Thread: Fire and Ice Mafia --Fire Mafia won! (2/26/13)

Originally Posted by Master Mew

That is an inaccurate summary of my case against you, and ignores the fact that I have obviously been angling toward the conclusion that you were scum this entire phase and was not, in fact, following Midorikawa.

You were?

Originally Posted by Master Mew

My reversal of opinion on you demonstrates that I am legitimately scumhunting - your behavior changed, and my read changed. It would have been easier to ignore it and let the Soulmaster wagon slip through if I were scum.

What change in behavior?

I could be Mafia trying to lynch Soulmaster, who I think could be either Fire or Ice Mafia. If I was Ice Mafia I'd think he'd be Fire Mafia and vice versa.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

Your "case" on me boils down to the fact that I suspect you now, care to explain how that isn't OMGUS?

Uhh... No it doesn't???

One second, he thinks I'm Town with the "town slips", and then SUDDENLY agrees with you Midorikawa that they could be easily fabricated, and votes me.

Hmmm... Now you're lying about my case on you :P.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

And if your theory is that Soulmaster and I are the last scum, why did you unvote him, and why are you waiting to see if your case takes hold before you vote for me?

I already said why. Feralize could hammer in any minute if she wished to. More time is good, like you said ^_^.

wow

now wanting more time is bad??? :P

@HumanDawn;

A few things:

-I did say I had a scumread on Soulmaster.

-I'm not "avoiding responsibility" by not hammering. I didn't vote him because the phase would have ended prematurely. The better alternative is allowing the phase to run out and using the excess time to scumhunt, which is what's been going on.

-You seem to realize the point I just made in this sentence: "now I want all the time I could get with these 72 hour Day Phases." So why are you trying to incriminate me for not dropping the hammer?

-Your "town slips" have convinced me more and more that they could be faked. Anyone could simply mix up the two mafias' kills to look town. It happening once may be a fluke, a true towntell, but more just seems less and less authentic to me.

-You said in a previous post that you got town vibes from me, and now you're trying to incriminate me. Master Mew said he thought you were town, and his opinion seems to be changing/has changed. I think it's pretty ridiculous to try to make him look bad for doing something that you did too.

Vote: HumanDawn

Originally Posted by Feralize

A few things:

-I did say I had a scumread on Soulmaster.

-I'm not "avoiding responsibility" by not hammering. I didn't vote him because the phase would have ended prematurely. The better alternative is allowing the phase to run out and using the excess time to scumhunt, which is what's been going on.

Okay, thank you for clarifying.

Originally Posted by Feralize

-You seem to realize the point I just made in this sentence: "now I want all the time I could get with these 72 hour Day Phases." So why are you trying to incriminate me for not dropping the hammer?

Because you didn't say this. How was I supposed to know that you agreed with not hammering Soulmaster?

Originally Posted by Feralize

-Your "town slips" have convinced me more and more that they could be faked. Anyone could simply mix up the two mafias' kills to look town. It happening once may be a fluke, a true towntell, but more just seems less and less authentic to me.

I've been having a hard time in real life at the moment, having problems breathing this past week as I've just said. I could fake them as a Townie too to appear innocent, but you chose the alternative of me being Mafia faking them. And, it's only 2, and I swear I've been really derping about this. I have a Skype chat with Akuraito I could print screen and show, but I can see you pulling the "that could be easily faked!" argument where you'd just ignore it, so there's no point.

Originally Posted by Feralize

-You said in a previous post that you got town vibes from me, and now you're trying to incriminate me. Master Mew said he thought you were town, and his opinion seems to be changing/has changed. I think it's pretty ridiculous to try to make him look bad for doing something that you did too.

Yeah... And? I can also get scum vibes and town vibes from somebody. I did what the same as him?

EDIT:

If I'm going to be lynched, I'd rather be lynched with having my vote be put on scum.

VOTE: Master Mew

---

Okay, screw this. If my health is going to be disrespected in this game in the most insulting manner possible by being ignored, I'm just going to have to use my alternative energy, ROLEPLAYING ENERGY.

Roleplaying energy is when I decide to roleplay as a character, and that character gives me energy.

I'm going to take the energy of Quercus Alba, an old man from AA: Miles Edgeworth. He's sick and old, but he could defend himself pretty well, and even though he lost in the end, like I am going to by the looks of things, he put up a good fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWu-P1FAIP4

Oh and if anyone dare say that I'm Mafia because he's a bad guy in the games I'm going to bang my head in the wall.

Anyway, lets get serious.

I'm going to destroy every argument against me.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

There's a pattern of behavior. Look at his voting history. He finally gets his way, he's been onto Soulmaster this whole time, he starts the wagon today and it finally catches on - and he unvotes.

Soulmaster gave a satisfying rebuttal, and I was a bit worried of the hammer. Pray tell, what's wrong about that?

Originally Posted by Master Mew

If you look at the original vote, he left himself room to do so through ambiguity. And as you pointed out when I brought up towntells before, Mido, every single one of them could have been faked. The most recent one looks ridiculously forced. Nobody's been asking him about the nightkills, he's been bringing them up just to "slip."

What ambiguity? :P

Oh, so now that you want me to be lynched, you're going to think they're fake? :P

I love Roserade. Sue me.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

He's been careful to not lead lynches, to find exits to prevailing wagons (look at his brief departure from the FinalArcadia wagon yesterday), and to push lynches he doesn't think he'll get. We finally went for Soulmaster today, and he vacated the wagon to look elsewhere.

I haven't been careful of that, and I haven't left he wagon to look elsewhere. I already explained why.

AND WOW

The hypocrisy in that quote is just IMMENSE. You haven't led any lynches, and you voted on Feralize Day 2, when the Town was insistent on getting rid of FinalArcadia. Understandable to get more time, but then I do the same thing by unvoting Soulmaster and you vote me.

With your case against me you may as well vote yourself :P.

-Your "town slips" have convinced me more and more that they could be faked. Anyone could simply mix up the two mafias' kills to look town. It happening once may be a fluke, a true towntell, but more just seems less and less authentic to me.

Not when I'm genuinely sick as I've said earlier in this thread? This is also hypocritical. I respect your inactivity with you being busy, but you don't respect my health issues and vote me anyway? That... just makes me feel so disrespected, really.

And if anyone seriously thinks that I'd go as far as faking my well being for a week and that me feeling disrespected is just an act to defend myself as Mafia, then I'm going to feel offended about that too.

---

1. No one has disrespected your health.

2. I have tried to lead lynches, and am trying again today. The difference between my attempts and yours is that when people did follow my lead, I kept pushing the case instead of backing off to look elsewhere (which I'm sorry, pretty plainly is what you're doing - or did I miss the part where you're still trying to lynch Soulmaster?)

3. No one has accused you of pretending to be sick. You have been accused of pretending to be a Townie.

Everything else is stuff we've already been over, I'm not interested in talking in circles and I'm not going to convince you to lynch yourself anyway.

I don't appreciate the implication that we should feel bad about ourselves for voting for you, by the way.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

1. No one has disrespected your health.

I think it's very unsportsmanlike to force somebody to scumhunt instead of letting them take their time, especially when they said they've been sick(disrespect by ignoring it). That was also horrible meta reasoning. Some hypocrisy then came from Feralize(I respected and took note of what she said about her inactivity and she didn't bother to answer me).

Originally Posted by Master Mew

2. I have tried to lead lynches, and am trying again today. The difference between my attempts and yours is that when people did follow my lead, I kept pushing the case instead of backing off to look elsewhere (which I'm sorry, pretty plainly is what you're doing - or did I miss the part where you're still trying to lynch Soulmaster?)

And what's wrong with backing off(not entirely) and looking elsewhere? I said that I was worried of Feralize possibly hammering Soulmaster, and with my paranoia, I unvoted. He would have been lynched anyway, I think. Why bother to keep on pushing a lynch on somebody when you've already said all your reasons and they're going to be lynched anyway when that time could be used to think of other alternatives like you just said?

Can't see how that would equate to scum. If I were scum, I'd do wiser to keep on lynching the person I think is scum instead ;).

Oh and you could totally be scum trying to get rid of a better Town player. Just sayin'. Or maybe scum trying to get rid of scum, letting you have one nightkill.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

3. No one has accused you of pretending to be sick. You have been accused of pretending to be a Townie.

Yes, which from the Town slips I made, where because I was sick. My defense is that since I was sick, those slips happened. Yet now that I've been told that I could have fabricated them out of nowhere from you and Feralize, and when I said that I made these mistakes because I was legitimately sick and not because I was trying too hard to look Town or anything, the votes were kept me, and thus the fact that I was sick was disregarded, that it means nothing. "You were sick? So what?".

Originally Posted by Master Mew

Everything else is stuff we've already been over, I'm not interested in talking in circles and I'm not going to convince you to lynch yourself anyway.

What stuff?

So basically, you can't be bothered to present a decent case against me and combat my points? :P

Wow Master Mew. If you're going to lynch me as scum, at least debate with me. That would be fun.

if you're really not scum somehow my paranoia level is going to increase next game i'm with you where i'm town

Originally Posted by Master Mew

I don't appreciate the implication that we should feel bad about ourselves for voting for you, by the way.

Expressing disgust at my illness being ignored and not factored in the argument is not an implication for you to feel bad about ignoring it. The votes being kept show that it has been ignored. Midorikawa, Feralize and you have ignored it by keeping your votes and not talking about it.

We're still voting for you because sick people can be scum, too...?

No one is ignoring your sickness - I'm sorry you're sick and hope you feel better soon. It doesn't exempt you from scrutiny in any way, however. It's utterly irrelevant to the context of this game.

Weirdly my vote is on you because I think you're scum, not because I'm a jerk who wants to make a sick guy even more miserable - seriously, none of us are that way and you know it.

@HumanDawn; I understand your sick and I know how that feels. Honestly I don't think you should be doing anything but resting in that case even if it gets you lynched, though considering these are three day day phases then you have time to defend yourself even amongst your rest. You keep bringing up your sick like we should unvote you just because of it, but the fact that your so active while your sick shows that it's not serious enough to you to spend time resting instead of sitting on the computer. I'm sorry your sick and I hope you get better soon but I'm not going to brush off your behavior and unvote and ignore you just because your sick.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

We're still voting for you because sick people can be scum, too...?

Yes they can, but ONE of the reasons put against me for being scum was because of the Townslips that could have been fabricated, which as I said, the mistakes were genuine because of my sickness. If I was scum, I honestly wouldn't go down to that level of low to use my sickness to my advantage. It's also way too risky for me to even do those as scum.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

No one is ignoring your sickness - I'm sorry you're sick and hope you feel better soon. It doesn't exempt you from scrutiny in any way, however. It's utterly irrelevant to the context of this game.

Okay, then it would have been really nice, and I would have really appreciated if that was taken into the argument. I know that, but from a part of the case that was from Midorikawa because I wasn't scumhunting as much, and as I said, that's because I was sick, which I'm pretty sure she read before, but then she didn't respond to it. Being sick is a serious thing, so it makes me uncomfortable to see it be ignored, not responded to.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

Weirdly my vote is on you because I think you're scum, not because I'm a jerk who wants to make a sick guy even more miserable - seriously, none of us are that way and you know it.

Master Mew, I'm not the other Mafia member you want dead so you could then be the only Mafia member left alive ;P. Yes, you said it yourself, I KNOW IT. Why even say that?

Just because it's a game doesn't mean I that I don't have every right to think I'm being mistreated in it, being removed from it for the wrong reasons were personal issues have been affecting me. There are other factors, true, but if you're not going to debate with the factors, at least recognize the personal ones IMMEDIATELY.

Originally Posted by Midorikawa

@HumanDawn; I understand your sick and I know how that feels. Honestly I don't think you should be doing anything but resting in that case even if it gets you lynched, though considering these are three day day phases then you have time to defend yourself even amongst your rest. You keep bringing up your sick like we should unvote you just because of it, but the fact that your so active while your sick shows that it's not serious enough to you to spend time resting instead of sitting on the computer. I'm sorry your sick and I hope you get better soon but I'm not going to brush off your behavior and unvote and ignore you just because your sick.

Defending myself hasn't been doing me any favors thus far, because no matter how good the defense is, it will be ignored and not debated against. I still keep on defending myself because I see the fun in it. Join in Midorikawa. Debate against me. I got 4 hours left. Master Mew has chickened out it seems. Oh I've been resting a few extra hours every day because of my breathing problem. Spending time on the computer can be relaxing as it doesn't use much energy(staying in bed with laptop rewatching episode 10 of PMMM ftw!), but using that time to scum hunt can be a huge bother, and too much use of brain power. No Midorikawa, if you read my entire defense like you should, you'd learn that the sick thing shouldn't mean that I should be unvoted because of it.


I'm just going to conclude this entire sick thing here. I think this has gone long enough already, where I've been falsely accused of guilt tripping and calling people insensitive over expressing my anger. It's best to stop it here in case it goes crazier.

---

Anyway, this chickening out from Master Mew, not debating with my defense is pretty anti-town, and a very common Mafia trait. Master Mew also claims to be pushing the lynch on me... without actually pushing it by debating with my defense. Another hypocritical thing. The scummiest player so far in my eyes is Master Mew for reasons I have explained that haven't been debunked. I've cast my defense that hasn't been debunked, I've destroyed the reasons for the votes on me, and still have yet not been unvoted.

@HumanDawn; If you turn up town then I'll go after MM, if you're mafia then well he could of course still be mafia, but will have a smaller chance. Also I'm not chickening out. I've been really tired lately so my activity has dropped and I also have real life things to deal with so sorry I haven't been able to dedicate so much time to this game lately.

Originally Posted by Midorikawa

@HumanDawn; If you turn up town then I'll go after MM, if you're mafia then well he could of course still be mafia, but will have a smaller chance. Also I'm not chickening out. I've been really tired lately so my activity has dropped and I also have real life things to deal with so sorry I haven't been able to dedicate so much time to this game lately.

It's highly likely that you won't have a chance to, that's why I'm trying my hardest to defend myself. Okay, so you're just going to lynch me anyway despite my defense and despite the fact that Master Mew has been acting extremely scummy dodging my attacks on him, where he lied and said it was just an OMGUS, where I then had to quote my reason that he then ignored responding to? Even when he said that we'd just be going in circles in the debate with him saying that I'm scum for no good, backed up reason when I keep debating with him with different things for him to combat? And the amount of hypocrisy keeps on rising. You're busy and tired, okay, I respect that, sounds believable enough... but... When you voted me, didn't you say that I could be scum because I haven't scumhunted much? I told you I was sick, and couldn't bother more than usual because of it.

Just, ugggggghhhh... Midorikawa, I honestly believe that you're Town, and that if you're SOMEHOW Mafia pretending to be Town, then you've done a really good job fooling me. Honestly, if ALL THIS really good defending and scumhunting on Master hasn't made you think I'm Town, then I just don't know what even will. I'd definitely be disappointed in you.

Human, I haven't been quote-walling you because, frankly, I've been at work all day and if you've ever tried multiquoting on a cellphone, you know it takes longer than a fifteen minute break allows.

I haven't been satisfied with your rebuttal to any of the points brought against you, so my initial case still represents my current stance.

I don't want you to feel shortchanged, however, so I'll tell you what: Briefly summarize your response to each of the points brought against you (we're talking a sentence or two, be succinct) and enumerate them, and I'll do my darnedest to get a reply in quickly explaining why I find each rebuttal dissatisfying.

@HumanDawn; That wasn't my sole reason for voting you. Also I'll re-look at your case against MM if you can put it in simple sentences because at this point all these wall posts are starting to confuse me and it's difficult to find anything

Originally Posted by Master Mew

I haven't been satisfied with your rebuttal to any of the points brought against you, so my initial case still represents my current stance.

I have countered everything perfectly in the most satisfying way possible with an unbreakable rebuttal.

Originally Posted by Master Mew

I don't want you to feel shortchanged, however, so I'll tell you what: Briefly summarize your response to each of the points brought against you (we're talking a sentence or two, be succinct) and enumerate them, and I'll do my darnedest to get a reply in quickly explaining why I find each rebuttal dissatisfying.

If you read them to be unsatisfactory, it's going to be in vain to tell you them anyway. The phase is almost over. If you do know how much of a pain it is in mobile to post, I'm pretty sure you won't say much that hardly constitutes as a rebuttal.

Originally Posted by Midorikawa

@HumanDawn; That wasn't my sole reason for voting you. Also I'll re-look at your case against MM if you can put it in simple sentences because at this point all these wall posts are starting to confuse me and it's difficult to find anything

Yes, I know it wasn't your sole given reason. I took care of everything else.

Wow. That goes to show how everything I said has been in vain and ignored.


@Feralize;

You're on Skype at the moment.

[01:40:49] Human: Are you busy at the moment?
[01:43:24] Feralize: Not especially.

Are you going to insist on lynching me after everything I've said?

@HumanDawn; This game is a No Outside Communications game, which means skype is not allowed and communication happens IN THREAD ONLY. Proof/reasoning in the form of outside communications is also forbidden. The next time you use another form of communication that is not in thread you will be modkilled.

So, I offer you exactly what you asked for: A chance for a complete response to every one of your defenses, and you say no?

Interesting.

Fine: Your "townslips" looked fake. You said they were real because you're sick - but we have no way of knowing if they're real slips because you're sick, or if you're scun trying to look town and just happen to also be sick. That's why that defense is inadequate.

You softclaimed Doctor even though you weren't the Doctor. You say it was a survival gambit, but the best way for a Doctor to survive is to hide, not give awat their role. This raises more questions: Why is the player who softclaimed Doctor still alive?

You kept pushing a Soulmaster lynch until it looked like you would finally get it, then unvoted him because suddenly you weren't so sure about him and wanted to look around first. You claim this was genuine, but it really doesn't look that way. After looking around you concluded that Soulmaster was in fact scum, and that I was the other scum, but instead of doing the pragmatic thing for a townie and rejoining the Soulmaster wagon, you voted for me - again, pushing a wagon you were less likely to get so that the Town could lynch Soulmaster and if he flipped Town you wouldn't be responsible.

I have a very hard time believing that your suspicions on Soulmaster are genuine because if they were, you still could have accomplished that lynch.

And finally: Your vote on me was OMGUS. The quote your provided actually demonstrates that. Read it, you had As townread on me earlier in the game an never revoked it, but when I "suddenly" suspected you, you suddenly suspected me.

Trusting people who trust you and suspecting people who suspect you is a scumtrait - who better to keep around than the players who think you're town? If I recall correctly, you espoused a townread on Feralize for her questioning the Day 1 case on you as well.

I think I remembered the important points, would have been easier if you'd provided them, though.

And so ends my lunch break. :/