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  1. #46
    The Lark Ascending. Jimiinthesky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Weather is just turning into just the standard in pokemon battles. However i think that the very best teams are ones that arn't weather teams, and are engineered to work well in sun and rain, but also on their own. Including pokemon like Kingdra, volcorana, heatran, zapdos, vaporeon, on teams where you don't have to waste a valuable spot on a ninetales or politoed, and can simply feed of the weather on others.

    Sorry, i've got a bit off topic, my point is that the best stars in terms of pokemon, are ones that feed off incredibly well from weather boosts, such as the above mentioned.

  2. #47
    Banana eating Gengar GengarEatBanana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Weather is really running rampant this gen. I tried to create an Anti-Weather team, and whilst ok and decent enough, it really is too hard with all the counters.

    However, Blaziken = the Kentucky-Fighting-Chicken, has provided me with no problems so far. I've used a Speed Boost Sharpedo with Focus Sash, and it has always been a definate counter on the PO simulators. Defensively bulky Calm Mind Suicune and Choice Band Azumarill have been two other counters as well.
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  3. #48
    now's the time to shine coolking503's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    How can anything with a focus sash be called definate. Entry hazard or random attacks on the switch in screw you over.
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  4. #49
    EV-Wizard/PeculiarBattler League's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Blaziken can also pack Double Kick and Quick Attack, should anybody consider them worthwhile. Focus Sash definetly doesn't make any pokemon a counter, unless something like Magic Guard Alakazam dons it. (That is also an answer to the question in the post above.)
    Quote Originally Posted by coolking503 View Post
    I dont get the lack of mention of Voltos and virizion. Both wreck havoc, one versus rain the other versus Sandstorm.
    My list on page two generally excluded Thundurus. I'm not crazy about Virizion.
    Quote Originally Posted by coolking503 View Post
    ...

    Whimsicott is screwed over by magic bounce completely. Also, hitting it on the switch in and not letting set up is a good idea. It may wreck stall, but it stinks against offense. Not really a star.

    ...

    Zoroak, having used him, is over rated. Hes UU for a reason. That doesnt make him a star. Team preview screws him over, and once he takes damage you can tell what he is compared to the other last pokemon.

    Chandulure doesnt check excadrill. It is dominated by excadrill, who outspeeds and KOs without boost using Earthquake. If it uses a balloon, use Rock slide. The KO isnt garunteed but at +2 it is, which means its not a counter. Limited move pool, ghost typing, and bad defenses hold it down. I prefer Heatran.

    Haxorus has 3 moves it can use, and is easily stopped. Base 99 speed means its outsped by base 100s and above. Outrage is excadrill set up bait. Brick break is set up bait for ghosts (and egyptian bird thing), and EQ is stopped by Flyers and balloon pokemon. Without a choice item its outsped and KO'd. Its not good at all, and wont be since Dnite, Mence, Garchomp, and even sazandora are better. And dont say they will be banned. The only one even close is Chomp, thanks to Sand Veil.

    Darmanitan is kind of a star, since its CB Flare Blitz hits like a truck WITHOUT the sun. Its a scuicide bomber though, kinda like volt tackle pikachu but stronger.

    ...
    Eh, if Zoroark isn't a star in OU, it will at least always be used in OU. The ability is just too tricky and novel to not be used. And I guess Darmanitan is potent--I'm still hesitant to designate him a the star. Regarding Chandelure, reread my post--it doesn't say what you think it does. Whimsicott, despite generally having one or two absolute counters, is still a 5th Gen Star I'd say.

    Per the replies on page 2, I know the typing of Scrafty very well. My exact words were "has fantastic offensive and defensive typing for a dragon." Scrafty generally operates as one, has the two best Dragon moves (not just Dragon Dance, but also Dragon Tail), and is in the Dragon egg group.
    Last edited by League; 17th May 2011 at 03:21 AM.
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  5. #50
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Quote Originally Posted by League View Post
    Eh, if Zoroark isn't a star in OU, it will at least always be used in OU.
    What's your point? Electivire and Ninjask, despite their near-total worthlessness, were always "used" by inexperienced players in Generation IV OU.

    Quote Originally Posted by GengarEatBanana View Post
    Defensively bulky Calm Mind Suicune and Choice Band Azumarill have been two other counters as well.
    Technically, neither Suicune nor Azumarill could counter Speed Boost Blaziken because they could not safely switch into its Hi Jump Kick.

  6. #51
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    The only real SB Blaziken counter that I can think of is Gyarados. When Blaziken was popular in OU I just happened to be running a Gyarados that put a stop to it almost perfectly. Outside of that, though, the list of checks/counters must be pretty small.
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  7. #52
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Quote Originally Posted by Troggy View Post
    The only real SB Blaziken counter that I can think of is Gyarados. When Blaziken was popular in OU I just happened to be running a Gyarados that put a stop to it almost perfectly. Outside of that, though, the list of checks/counters must be pretty small.
    Slowbro also deserves a mention. +2 Shadow Claw doesn't OHKO IIRC.

  8. #53
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathcliff Huxtable View Post
    Slowbro also deserves a mention. +2 Shadow Claw doesn't OHKO IIRC.
    Oh yes, of course. Had that in my mind last night when I was pondering, but forgot about it. If you are facing one without the 3rd coverage move, you really can't go wrong with Gyarados or Slowbro.
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    Rocking the Lucario Thundagere's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Azumarrill works really well too, with STAB priority Aqua Jet, it can OHKO Blaziken. Still, Blaziken is definitely a star, dream world was very kind to it.

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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    I'm not denying Blaziken is dangerous, but it seems that players often go for a for Sword Dance all the time. They don't predict the switch and CB Azumarill just Aqua Jet's away. I kinda take back Suicune, even if it is Defensively bulky.

    Sorry, Sharpedo isn't a definate counter, but for me it seems to always work.
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    The Lark Ascending. Jimiinthesky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    But Blazekin is Uber, it won't ever be battling against any of these pokemon. In ubers it is destroyed by Lugia and especially Giratina who can absorb high-jump-kick. What is the use of discussing the merits of it in relation to OU when it is Uber, it's like discussing the impact Wobbuffet had on the gen III OU metagame.....

    Therefore i strongly think that Blazekin is not a star of the gen V metagame.

  12. #57
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    "The Gen V Metagame" = / = "Gen V OU"

    What about stars of Gen V UU? Stars of Gen V Ubers? Hell, stars of Gen V NU? They're all stars, just in different tiers. The fact that Blaziken was able to make into Ubers in the first place, I think, demonstrates his rocket into stardom during this gen.

    Moving on.

    I've got a couple I can think of. Krookodile comes to mind, first and foremost. With Moxie and a Choice Scarf, that thing is an absolutely BEASTLY revenge killer. It may be UU, but it's an adaptable pokemon that fits well onto many teams, even without the scarf. It's got pretty good dual STABs, too - it's sort of like a frailer Excadrill without the steel typing.

    And no mention of Hydreigon or Terrakion? For shame, people, for shame.

    ...Okay, because I love the thing to tiny little pieces, I've got to mention Sawsbuck. Again, it may be UU, but it's got a bunch of options. Leech Seed and Aromatherapy let it support the rest of the team, but in it's main role as an attacker, it's got most everything covered. STAB on Return is always nice, and Horn Leech can really wreck some things after a Swords Dance. It also gets Earthquake by virtue of Nature Power, which is always nice to have. Chlorophyll might be nice for sun teams, but Sap Sipper and Jump Kick make Ferrothorn setup fodder if they're not carrying Thunder Wave.
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    The Lark Ascending. Jimiinthesky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    The idea is to discuss true stars of the metagame, influential pokemon that changed the face of the metagame, such as tyranitar in GSC, Metagross in RSC, and scizor in DPP. Blazekin has not changed the metagame, it does not require teams to create specific counters for it nor is it a near staple on all uber teams. I'm not saying it's not a star because it's in ubers not OU, i'm saying it's not a star because in the tier it is in it is near useless, it's 'rocket to stardom' was a result of it being too good for OU, not because it was of ubers standard.

    IMO the main stars of this gen are Excadrill, Ferrothorn, Politoed and Ninetails. Each is a pokemon that teams have to create counters for, or have to be considered for their team. These pokemon are so influential to the gen V metagame that other pokemon are used or not used just on their ability to counter them.

  14. #59
    Clarion of Revelations Feliciano's Avatar Social Media Editor
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Perhaps you didn't get me. *puts on modhat to make it more obvious* This is not to become a discussion about Blaziken's rise to Ubers because a bunch of neckbeards at Smogon thought it was too broken to use in OU. Or did you forget what OU was like before Blaziken was moved up, when teams DID have to create a counter for it lest they get swept?
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  15. #60
    The Lark Ascending. Jimiinthesky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stars of Generation V

    Okay, i get your point, i just am certain Blazekin is by no means a star of the gen V metagame, and the 'neckbeards' an Smogon do happen to be the authority on pokemon battling, and it's tiers are, more often than not, transfered to the professional tournaments. IMO Blazekin has not influenced the metagame in the same was as the likes of Excadrill and Ferrothorn have.

    Anyway, sorry for dragging this conversation on too far, i just feel strongly about this.

    Moving on to a different pokemon, I agree with you about Terrakion, as a scarfed revenge killer it is epic, i run one and it gets 2kos on things like reunicules and conkeldur, even skarmory with stone edge. I would litterally eat my own hand for it to learn u-turn, but it is still a great addition to the metagame.

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