth work (and a lot of Google Translate) but it looks like she's illustrated several books from 2009 to the present.

    Click on the blue link in the sidebar of her website, then click on the pink link. It's a list of hardcover books she's illustrated, including newer ones.

    Now go here:

    http://shop.kodansha.jp/bc2_bc/search_view.jsp?b=285163

    Now click the little blue button with arrows under the book cover on this page. A new window should open up for browsing part of the book. Click on the left page to go forward (this is read Japanese style after all!)

    As you can see, there's enough of her old style in her character's profile views to see it's her, but she's actually really improved aside from that (unless she wasn't trying very hard during Pokemon Adventures). She may not be doing manga, but she is still doing what she loves, and doing it better than ever before :)
    That's awesome news! :D She must be finally improving from her condition. ^^

    That's neat that she's feeling better though and has started illustrating again. I wonder if she'll eventually go back to manga work once she gains up some more strength. It'd be cool if she did another manga of her own or something, but I could understand if she didn't want to try manga again since it seemed to affect her so bad last time. It is very nice that she can draw again though, that's bound to cheer her (and her fans) up!

    Thanks for the link btw, it was nice to see one of Mato's latest works. ^^ And I agree, you can definitely tell it's her by the style. She has really improved though, she doesn't seem to be using chibis at all and for her her work seems to be looking a bit more detailed, which is good. To be honest I don't know what it was with Pokemon Adventures, but I would assume she was trying there. I've heard some people say that she may have been trying to make her artwork look more like the early game graphics, but then again Kusaka accepted Satoshi no problem so that may not be it. (plus from what I've seen how she drew Adventures was just her style, not something she was doing just for the series) My guess is that her disease/condition really started to affect her while she was working on Adventures, so of course her art wouldn't be too good there. Adventures was the series that did her in for a while there, after all. (probably due to the strict magazine deadlines once it got picked up somewhere in Yellow) But that's true, Mato's better, doing what she loves to do again, and has definitely improved. :) I guess she was determined to come back with vengeance, hahaha.

    All this talk of Mato now has me curious, what about Satoshi? I know he's fine since he's still doing the series and all, but I remember reading that he's illustrated for some other mangas as well. I'd love to check out one of the other series he's done if I could, since I really like his work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eitaro View Post
    That's not really news

    But it is a good thing she's better
    Really? It's news to me! Haha. Then again I didn't first find out about Special 'til late 2009/early 2010 if memory serves. And I hadn't really searched for info on the artists either. ^^;

    It is!

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