Thread: Who is the better Champion: Adeku (Alder) or Shirona (Cynthia)?

Ever since Diamond & Pearl, the writers of the series have been giving us more of the regions' Champions than we had been getting in the other series. Based on what we've seen of the Champions in the TV series - their personalities, their pokemon, their interactions with Satoshi and his friends, their impact on the plot - which Champion do you like better? And why?

Alder, for sure. His personality is hilarious, and his Bouffalant had some funny scenes as well in the Gigalith episode. They should show more of his pokemon though. Cynthia on the other hand is a complete bore IMO and so is her Garchomp. Plus those riddles like "blah blah when two lives meet something will be born blah" are kind of annoying, and what the heck does that one even mean? Sure, she contributed to the plot more than Alder did but I'd still prefer a fun champion like Alder over a dull one.

Also it's kind of unfair to judge both of them because BW isn't over and Alser could get more episodes later on. 80% of these votes will most likely go to Cynthia.

cynthia i just like her pokemon better and i think she is a stronger trainerand acts more like the ideal champion and i loved d/p so sorry my answer is a little bias

Originally Posted by Shining Triad Leader

cynthia i just like her pokemon better and i think she is a stronger trainerand acts more like the ideal champion and i loved d/p so sorry my answer is a little bias

How can you tell if she is stronger? We haven't even seen every pokemon from their teams. Alder could be stronger as far as we know.

^^ like i apoligized for earlier im bias i just think that garchomp and lucario ang togekiss and those guys are stronger than some of the unova guys im not saying im right just what i predict surely u can at least see where i'm coming from no:)?

it could go either way i still choose cynthia for personality

Cynthia--she doesn't act like a total idiot outside of battle. Or in battle, for that matter.

So how do you guys feel about Shirona being the one to help Satoshi and his friends fight off the Kami Trio in Season 2? Why wasn't Adeku the one helping to protect the Isshu region?

It reminds me of how Wataru (Lance) was just randomly thrown into the Magma/Aqua conflict for no reason at all.

Originally Posted by DracoMan

Cynthia--she doesn't act like a total idiot outside of battle. Or in battle, for that matter.

Please explain how Alder was being an idiot in battle. He beat Trip quite quickly.

Originally Posted by Dogasu

So how do you guys feel about Shirona being the one to help Satoshi and his friends fight off the Kami Trio in Season 2? Why wasn't Adeku the one helping to protect the Isshu region?

Because he wasn't there at the time, and the writers didn't want comedic relief in that episode.

Even though I definitely like Alder, Cynthia most certainly takes the price in my book. I've always been a huge fan of her both in-game and in the anime, and before Iris was confirmed to be the B2/W2 Champion she was in fact my favorite Champion out of all.

I have always preferred female characters over the male ones for certain reasons, and there's just something about Cynthia that makes it hard for me to not like her. Her aura emits a kind of mix of coolness and passion, which is something that we've seen her live up to as well. Her love for Pokémon and fascination for the unknown and ancient history reminded me of myself, and even though we're quite the opposite personality wise I still admire her calm- and kindness, with her always managing to keep her soul and mind clear. Not to mention that she also has some really awesome Pokémon, including Garchomp. Being a fan of Dragon-types I naturally am a big fan of Garchomp too.

Alder's cool and all, and I really like him, but Cynthia will always take the price in my book.

How is this fair? Cynthia received much more pimping out than the other champions like May did for the pokegirls arguably iris now and paul did for rivals. It's enough that garchomp alone has the strength of a legendary but cynthia is also this helping would be kill stealing Mary sue.

Originally Posted by Acceleration

Originally Posted by DracoMan

Cynthia--she doesn't act like a total idiot outside of battle. Or in battle, for that matter.

Please explain how Alder was being an idiot in battle. He beat Trip quite quickly.

I'm talking about his "battle" against Ash. You know, the one where he fell asleep and got his own Bouffalant pissed off before just walking away and giving Ash the win.

Originally Posted by pokemonsquared

cynthia is also this helping would be kill stealing Mary sue.

Cynthia is not a "Mary-Sue".



If I had to pick the best I pick Cynthia, she acts like a Champion should in my book. Plus her team is much more impressive than Alder's in-game, her signature Pokemon, Garchomp is much more impressive than Bouffalant. I've found the effect she has on young trainers to be realistic and spiritual in a sense. She emits an aura of calm coolness that you really feel, she has an epic Pokemon release catchphrase, "Dance in Heaven, Gaburias!"(Garchomp, Battle Dance!) She's pretty-looking, knowledgeable, and clearly worked her way up to her Champion status given that she most likely raised a Gible into the Garchomp she has today, remember training Dragons is hard work and is hyped as pretty hard to do. She has a Glaceon :> She has an interesting outlook on life and is young and strong, she's no damsel in distress and the first female Champion.

Originally Posted by Gotpika

Cynthia is not a "Mary-Sue".

Prove it.

Originally Posted by Gotpika

Garchomp is much more impressive than Bouffalant.

Again, prove it. We've only seen Bouffalant battle twice, one of those battles shouldn't even count. So again how can you claim Garchomp is more impressive?

Originally Posted by DracoMan

I'm talking about his "battle" against Ash. You know, the one where he fell asleep and got his own Bouffalant pissed off before just walking away and giving Ash the win.

Fair enough, but it's not like he does that all the time.

Originally Posted by Acceleration

Prove it.

"Mary-Sue" is a term without meaning that has gained a negative connotation to mean "character who I don't like," it's a subjective term used in an objective way by most in an attempt to make a character out to be the worst piece of low life being in the world of fiction. Mary-Sue is a term without meaning and attempting to give it any meaning has caused it to pretty much become a lost cause. That's one of the reasons why "Sue test" are bullshit. Mary-Sue is only used by the majority of people whom are deliberately trying to be invective. Like I said "Sue-ness" is subjective and there are no definite steps it takes for a character to become a Sue. I don't think the purest sacred fires could purify the world of that damn term. Goes right next to "Glorify" in terms of words that have lost translations that are whored out and only surface as a way to talk ambiguously aggressive among a fandom about a character in anime, fanfiction, manga, etc. That's why "Sue qualities" are baseless and attempting to use "Mary-Sue" to shift the opinionated dislike of a character onto others in an objective way is just crap.

Cynthia isn't a Mary-Sue, she hasn't shown any super visual flaws, she has strong Pokemon, she's pretty, she raised a Dragon, claiming her to be a Sue however is simply a weak argument given most characters in various situations have those very same traits. Alder is comedic, very strong physically, wise, and has strong Pokemon. Invoking the typical "Sue" traits as means of throwing Cynthia throw the ringer is bullshit given these same qualities reside in many other character that's why "Mary-Sueism" being used as a way to justify a claim like Cynthia being inferior to Alder is again...crap. It also works with Lance as well, he trained a team of powerful Dragons, the hardest type to train supposedly, he's adored by many fangirls and is like an idol according to Marina, he's shown to some great physical abilities, and able catch a wild raging Gyarados that Ash and gang couldn't and defeat Team Rocket Agents.

Originally Posted by Gotpika

Garchomp is much more impressive than Bouffalant.

Could have sworn that was my opinion, not factually stating that Garchomp is better. But, yeah I find Garchomp to be stronger due to it being a Dragon, that species in-general being very powerful, Cynthia's the Sinnoh Champ, we've seen it waste the other Elite Four's Pokemon various times, we saw her skewer Paul's team and completely endure Weavile's Ice-type moves something that very strong Dragons can only do apparently, like Iris' Dragonite(Though it was being beaten by Dawn's Mamoswine's for some reason) or Drayden's Druddigon. She managed to beat Flint's Infernape by a hair apparently in the last DP episode. Garchomp also managed to give Caitlin and her Gothitelle a run for their money, again, Psychics like Dragons are a pretty strong type but then again it was only an exhibition match so neither may have been going all out. And of course when Cynthia's Garchomp was "taking it easy" on Axew that thing looked like he was about to die on the spot if that last Brick Break had connected. We've seen Bouffalant battle once against Trip's Serperior and it was a OHKO and we didn't even learn its other moves or see it battle again unless you count Pikachu VS. Bouffalant.

Originally Posted by Acceleration

Originally Posted by DracoMan

I'm talking about his "battle" against Ash. You know, the one where he fell asleep and got his own Bouffalant pissed off before just walking away and giving Ash the win.

Fair enough, but it's not like he does that all the time.

True, but doing so during his official intro to the show makes for a very bad first impression. And you know what they say about first impressions...