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  1. #271
    Outplay the Coinflip -Glory Blaze-'s Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Why don't we just model it after Smogon's CCAT? We have nominations for each Pokémon and the community votes on who they want to be added to the team (this, we choose our team style and whatever based on the first couple Pokémon to be chosen)

  2. #272

    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    So in your opinion, Starmie, or Excadrill?

    Imo I prefer Starmie for better speed, Excadrills pretty slow withought scarf or sand rush. Also Starmie has a much better movepool, and I feel it can also be offensive while rapid-spinning away.

    Also it can threaten most stuff that sets up rocks.
    Last edited by Psycho Pacifist; 7th August 2014 at 11:25 AM.

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    Is Not A Moderator TerraTF's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Forgotten View Post
    So in your opinion, Starmie, or Excadrill?

    Imo I prefer Starmie for better speed, Excadrills pretty slow withought scarf or sand rush. Also Starmie has a much better movepool, and I feel it can also be offensive while rapid-spinning away.

    Also it can threaten most stuff that sets up rocks.
    Excadrill. Not as slow as you'd think. Base 88 Speed is nothing to laugh at. Outspeeds and OHKOs every single Rotom form if the ability is Mold Breaker. Base 135 Attack is also great to hit with moves like Earthquake, Iron Head, and Rock Throw.

    Not to say that Starmie doesn't have its own positives such as a base 115 Speed or a base 100 SpA as well as access to Scald and Psyshock, its just not as good as it once was. Its only useful ability is Natural Cure, defenses are lacking at 60/85/85 which makes its Recover less useful. Starmie just hasn't been all too hot since Gen 4. If I were to use it I would use it in a Rain team.

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  4. #274

    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    I mean I'm not doubting Excadrill's power, Also, Rock throw?

    Analytic is viable. It's hard to switch in on an Analytic boosted attacks. Starmie it can do well against Keldeo, un-scarfed Gengar (Assuming I have hazards to break sash, and Gengar is the only OU spin-blocker left RIP Aegislash), Garchomp (Ice Beam as third move assuming), and Lando. It also hit's a lot of things like Azu and Gyarados with Thunderbolt. Psyshock can 2HKO Blissey with some previous damage.

    Withought sand Excadrill isn't as viable as Starmie on it's own imo.

  5. #275
    Is Not A Moderator TerraTF's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Forgotten View Post
    I mean I'm not doubting Excadrill's power, Also, Rock throw?

    Analytic is viable. It's hard to switch in on an Analytic boosted attacks. Starmie it can do well against Keldeo, un-scarfed Gengar (Assuming I have hazards to break sash, and Gengar is the only OU spin-blocker left RIP Aegislash), Garchomp (Ice Beam as third move assuming), and Lando. It also hit's a lot of things like Azu and Gyarados with Thunderbolt. Psyshock can 2HKO Blissey with some previous damage.

    Withought sand Excadrill isn't as viable as Starmie on it's own imo.
    Mean Rock Slide.

    Also with Analytic I'm not sure we're looking at the same attack. Analytic increases your attacking power if your opponent has already moved during that turn. Only thing that Starmie will be useful with Analytic against is priority.

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  6. #276

    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    The point is, it's hard to switch into with analytic. I understand what Analytic does.

    And those are examples of things it can hit hard. Withought Analytic.

  7. #277
    Outplay the Coinflip -Glory Blaze-'s Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Excadrill is better. Better bulk, better power, better typing, better abilities, better versatility (Sand Rush sweeper, Air Balloon, Assault Vest, Choice Scarf, etc). Starmie has gotten better since the Aegis ban but it's still mediocre.

  8. #278
    ♦ unisharks ♦ Exor's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TerraTF View Post
    Mean Rock Slide.

    Also with Analytic I'm not sure we're looking at the same attack. Analytic increases your attacking power if your opponent has already moved during that turn. Only thing that Starmie will be useful with Analytic against is priority.
    As Forgotten implied, Analytic also boosts power during switches. So no, it's not useless at all.

    I use Analytic on my Starmie, I don't know if Natural Cure is a better choice or not.

  9. #279
    Is Not A Moderator TerraTF's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Neosquid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TerraTF View Post
    Mean Rock Slide.

    Also with Analytic I'm not sure we're looking at the same attack. Analytic increases your attacking power if your opponent has already moved during that turn. Only thing that Starmie will be useful with Analytic against is priority.
    As Forgotten implied, Analytic also boosts power during switches. So no, it's not useless at all.

    I use Analytic on my Starmie, I don't know if Natural Cure is a better choice or not.
    Natural Cure is far better. Gets rid of statuses when you switch out. I'd rather have that over an ability where it only works if your opponent swaps out.

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  10. #280
    Outplay the Coinflip -Glory Blaze-'s Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Neosquid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TerraTF View Post
    Mean Rock Slide.

    Also with Analytic I'm not sure we're looking at the same attack. Analytic increases your attacking power if your opponent has already moved during that turn. Only thing that Starmie will be useful with Analytic against is priority.
    As Forgotten implied, Analytic also boosts power during switches. So no, it's not useless at all.

    I use Analytic on my Starmie, I don't know if Natural Cure is a better choice or not.
    Analytic is generally considered better

  11. #281
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TerraTF View Post
    Natural Cure is far better. Gets rid of statuses when you switch out. I'd rather have that over an ability where it only works if your opponent swaps out.
    Is it really, now? Getting rid of paralysis is useful, I give you that. And sleep, to a lesser extent, though that also opens up the possibility of another Pokemon being put to sleep upon Starmie being cured. Burn and poison aren't that big of a deal for it, it's a special attacking fast offensive Pokemon - getting burned or poisoned isn't the end of the world for it. Heck, it can even be beneficial, preventing it from being paralyzed or put to sleep.

    You can argue that Natural Cure is a better ability for it, but it's definitely not "far better".

    Quote Originally Posted by -Glory Blaze- View Post
    Analytic is generally considered better
    I see. That's kinda what I thought, the extra power can help it break down walls that switch in on it. Wheras Natural Cure mostly only deals with sleep and paralysis, as I mentioned. Which is still cool.

  12. #282

    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    @-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

    Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).

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  13. #283
    Is Not A Moderator TerraTF's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by DragonEspeon View Post
    @-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

    Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).
    I sort of went over their best suitabilities in my post. Overall Starmie is much better in Rain, behind maybe Tentacruel, but Excadrill is best in most situations due to his 3 great abilities.

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  14. #284
    Outplay the Coinflip -Glory Blaze-'s Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by DragonEspeon View Post
    @-Glory Blaze-; Why do you consider Excadrill to have the better typing? There is no objective "better typing" in this case. Their worth as a type should be judged based on their suitability to the respective teams they are used on.

    Starmie has its own versatility and value as a special spinner, with competition only from Mega Blastoise (but then you'd be giving up a Mega spot).
    Ground + Steel is a better STAB combo than Water + Psychic - Starmie has to rely on BoltBeam for additional coverage, and has to drop at least one of Hydro Pump/Psyshocl/Thunderbolt/Ice Beam for Rapid Spin (and another if it wants ChoiceTrick) while Exca has EdgeQuake with Rock Slide and STAB EQ, plus Iron Head for a strong neutral hit on stuff like Latios and Landorus. Plus his primary spam move is 100% accurate as opposed to 80%. And lastly he has more relevant resists like Fairy, Flying (that one's huge), Rock (also huge), Bug, etc plus immunities to Electric and Poison. His only common weaknesses are Fighting, Ground, and Fire but he can neutralize Ground with a Balloon and he wrecks most Fires with either EQ or Rock Slide and he can abuse that since he outspeeds even some Scarfers under Sand. Starmie on the other hand has few relevant resists (Fire, Ice, Fight) and tons of common weaknesses (Dark, Bug, Ghost, Electric, Grass) and lacks crucial resists to Sucker Punch, Extreme Speed, or Brave Bird so it can be prevented from Spinning by common priority users despite its higher speed.

  15. #285
    Is Not A Moderator TerraTF's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Chat Thread

    That time of the year again. Its been 3 months since the last move of Pokemon between tiers and we have had some more released today. I'll put the info from the Pastebin in a quote as well as the link to the Pastebin.

    From OU to BL:
    Scolipede (was previously banned in UU then rose because of usage)

    From OU to UU:
    Espeon
    Togekiss
    Diancie
    Quagsire
    Vaporeon
    Smeargle

    From UU to OU:
    Gothitelle (Shadow Tag is banned in UU, not Gothitelle)
    Heracross
    Magnezone (was technically BL)
    Mew
    Slowbro

    From UU to RU:
    Wobbuffet (Shadow Tag is banned in UU, and thus all lower tiers)

    From RU to NU:
    Kabutops

    From NU to RU:
    Omastar
    Spiritomb

    These changes should be added to Pokemon Showdown and our Pokedex on-site very shortly if they haven't already been added.
    Link

    Some nice move from OU to UU and from UU to OU. Scolipede's fall from OU has been a long time coming since the Baton Pass nerf. Now its sitting comfortably in BL. Some big defensive Pokemon fell as well including Espeon, Vaporeon, and Quagsire. Other falls include Togekiss, Diancie, and Smeargle. I would be surprised if Espeon and Vaporeon remained in UU for long. Both have incredible staying potential, can hit very hard, and have access to one of the best Boosting moves in the game.

    Now from UU to OU we have hard hitters in Magnezone and Heracross along with some defenses in Slowbro and Mew as well as a surprising support Pokemon. Gothitelle rises to OU. Likely won't stay long if a Shadow Tag ban is passed. Of the new additions I can see Mew and Magnezone fall. Mew is OU for one reason only. Its one of the best quick passers in the game with access to Swords Dance, Calm Mind, Iron Defense, Amnesia, Hone Claws, and more. Magnezone will likely fall after the next 3 months. I enjoy using Magnezone greatly but it a one trick pony that can't beat Steels named Bisharp and Heatran. Very good Pokemon to have to take down Scizor, M-Scizor, Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory but outside of that its nothing.

    So what does everyone think of the new drops and additions? Anyone with experience in the lower tiers can feel free to explain why the new UU, RU, and NU additions and losses will be either good or bad.

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