Thread: Mary/Gary Stus....

Often times when characters and Pokemon seem to be doing very well or never lose, people often accuse your characters of being Mary/Gary Stus which I find very annoying.

How do you deal with this and prevent your characters from being so.

I try not to overload them with special powers, and make them work to master what powers they have.

Past wise, I try to buck the tragic past by balancing the tragic with some laughter and "I love you"s (or not even bothering with the tragedy at all, if the story warrants it)

You find it annoying because it's done to annoy you. The label Mary Sue (or Gary Stu) is recognized in many online communities as no longer being valid, because many people abuse of it, so I'd recommend you to ignore it when it is thrown at any of your characters and their characterizations. Be sure of what you're writing, of your characters and their own personalities and abilities; only change them when you feel they should change, don't do it only to avoid the accusation of Mary Sue/Gary Stu.

However, if you are still worried about that label, try to make both their victories and failures believable and justifiable, same with their virtues and flaws. For example, winning a Pokemon battle because the weather suddenly changed to favor the protagonist or losing a Pokemon contest because the protagonist's girlfriend broke a nail are not justifiable or believable. Additionally, if you're going to give powers, an item or a Pokemon to your character, and all the reasons you can think of for giving that to them is "because they're the protagonist or related to the protagonist, and it's cool/awesome/impressive", then you're in the path to making a Mary Sue or Gary Stu.

If you follow those guidelines, and your characters are still being called Mary Sues or Gary Stus, then the reader in question might be trolling you. Try not to feel disheartened by their words, OK?

Just because your character wins a lot doesn't make him a Mary Sue/Gary Stu. If they've earned that win and they already have a lot of experience that justifies it then it shouldn't matter. If your character is inexperienced then as long as he has a good and logical way to win then it's also justifiable so long as it doesn't happen to often. For example in my fic Pokemon Academy: Dragon's Roar my characters usually win by relying on logical strategies that can be carried out and the main character himself loses most of his battle, though I've actually made fun of the whole good guys always win because they're good once or twice.

In Welcome to Our World my main character is a rookie that shows a lot of promise but that's because he's really calculative and can adapt to situations easily.

Even if your character is skilled you should still try to make sure he doesn't reach that level though, try to have them lose once or twice.

Although it hasn't really cropped up in the fic as yet, the main character of Champion Game has this problem. As the title suggests, he's the Champion, so I can't really have him lose any of his battles - discounting, perhaps, an actual League battle. That could easily go either way. The challenge, then, is making sure that he wins as realistically as possible every time. Maybe he'll come from behind - without making it seem like a deus ex machina, of course - or if not, he'll at least have to work for it. Making it believable is the writer's biggest weapon against Mary Sues.

Also, I'm going to have to agree to disagree with Kayi-chan here - the label 'Mary Sue' is still perfectly valid because, unfortunately, they are just as prevalent now as they have ever been, if not more so. Authors will continue to make these characters, and while actually throwing the term around like confetti does pervert the meaning a little bit, it is still a valid criticism of a character. Only when it's correctly backed up, though. Reviewers who just say 'Oh, xe's a Sue, get rid of xer' are the ones that are annoying. A Sue is a widely recognised archetype with surprisingly well-defined parameters, though - especially in Pokemon fanfiction - and if a character fits the bill, telling the author so is probably the best thing you can do, as long as you give sufficient justification. Pointing out ways to improve is good too. /tangent

Shouldn't this go into the Official Mary Sue Thread?

I personally think any accusation of a character being a Mary Sue should be ignored, since they are very subjective. Winning many battles doesn't make a character a Mary Sue; being the strongest trainer in the world doesn't make them a Mary Sue. The way I see it, if everyone and everything revolves around that character, then it is a Mary Sue. Example: All humans want to be the character's friend/lover, all Pokémon want to be trained by the character, and every city, village, and location in the word is named after that character.

Originally Posted by Kyuujux

Shouldn't this go into the Official Mary Sue Thread?

It should, but it's OK the original poster missed the thread, considering it's very old already.

Originally Posted by Kayi-chan

It should, but it's OK the original poster missed the thread, considering it's very old already.

Yeah I don't often look back like 5 pages, and I'm sure several others don't. Even if I do, I'd probably miss it anyway.

I know. It's annoying when a character in your story isn't a dainty damsel whiny kid, they are a mary sue. Like I use Gothitelle alot, and I give her these powers such as Hammer Arm and Close Combat and Night Daze (don't forget Psyco-cut). Not only that but she had a really amazing IQ, one par with Robotnik from Sonic the Hedgehog and she can Mcguyver herself out of any situation.

Now, I don't think this character is a Mary Sue, but because she doesn't get capture like 500 times, people are going to be bound to say that.