Thread: Is the show going overboard with the whole, "Type Advantages aren't everything" deal?

Personally I have no problem with it.

Neither do I, really. But then again, I don't want a Pawniard to beat a Mienfoo (just an example) just by using moves, that aren't that effective against Mienfoo, without having any strategy, 'cause that would be to go overboard and it'd only be very lousy writing.
If a Pokémon is in a disadvantage I want it to win by using strategies, smooth moves and not just to rush in action.

Originally Posted by Kojofuu

If a Pokémon is in a disadvantage I want it to win by using strategies, smooth moves and not just to rush in action.

I agree, that's part of what made the battles in AG and DP good, because even though the writers had Satoshi use pokémon that were at a type disadvantage sometimes, it wasn't to often, it it was almost always justified with a strategy and if there weren't any strategy, the pokémon at a disadvantage would most likely lose the battle. The problem is, BW really hasn't delivered in that departement. The battles lack strategy, finesse and feel very much like game battles in that it's just two trainers exchanging attacks without much of anything else, and therefore, they're not justifying the type disadvantage wins.

EDIT: The lone exception was Corn v Satoshi in the Sanyou Gym Battle. That battle was written perfectly.

They been doing it since season 1. I see no problem with it. I see it as part of the show with Pikachu defeating ground type/normal attacks hitting ghost Pokemon.

Need I remind you of "Yeah pikachu if you train your electricity you can somehow electricute onix" FTW

I touched on this in one of my blogs, but yeah, it definitely is IMO. I think they just like to throw the unfavourable type match-up in for drama when they can't think of anything else to spice things up and make us go "how will Ash get out of this one?" but they're more often than not too lazy to actually come up with something really clever to surprise us with, opting instead to just let us watch Ash level up for a while before going back and kicking the opponent's ass (lame).

Originally Posted by Guardian of Johto

Need I remind you of "Yeah pikachu if you train your electricity you can somehow electricute onix" FTW

Hey, you laugh at Onix electrocution but that actually made a little sense, considering that it didn't work until the sprinklers came on (and - as we know - impure water conducts electricity).

But it wouldn't run a current through onix...because of the boulders he is made of

I don't see any problem with it.

It can work in the games too...on occasion, so why can't it work here?

Originally Posted by Guardian of Johto

But it wouldn't run a current through onix...because of the boulders he is made of

Well, in all fairness we don't actually know the anatomy of an Onix - for all we know those "boulders" could actually just be really thick mineral coats for softer, organic body segments beneath (a bit like a Crinoid). If the water got into the joints & reached the organic parts then it could provide a pathway along with electricity could flow towards them, hurting Onix.

Still, Devil's Advocate aside, my point was that it was cleverer than having Ash just go through some training montage, which ultimately just preaches brawn > brain :/

It was better in the Pokémon Tech episode (Kanto), where they at least made the "level over type" thing seem strategic, with Weepinbel getting kocked out by Starmie, who was then subsequently knocked out by Graveler. The way they do it now though (with Ash reverting to "must train harder" as opposed to "must think up good strategy") doesn't really seem to encourage intelligent thinking, nor is it more interesting. Just lame lame lame.

Yeah, but I really hate the mini montages for training pikachu and then it can instantly do crazy shit

I'll take a small step beyond the thread subject here.

Swellow's "Thunder Armour" was one of the most bizarre things in the Anime.

Pikachu's incident where he used the force of the Hyper Beam to jump over the attack was another that baffled me.

But, in Anime as a whole, I think a lot of logic-defying things happen. The main character does something stupid or risky, and it pays off, and they succeed. Fairy Tail and Bleach are notorious for pulling such stunts.

Yes. They are.

I will agree it's done well if there is a strategy involved to overcome a pokemon's weakness, or have a move that counters the type you're weak to. Having a bad matchup win the day has been prevalent in the anime since the beginning, and by now I just live with it. No, it doesn't make sense if they make a poke that's weak against it's opponent win for no reason. I don't even believe it to be an entirely good message. Yes, it is good to not give up on the things you care about, but sometimes, you fail for a reason, and that is because you're doing it wrong. You can believe all you want, but it won't instantly make you succeed. You need a plan, a strategy, and then the motivation to do it. I also don't like when they overlook type alignments to do this. (moves working on things that they're not supposed to) It's not like they don't exist in anime canon, so I don't know why they do it other than for convenience. All in all, I can see what they're trying to do, but their execution is lacking.

I do think they're going a wee bit overboard with this currently, and it is especially jarring when we've just come off a series where he was actually more prone to using pokemon with a type advantage over the opponent, rather than ones without. At times, it feels as if Ash is deliberately putting himself at a disadvantage, which is frustrating as a viewer since I'm not sure whether to roll my eyes or commend him for giving himself a challenge.

Ordinarily this kind of thing has never bothered me too much. I have to echo the sentiments of others who have said that it's cool to see when Ash manages to overcome the disadvantage with a good strategy. But with that said, there haven't really been any particularly strategic fights thus far this series, so it just comes across as Ash being needlessly reckless.

I have no problem as long as it's entertaining.