DISCUSSION: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

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    Caught in a lab romance~ Araragi-hakase's Avatar Head Administrator
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    Default Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    Do you think Takeshi/Brock was a good traveling companion? Do you think he had a good send off and closure? Do you wish things had been handled differently with him?


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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I was actually very fond of Brock as a companion. I thought he was a great supporting character for Ash and I did find him funny at times, even when flirting...until mid Hoenn lol. I wish he didn't really fall to the background though and did more to help Ash and they put a much greater focus on his realization that he wants to be a Pokemon Doctor. I was sad to see him go for good in the end, though I do wish his and Ash's departure was a bit more emotional, like when he and Misty split up from Ash at the end of Johto.
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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    Brock made a very good companion and helpful for Ash throughout his journey. His "falling in love with every girl" theme in every episode I felt I was overdone after awhile, even though he had variations in the later sagas. I feel he was best handled in the Original Series, compared to AG and DP. He did less in AG compared to the OS, since May had a more key role in that series, but he was very helpful as a mentor for everyone. His sendoff in AG, I felt they did a whole lot better than his final episode in the DP main series. By cooking and taking care of everyone's Pokemon, he taught them a lot throughout the journey and was a great role model and companion in that regard.

    In DP I felt he was in the background too much, compared to Dawn and Ash. At the end he wanted to suddenly become a doctor, but I think it would have a been a better sendoff if they had more episodes and subtle hints that he was thinking about changing his career path.


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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    For me, a large problem with Brock's character was that it lacked direction. He had a goal, but was given nothing to do that showed us how far along he was towards achieving that goal, or where he stood amongst other Breeders, and I think that was a major contributing factor towards him growing stale by the end of DP. His role was reduced to being the team caretaker and I wonder whether or not that had any purpose. I do wish they changed his goal earlier, to at least give his character fresh impetus. In fact, I think they should have made him aim to be a doctor from the very beginning. Maybe they could have had him study while he was being a gym leader, but needed some field experience which he couldn't get due to having to take care of his siblings. That way, you would have been able to see him actually working towards something.

    His personality was fine. He added maturity and a bit of wisdom to an otherwise young cast of characters, which gave the group some balance. What I would have liked to have seen was him being more proactive in offering advice and passing on his experience to the younger characters, as that would have given his character a bit more definition beyond "that guy who really likes women".

    In the end, I can understand why he was shelved. There's little doubt he had become stale and simply wasn't offering anything interesting to the show anymore, and it was probably easier for the writers to start from scratch with Cilan than try to revitalise Brock's character. I thought his closure was largely positive, but I think it would've been better had we seen Ash show that he had the requisite maturity and willingness to take responsibility for his and others' well-being, as a sort of tangible legacy of Brock's influence on him as his close friend and frequent companion.

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    Bonded Forever Misty Calls Masquerain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I thought Brock was a good traveling companion.

    I thought his Johto and Kanto sendoffs were great, his AG sendoff was also good, his DP one was rushed.

    I do wish things were handled a bit better. I liked DP Brock, unlike most, which is why I hated him just being in the background. He's an old character, they should have treated him with respect. He had his focus episodes and involvement in the Team Galactic plot, which was good, but it wasn't enough.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I love Brock a lot! He's funny, smart, caring; basically like an older brother to Ash and friends. I really enjoy his gag too; half of it is the funny quips from Misty and Max. It was always a great opportunity to get good dialogue in. Falf the reason his gag got old is simply because there was half the interaction; Croagunk's punches simply don't compare to someone dragging him off, and the dub voice/dialogue did him no justice in DP. That and Happiny's DEM strength got old fast. Besides that, Brock has everything needed in a great character. So what if breeding wasn't expanded upon? He loves and cares for Pokemon just the same. And if being a doctor is a more manageable goal for him, then I say all the more reason for him to come back and be the gang's medic. This guy is singlehandedly the most valuable traveling companion on the show, and I'll never consider him "done".
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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I liked Brock. He was a likable character who could pull off being the more mature member of the group when the situation called for it and being a goofball in his love daze gag. I thought it was overdone, but fine in the original series. Although I think that I liked it more when the roles were reversed and he'd pull Misty's ear instead. It started to get really old in AG, but I think that was mostly because of Max. I actually liked Max for the most part, but the way he was pulling on Brock's ears like they were rubber just came off as more creepy and annoying than anything else. DP made the gag funny again with Croagunk.

    While I'm probably one of the few people who didn't mind how long he stayed in the cast, I can see why people would have that problem since they didn't really handle Brock's goal that well. They could work with him well as the mentor figure of the group and as a comedy relief character, but not so much as an individual character. They couldn't really show much progress for his goal as a Breeder and they never quite explained how he could do it besides taking care of and raising Pokemon, which isn't really much. I thought that he got more focused AG and DP than he did in the original series, which is one reason why I didn't mind that he stayed for as long as he did. He could have gotten more, especially when DP was primarily focused on Ash and Dawn, but he still got a pretty decent amount of attention.

    Brock becoming a Pokemon Doctor made sense given that he had spent the last couple of series healing Pokemon frequently, so it worked. The departure itself was a bit rushed, but there was still emotion in there and they did spend that episode emphasizing how sad it was that the trio would split up. For a character who had been in the cast for so long and wouldn't be coming back after one arc like with the Orange Islands, he could have received a bit of a better sendoff, but I was okay with it.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I think he was a good companion up until, DP where dawn and ash tended to be in front more and he just was a moving wallpaper. I do wish he had a better send off, but compared to cilan's and iris' which were abysamal, his was kinda meh.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    Quote Originally Posted by PockyAddict
    I think he was a good companion up until, DP where dawn and ash tended to be in front more and he just was a moving wallpaper. I do wish he had a better send off, but compared to cilan's and iris' which were abysamal, his was kinda meh.
    I never got the idea that this just started happening in Diamond & Pearl. What was Brock doing in AG (or, for that matter, Johto-era OS) that made him any more active there? If anything, I prefer DP!Brock to AG!Brock or Johto-era!Brock. He had a slightly bigger role thanks to the return of a three-man group and the Lake Trio story arc, and Croagunk managed to actually make that stale “girl-crazy” trait of Brock’s amusing again.

    As a companion, Brock had a clear role in the group. He was the one to provide for his teammates, take care of sick Pokemon, and give advice. His goal as a Breeder - which I honestly don’t think was ever meant to be elaborated on to a significant degree - and his history in providing for his family made sense that he would be able to do these things. And his friendship with Ash was obvious enough that you never really questioned why Brock would always seek him out to travel with him. As a character, he was never going to be my favorite but he was likable enough. I don’t think I’d ever say I enjoyed Brock, but he had his moments.

    The big issue with him is that he really wore out his welcome after awhile, and I honestly don’t see why he needed to come back after Johto. He made sense in OS, back when Ash was still a rookie and learning the ropes. Brock could be the one to give the helpful advice and explain the basic mechanics of Pokemon training to him (and the viewer, by proxy). But when OS ended, Ash had developed enough to a point where he could be the one to explain those things to another generation of viewers. Brock’s main purpose on the show was done, IMHO, and he should have been written out along with Misty.

    As far as Brock’s departure goes, I’d like to say I remember more about it, but I don’t. The fact that there was some buildup to it throughout the DP series and an entire episode dedicated to Brock finding his new passion were both plusses, and instantly make it better than how Misty, Iris, and Cilan were written out, but I’m not going to say it was great. But honestly Pokemon has never had the greatest track record when it comes to writing satisfying exits for its major characters (I think Paul, and maybe Dawn, were the only exceptions to that).
    PockyAddict likes this.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I definitely enjoyed Brock as a companion. He was very entertaining with his humorous lines and gags. I also feel that he really helped his friends a lot during his time on the cast. He gave all of them knowledge on how to heal Pokémon, Ash made smarter decisions from time to time, and Max learned how to care for Pokémon. I also like that he eventually decided to become a Pokémon doctor after so many episodes of helping sick Pokémon.

    However as the series went on, I feel that he slowly started to become less active. Now I love the DP series, but one of the few things I didn't like was how Brock got so much less major screentime than Ash and Dawn. He was kinda just there in the background just commenting on battles and giving out advice from time to time. I really just wish he would have done more, or better yet, have him replaced after AG. I also thought that Brock's woman chasing gag got really old around this time as well. (I mean, it got old in OS, but it REALLY got annoying in AG).

    So overall, I really like Brock. He's definitely MUCH higher than Cilan on my list of Ash's male companions. (Not higher than Clemont though :)

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    He was great at first, I loved his character actually. He stayed on the show for too long though and that hurt him.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I think Brock was a good character. Early on, he was Ash's main mentor in terms of how to care for Pokemon and effective ways to battle and is a major contributor to Ash's skills today. Noteworthy fact: Ash oddly started to suck when Brock left. Just saying. And I, for one, enjoyed his lengthy time on the show, since I feel that Ash needs a long-term friend. Unless there's some person hiding in Ash's past like Serena, I can't see how he couldn't call Brock his best friend.

    Brock was a humorous character. He was funny with his attraction to all of the older girls, and I didn't find that it ever really got annoying, but as the show's humor changed, so did this trait in Brock, which is why it seemed to get less funny as time went on. It's probably also why people felt as though Brock faded into background character status as the show went on. Comedy no longer seemed to be a major aspect, and Brock's character suffered because of it. Anyway, I also liked that Brock had a backbone. Cilan just seemed to be so overwhelmingly polite at times; even amongst Iris' and Ash's worst arguments, he generally just tried to diffuse any situation as calmly as possible. And I hardly remember him ever truly calling Iris out on her assholery. Brock was much more confrontational when the time called for it and knew how to call out the others in the group when he needed to. Plus, slightly off topic:



    While his goal wasn't really too expanded upon as the show went on, it was handled well in my opinion. Brock had plenty of moments showing his skills in Pokemon care and treatment and how he'd improved as the show went on. Though the Anime's definition and portrayal of a Breeder isn't quite as clear as in the games', his goal to become a Pokemon Doctor at the end of DP made a lot of sense, since he'd basically been a doctor the entire time, seemingly treating injured Pokemon more than anything else.

    I also liked when Brock got to participate in tournaments and such, since he had a really cool way of battling with his, not-so-average-everyday team. If I could have changed anything, I'd have given him more battles. Important battles, at that. It seemed like such a waste the the coordinators got more battles than the Gym Leader.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    Personally i enjoyed Brock. He may have not been utilized and developed as much as he could've been, but looking back there was much more to like than dislike for me about Brock presence, role and impact he left on pokemon series liking his character a lot.

    Brock was epitome of what means to be humorous and wacky liking his wisdom, crack up jokes and obsession over girls trying to impress them in on way or another. Such as dr. Anna, Suzie, Yuma, Lucy, Holy and many, many others with some of them writers taking steps forward building more on Brock need to find true love and nurture role he never really experienced himself. Such as Temaku from Johto, which wanted to marry him or Frontier Brain lucy who had crush falling for his charm.

    I liked Brock caring side showing lot of concern for his friends, how to prevent them from rushing into danger being "voice of reason" or defend them when needed giving moral support and various advices. Whether it was Ash, May, Misty or Max. Perhaps his kind heart and knowledge came to expression most when putting lot of thought and care in taking care of pokemon showing how beneath surface of full of hormon young teen there is person which just search for comfort and care he never experienced from parents leaving him with siblings alone in young age having to grow up fast and wants to dedicate his life in exploiting pokemon qualities in different way by bringing their true inner strength on surface, rather than using them in battles like everyone else does.

    With this conception in mind i feel his best moments came when being involved in fields where he could put his wisdom and acquisition to full potential, whether its taking care of sick pokemon like Stantler with hard time chasing him away after being healed realizing how he belongs with rest of herd, poisoned Sharpedo with which he spent whole night, injured Bagon, Nuzleaf. Tentacruel, Dawn Pachirisu and many, many others.

    Preparing strategies for Ash how to beat gym leaders being backbone on which he could always rely giving him valuable lessons, rescuing group from quite a few dangerous situations when dealing with villains and wrathful pokemon along with teaching them important things when it comes to pokemon feelings, how to approach enraged pokemon which brings chaos and provide moral support/motivation etc. Brock took care of cast supervising them as older brother,cooking, navigating way preventing them to get lost, gave logistic support and all this small but important things keeping group and everything on hold. Something which is sadly often overlooked when bringing his role in discussion.

    Along with often injecting lighthearted humor, and fun interactions in main cast having many memorable moments when either he developed or influenced someone else story.

    I enjoyed in his collection of pokemon a lot too and when i look back at Steelix, Croagunk, Marshtamp, Crobat, Foretress, Ludicolo etc it amazes me how much potential and strength such team posess reflecting perfectly how talented and devoted Brock was to his calling of being breeder before.

    That said while he didn't changed much as person i still find he moved somewhere with his story compared to Cilan or Tracey which never came to that bridge unfortunately. Compared to early Kanto days Brock change maybe wasn't noticeable and big like it was case with some other candidates, but changes in behavior and way he approached toward things in general started to become visible paying of favorably for him.

    Over time Brock became more open and considerate as person toward his friends and outlook on life. In becoming more empathic accompanied with lot of care and concern for his friends holding them precious, which can be noticed in barely suppressing emotions when saying goodbye to Misty and Ash at end of Johto, when encouraging May and Ash in their quests to succeed, even at times Dawn believing how she can recover from loses and be better. He became more compassionate and full of understanding toward his dissipated and disfunctional family. Coming best to expression in his interactions with younger brother Forrest encouraging him to be good gym leader expressing joy and satisfaction when seeing how he grew in good battler(especially after passing test) knowing that he left his former position in good hands. All of this was notable change compared to stoic, at times almost rigid nature he showed in early days of his journey.

    And subtle, gradual foreshadowing toward doctor career with Brock character slowly showing more and more interest for pokemon healing and role nurse Joy performs starting in Hoenn when attending several incidents which required knowledge of pokemon anatomy, type of poisons etc. Going through selfdoubts and soul searching during Sinnoh leaning more and more toward new calling realizing how as doctor he will be able to help pokemon in need of assistace much more that way was something which writers did good enough imo.

    At end of day i liked Brock and appreciated time he had on cast with pleasure and smile remembering many of great moments he brought to anime. He played valuable role being guardian but above everything loyal and sincere companion and friend to Ash and others , helped in providing lot of useful information and cleverly designed plans on how to catch pokemon, maximize pokemon strength, deal withn pokemon poachers or villains in preparing ambush along with many other tiny things which we often take for granted. Aside from that he guided Ash helping him to grow into better trainer,giving many useful tips and coming up with strategies in several battles providing lot of wisdom and knowledge to group along with making us learn more about himself, his past and family, evolved as breeder applying his knowledge on several pokemon, raised impressive collection of pokemon and brought lot of humor and good dynamic in cast.

    He may have not been excessive "right in your face" type of character taking lead role in plots and entering tournaments on daily basis, but he did things, helped move show and characters forward being important backbone on which others could rely keeping things on hold and preventing from everything falling apart giving shoulder to cry, confine yourself and help to get back on feet again. Which was indeed important task in my opinion.

    I would definitely like to see him again, showcase how far he went in his new calling, embellish anime and interactions with poised, flirty and wise,which sometime oh the irony transforms in irrational, full of insecurity character having certain depth and dimension in himself which makes him all that more enjoyable. Because i do miss Brock being overall great character who brought lot of importance, value and positivity to pokemon anime. Character who was unique and substantial simply not being given enough respect and focus as deserved.

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    Call me Robert guys 1rkhachatryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    I loved Brock, he was my favorite of the companions so far and I loved the bond that he and Ash shared.

    The problem with Brock is that the writers refused to try AT ALL with him. This is why people got tired of him. The writers just gave up, pure and simple. It wouldn't have been hard at all to write him some decent story lines and episodes throughout the saga's but the writers just refused to care.

    If they did two things with Brock, he would of been a much more interesting character(to everybody I mean):

    1. Give him some damn screen time and episodes, it's not that hard to replace some of the hundreds of filler episodes throughout his stay in the anime with some plots for him.

    2. Cut down on his gags. We get it he loves girls, we don't need to see it every dang episode.

    If these two things where done, people would of seen Brock in a much better light.

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    Default Re: Brock/Takeshi as a companion

    To 1rkhachatryan : I wouldn't say that writers gave up on Brock at least not in OS and Hoenn generation. He was always treated like supporting character older care taker who looks after Ash and others while filing them with valuable knowledge and wisdom he posessed as most mature and knowledgeable member of cast.

    In OS he played important role in preparing Ash for pokemon league, gym leaders and how to master basics such as fundamentals of type advantage, what kind of strategy he should use with certain pokemon and way he shiould approach in training pokemon. He provided along with Misty moral support being like his guardian which make sure that Ash doesnt run mindlessly in trouble or battle he cant win(althoiugh with shaky results given Ash stubborn nature back than)while taking care of pokemon, cooking, being navigator and had msany memorable moments. Dealing with his desire to find soul mate which could understand him mand support through life, often probiding solutions to problems such as plan how to stop TR ARbok tank from rampaging around, helping Ash Totodile in courting Azumarill and how to win her heart, served as intermediator in Ash capturing pokemon like Chgarmander etc.and had several memkorable moments where he polayed important role.

    While learning new things as breeder and demoinstrating his iwn knowledge when exchanging experiences with AJ, Suzie with who he builded strong, mutually admiring friendship, girls like Florina which had confidence issues teaching her how to be more confident, showing to be very smart and resouzrceful when offering help how to fix destroyed equipment and install program which locates lost objects by using Golbat sonar in episode where it evolved etc. Along with impeccable and spontaneous dynamic he shared with Misty and Ash made of arguing and embarassment engaging in clash over his flirty nature and irrational behabior when girls or particular pokemon are in question, laughs and joking when talking about dreams and various interests like romance, cooking, personal fears looking in consolidation in his friends. Along with care, mutual understanding and inspiration often serving as intermediator in settling down conflict between other two, kept them from rushing recklessly in problems and defended them when their trainer abilities or worth was questioned by others.

    Same applies to Brock in AG saga finding myself to enjoy alot in his performance there. Brock was less of a coach and mentor to Ash who matured enough to be more selfreliant, although he still helped him to train pokemon, gave him tips and advices how to improve his strategy when battling gym leaders or Frontier brains .Like in preparing strategy for Ash when he lost to Brawly, against Winona, in suggesting him which attacks to use against Flannery or warning him about strategy and special abilities certain pokemon use of who Ash wasn't aware of (such as hidden power, overgrowth etc).

    But instead of diminishing, Brock role was still noticeable in that saga feeling like in return writers put more emphasis on development of Brock and his pokemon in their own light, and expanding more on all that more wished for background and from here he originated as noticed in more focus being dedicated to his unconventional family, cognition how and in what way Brock received his first pokemon(revealing to be Onix as present), while having endearing bonding with brother Forest.

    I also enjoyed how he helped May and Max about learning things , various strategies and attacks from pokemon they weren't aware of explaining why Max viewed him as some sort of older "role model".

    If anything addition of Max helped his character by having someone to who he could relate to and his breeding career got some notable focus too often helping to resolve alarming situations regarding wild or endured pokemon, took care of suck characters like nurse Joy etc.
    Likewise he was more active than i can say for Johto at least in battle abilities and moments whgere he could demonstrate all that knowledge and experience as firmer Pewter gym leader too having some notable moments like battling May in contest, battling TR with Ash in tag match to save Pewter gym, learn about new ways to prepare food and keep pokemon in top shape(like pokeblocks etc).

    Making me impressed with nurturing care and understanding expressed when feeding and comforting Bonsly, saving Mudkip and earning its thrust to join him, or played role in resolving Lotad, Lombre love issues feeling like he is getting somewhere collecting new knowledge and methods about breeding and taking care of your pokemon. We can see that in learning to prepared new sort of food pokeblocks, in showing great deal of knowledge when treating sick or poisoned pokemon like Sharpedo, Nuzleef, Bagon, in understanding relationship between pokemon in love like Donphan or Flaffy and Ampharos, crisis about lack of water and how to approach wild pokemon like Solrock ending recognized as respectable and knowledgeable breeder by several renowned members of this branch.

    Such as Yuma, Jaco, Isis, Zane etc.
    While still being caretaker, navigator and most mature person in cast bringing order and settling down conflict between characters.

    I guess reason why Brock role for what it used to be didn't bothered me as much was because i viewed him as parental figure of group, he was never expected to receive huge fleshed out story arcs like Dawn, Ash etc has. Even in OS when Misty was around she always got more focus and development overall than Brock did. And i believe reason why Brock rarely battled or participated in some sort of action can be applied on great amount to passive dream writer established around Brock character. Since with breeding as whole there's little you can do with it, when it doesn't involve battling and entering competitions.
    Where writers have easier time in creating something for character, having several ways to make him more proactive(like inclusion of rivals,competitions,training episodes etc).
    Hence why its much easier to write for coordinators and trainers.

    Regardless of this handicap his development and focus came from individual episodes receiving changes in pokemon team and his skills gradually . Along with taking care of cast and cooking, navigating their way to towns and next gyms or area where contests are going to be held, giving logistic support and advices to Ash and May bringing everything on hold as most mature person in cast.

    His real shaft happened in Sinnoh, and even than i wouldn't necessarily say how he was worthless . Simply neglected and oushed aside preventing him from being more involved in action, utilize his own knowledge and skills in various situations and get more spotlight where he could truly shine(fact that Brock himself commented in one of DP movies how he feels left behind only adds to that bordering with breaking fourth wall, which while for comedy purposes still ironically contained truth). Though if there was one thing which in my opinion Sinnoh did right to Brock character was in serving as stepping stone to his eventual character developmernt . In vein of fleshing out Brock's character more in aspect of his own breeder and caretaking skills being given pokemon egg to display his true knowledge raising it to healthy and powerful Chansey along with starting to show interest for doctor calling more excessively. Which eventually led to self doubt and insecurity of what he truly wants to do realizing gradually how as doctor he will be able to be of bigger help for pokemon .

    Though it was obvious that big shaft was unfortunately present showing signs of detriment to character there, due to stagnation and limited screen time to display his qualities as he normally would.


    I believe because of security and care taking role ,he managed to add certain stability to main cast and leave long lasting impact on viewers which worked fine until writers exaggerated with it. Only and main problem was how in long run writers kept him too much in solidified role of older caretaker and cook of group which often overshadowed his other qualities, making people forget how he had more beneath that surface of his.

    I wished writers did more with his breeeding career, gave more attention to his pokemon and received more character development than he in reality had. Because there definitely existed way to expand on his story and make him more active.

    But still looking back Brock is great character in general imo and will always be considered important to me for anime series because he was there when everything started making along with Ash and Misty pokemon become popular and recognizable on global scale , paving way for future generations to come. He and original trio build around themselves certain iconic status which is something that lasts forever and his inexhaustible source of wisdom, intelligence and unselfich care helped alot for pokemon future, its characters and story.
    Last edited by pokemon fan 132; 1st February 2014 at 06:46 AM.

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