DP Tag Battle
Last edited by The Puppetmaster; 11th August 2011 at 02:33 PM.
It's not even a contest by any means.
Tag Battle RAPESTOMPS
While I like the premise of the Don Battle more (even though it ended up failing miserably), the DP better is so, so much better in terms of execution, development, and entertainment value. The episodes were really heart-wrenching and delved into the Satoshi/Shinji rivalry so well AND introduced awesome characters like Kouhei and Hikozaru to Satoshi's team. Tag Battle is still one of my favorite arcs from DP because of how excellent and seamless it was.
I prefer the DP Tag Battle for sure, because it developed the rivalry between Ash and Paul much more than Ash and Trip during the Don Battle. Plus, the battles were more entertaining IMO in the Tag Battle.
I actually like them both equally.
I'm a sucker for double battles, so the Tag Battle arc had that going for it. It also had some great battles, and the Chimchar subplot was a nice touch. But it really lacked enough character interactions (heck, DP lacked enough character interactions for me), and the whole thing seemed kind of forced. And by then I thought Paul was stale, so it was kind of annoying he was there. It was also very predictable.
The Don Battle had two many battles and plot in a short amount of time. If they spread it out more and gave everybody enough time to battle, it would have been perfect. Most of the battles were pathetic, aside from Luke vs Cilan and Ash vs Burgundy. The tournament at least had the courtesy to put importance on character interactions. Bianca did get pretty stale by the second episode, and Keniyan's name gag was old by then, but otherwise we got a better characterization for all the characters. It was really, really refreshing to see them again.
I'm going with the Tag Battle because I like monkeys. :3c
The Tag Battle was so ridiculously better that I'm honestly baffled how the Don Battle could be so bad. Normally with this series, things get BETTER over time as the writers gain experience and learn what does and doesn't work. For some reason, BW just totally screwed with that line of progression and the Don Battle highlights that.
The Tag Battle took the Ash/Paul level to a whole new level by having them being forced to work together, which culminated in Ash getting Chimchar from Paul (a subplot that was so subtly executed that it was a legitimate surprise for people when we first heard about it) as well as showing some backstory with Paul and why he was bothering with a Chimchar he obviously despised and didn't work well with. It also resulted in an evolution for Paul, which turned the tables of the evenly-matched final round of the Tag Battle.
The Don Battle did absolutely nothing to further Ash and Trip's rivalry, and no one got an evolution out of the ordeal at all. Not to mention Trip was knocked out relatively early, not even by Ash, and didn't stick around afterward.
The Tag Battle gave us Conway, a future League rival and overall (imo) the best anime-original minor recurring character of the entire show. He bounced off Dawn wonderfully, they had wonderful synergy as partners, and was amazing in his own right as a character and his battling style. It also featured Holly, who sadly didn't apear beyond this arc, but she was definitely a step up from what the anime usually gives us with minor characters. Plus, her interactions with Brock helped make his part in the saga entertaining. The quirks were well done, nothing dragged, and no routine got old.
The Don Battle gave more screentime to pre-existing rivals, both higher and lower-scale. The one who benefited most was obviously Langley, who desperately needed a real personality since her debut was pretty awful. There was also more Burgundy and Bianca, though sadly the latter case suffered from the writers running her joke with Zorua straight into the ground and shoved further and further down until they nearly hit the planet's core. The writers really should've known better, too. Aaaand, your mileage may vary with Luke and Kenyan, but I'd safely say the Tag Battle arc was better with utilizing their cast.
The premise of the Tag Battle was also way more interesting than the Don Battle, which was just a series of 1-on-1 battles. How uncreative is that? The Tag Battle had a great premise of breaking up our trio and forcing them with people they either didn't know or had great conflict with. The closest thing to that for the Don Battle were the random match-ups, most of which didn't go much further than providing the occasional good battle. Otherwise, they totally passed up an opportunity to further any of the characters' main rivalries.
And of course, the Tag Battle arc wasn't plagued with plot magic. Every win was earned honestly and believably and the final battle wasn't some one-sided foregone conclusion. Dawn not being an experienced battler and Conway having trouble with working beyond his planned routines was balanced with Ash and Paul being the worst, most argumentative pair ever... and combined with Paul being totally apathetic about the whole thing, it really did seem quite evenly-matched. They even had a round that was won mostly though Ash's efforts, a round won mostly through Paul's efforts, and the final round won with combined efforts (without actually working together). Had Elekid not evolved into Electabuzz during the battle, Ash and Paul really could have lost.
And the Don Battle? Well, Iris has all of her problems with her Pokemon solved with plot magic that shows no real effort from her and always comes just at the right time for no real reason. Her Pokemon change their demeanors off-screen, new moves are predictably learned to win a battle that should've been lost anyway, and her final battle gives her every advantage imaginable. It also does absolutely no good for Iris to win the whole damn tournament, whereas something actually came of Ash and Paul's victory.
... Yeah, do I really need to keep gong on?
Moved this to Live Caster as a Contest thread.
Keep this rule in mind when posting please. Thank you!Originally Posted by Live Caster Contest Thread Rules
The tag battle, because of MAH FAV'RIT SUPAH NRRD,
Oh god, this question insults me XD (no offense to anyone, I'll explain below)
The tag battle was possibly the most pivotal point of the entire DP series. It developed so many characters. It gave chimchar a backstory, Paul some justification for his battling style (for many, it was infuriating how impatient and cruel he could be towards his pokemon and his perception of strength...something that is referenced and resolved in the future), it introduced CONWAY (and to a lesser extend, Holly), it gave Ash a chance to raise one of his most powerful pokemon and basically GIVE him the victory at the sinnoh league. HECK, it even reminded us that Brock was a competent battler :/
In terms of the battles, I found both arcs to be pretty entertaining. I don't really care much for them, but I think that the tag battle used a bit more strategy...and although the ending was predictable, it was soooo much better executed than...this...
Character interactions in the Hearthome tag battle tournie was mainly focused on Ash and Paul...but it was done with PURPOSE. It sparked their rivalry even more and showed the stark contrasts in their ideology. And Conway was excellent with Dawn; it was about time someone started creeping on her canonically XD Holly's interactions with Brock was also enjoyable because a girl creepin' on Brock is quite rare.
While the Don tournament had a lot of fun, lively recurring characters and there were more interactions...they weren't particularly as meaningful or memorable as the tag battle, imo. I mean, I was about to jump off a bridge if I had to see Bianca pursue Zorua again or if someone mispronounced Kenyan's name for the 5th time...in one minute =_= Heeeeck, even Cilan's tasting time was a hindrance!! Yeah, it's funny the first time, but it seems like they ran out of decent scripting so they had to rely on overused gags. Something that a lot of my favorite shows succumb to.
The reason why I seem so butthurt about this is because the tag battle is the entire reason why I'm here right now, it got me back into the anime. And when I heard that they were doing something in BW, I was so excited and I guess I set my expectations too high. Nothing I really wanted happened...time that could have been used for development was instead wasted on fluffy gags and non-compelling outcomes.
"seasons change, people change"
There were alot of issues with the Don Battle arc, and perhaps I hyped myself up a bit too much for it in the beginning. I had hope that after the well written Tag Battle arc back in Sinnoh, that there was going to be some significant development here. These kinds of tournaments are prime opportunities to capitalize on story-lines that need development. One of the issues with this tournament was the fact that alot of time was going to be wasted on overused gags, that turned otherwise appealing character(s), into annoying ones, namely Bianca.
Another issue here for me was how Trip and Ash were handled. Yes, I was glad to see Trip get beaten, but he and Ash's dynamics were just as boring as always, when time could have been spent to actually get their rivalry the fuck off the ground. Also, alot of battles in this tournament, felt empty...like the writers were trying to be different for the sake of being different. Unless you're actually planning to do something with it, don't do it at all IMO. In fact the even the final, premature, match-up had no build-up whatsoever.
I think we've discussed to death who was the biggest issue in this tournament, and that's because Iris really gained nothing from this overall. It just seemed like it was an apology letter from the writers by not having Iris do jack shit for the first 30 or so episodes of the series, and they didn't care how horribly they wrote it. Almost as if some sort of unecessary appeasement, when the character hadn't really developed enough to warrant such a spotlight.
Last edited by Masurao; 12th August 2011 at 08:48 AM.
Tag Battle, of course. I just rewatched it - and it completely dominated the Don battle in terms of pretty much everything. Battles, characters, interactions etc. etc. I also love how Paul mentions 'If I had that fire power, I'd be able to win the pokemon league for sure' which foreshadows to the Sinnoh league. (Even though Ash didn't win, lol). It really expands on chimchar, Ash and Paul's rivalry and of course brings in my favourite minor character, Conway into the show. It features Holly, who was also a great character and only one of few who actually liked Brock back.
It shows Ash training his pokemon, which is such a rare sight in Unova now. It shows backstory and great interactions without overusing un-funny gags to fill up half the episode. It just tops the Don battle in all ways imaginable.
The tag battle tournament was better on every level. I loved watching the character interaction, the battles, and the development in Satoshi and Shinji's rivalry. Plus, it gave us some awesome minor characters with Kouhei and Honoka.
Tag battle tournament, but also because the battles generally seemed better and more thought out. Of course there were some missed opportunities with it, but it did its job and set the pace for the rest of DP.
Also, it was the very first (and last) time Brock was ever in an official tournament in the show. Can you believe it took them over 10 years just to have Brock compete in a battle tournament? lol.