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Thread: World Championship Thread.

  1. #226

    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by smalllady View Post
    Sure, they're considered bulky, but they don't make good tanks at all. Mamoswine's base Attack stat is 130. It's no wonder Vaporeon can't stand up to even one of Mamoswine's attacks. You're going to need a damn good tank (high HP and Defense) in order to even survive it's first attack.
    I'm sorry, but that's wrong; Mamoswine's Attack is no more impressive than Vaporeon's HP, and high HP makes up for lacking Defense. But there is actually no need to quantify the situation in words when it is possible to calculate the likelihood of Mamoswine taking down Vaporeon with a single Earthquake attack. It can happen only when Mamoswine has a maximum Attack (which admittedly Pryce's Mamoswine probably has) and Vaporeon has near minimum HP and Defense. A well-trained Vaporeon would be left standing with nearly 50% of its health.

  2. #227
    真実の英雄 smalllady's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silktree View Post
    I'm sorry, but that's wrong; Mamoswine's Attack is no more impressive than Vaporeon's HP, and high HP makes up for lacking Defense.
    I don't see how a high HP stat makes up for a poor Defense stat, EV-trained or not. It's still not going to last very long against something with a high Attack stat.

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    In glorious technicolor The Outrage's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by smalllady View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Silktree View Post
    I'm sorry, but that's wrong; Mamoswine's Attack is no more impressive than Vaporeon's HP, and high HP makes up for lacking Defense.
    I don't see how a high HP stat makes up for a poor Defense stat, EV-trained or not. It's still not going to last very long against something with a high Attack stat.
    It matters quite a bit, especially when given equivalent base stats between HP and any other stat, the same base stat would yield higher actual stats in practice thanks to the equation. I don't know why you just don't use a calculator rather than making qualitative assessments.

    Adamant Mamoswine' (252 Atk EV's; 31 Atk IV's) Earthquake on a Lonely (-Def nature) Vaporeon (0 Def and HP EV's/IV's), also known as "the worst case scenario" will certainly OHKO Vaporeon (does 102.2% - 120.3% damage).

    However, let's assume this Vaporeon isn't incredibly bad and hold Mamoswine and Vaporeon's IV's constant, and give Vaporeon a bold nature 252 HP EV's, and Mamoswine just barely guarantees a 2HKO (53.2% - 62.9% damage). Now, given the 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe EV spread suggested by Smogon, and Mamoswine would be incapable of 2HKOing Vaporeon (38.2% - 44.9% damage). And this doesn't factor in leftovers.

    So a defensively oriented Vaporeon can and will be able to withstand a hit from Mamoswine. Now a Surf from the very same Vaporeon on a Mamoswine with no HP EV's will most certainly fall (93.1% - 109.7% damage), though I believe these battle facilities distribute EV's to the highest stats so assuming Max HP Mamoswine, we get 79.2% - 93.4% damage, which really poses a problem for the much slower Vaporeon, who will then receive 57% - 67.4% damage from Earthquake. But of course, given its defensive spread, this too is not a guaranteed 2HKO.

    Either way, while your assessment of "its not going to last long" may be true in Pryce's case if Mamoswine has not received any prior damage and Leichi berry activates, any unboosted Mamoswine would be incapable of breaking Vaporeon before Vaporeon breaks it even if Vaporeon were to switch in.
    Last edited by The Outrage; 19th July 2012 at 09:50 PM.

  4. #229
    真実の英雄 smalllady's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    I wasn't aware it mattered so much.

    This is why I've never EV-trained anything. All those numbers make me dizzy. I will never understand the fascination people have with it.
    Last edited by smalllady; 19th July 2012 at 10:13 PM.

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    Cranky Curmudgeon Signas's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by smalllady View Post
    I wasn't aware it mattered so much.

    This is why I've never EV-trained anything. All those numbers make me dizzy. I will never understand the fascination people have with it.
    People aren't fascinated with it, it's just a necessity to win in competitive battling.

    Still the Unova Champion in my book.

  6. #231

    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by smalllady View Post
    This is why I've never EV-trained anything. All those numbers make me dizzy. I will never understand the fascination people have with it.
    I've never EV-trained because the actual training process is quite tedious in my opinion. But it is important, even for the in-game battle facilities. I think you should remember just one thing: The damage is inversely proportional to the opposing Pokémon's Defense. That means that when the base Defense is low, IVs and EVs can make a huge difference because there is a greater increase to the stat percentage-wise in such a case. That's the explanation for the Vaporeon situation. On the other hand, when dealing with offensive stats the damage is directly proportional, and so the damage increase due to IVs/EVs doesn't depend on the base stat.
    Last edited by Silktree; 20th July 2012 at 02:21 AM.

  7. #232
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    While I can't be bothered to learn how to RNG or breed for IVs, I've EV-trained a few Pokemon now and again for the Battle Frontier and occasional Wi-Fi Battle. But to be honest, I don't see how I'm going to be able to make it through the WT without at least some effort going into natures and EVs. My in-game team won't stand a chance against some of those teams.

  8. #233

    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    I've been RNGing, EV training and IV breeding for a while now. It's not that bad if you have the right tools. The only problem is whether I should move all my stuff to Black 2 just for the World Tournament...
    Brett: No, no, I just want you to know... I just want you to know how sorry we are that things got so messed up with us and Mr. Wallace. We got into this thing with the best intentions and I never...
    Jules:*shoots random guy on couch*
    I'm sorry, did I break your concentration? I didn't mean to do that. Please, continue, you were saying something about best intentions... What's the matter?...Oh, you were finished! Well, allow me to retort. What does Marcellus Wallace look like?

  9. #234

    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Personally, I never RNG or IV breed. Far too much tedious work and time for those two. As far as IVs go, I may check with the guy that tells you which is the best and make sure that it's useful. The only things I actually care about when training aside from that IV checker guy are Pokemons' stats are Nature, Characteristics, and EVs.
    My Current Main Teams for Alpha Sapphire and Omega Ruby

  10. #235

    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Wait... they took away Steven Stone's SKARMORY?? WHY?! It was a steel type! And one of his best pokemon! I don't care about that stupid non-steel type fosssil bird (that isn't even very good anyway) because he already has Armaldo AND Cradily. Steven isn't Roxanne, he's Steven!

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    In glorious technicolor The Outrage's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Karpi View Post
    Wait... they took away Steven Stone's SKARMORY?? WHY?! It was a steel type! And one of his best pokemon! I don't care about that stupid non-steel type fosssil bird (that isn't even very good anyway) because he already has Armaldo AND Cradily. Steven isn't Roxanne, he's Steven!
    Why on earth do people keep thinking they took away Steven's Steel type for a non-Steel? Do people honestly forget his team composition is half Steel and half fossil(or rare rock relic in the case of Claydol)? Steven's Skarmory was replaced by Excadrill. On the other hand, Claydol was replaced by a more fitting fossil that just happens to also fly, Archeops. His current team did not change in composition of Steel and non-Steel rare rocks than his RSE team. It's honestly much better than making him look like a generic Steel specialist since his team's theme is actually unique beyond a single type. Even when you aren't looking at it thematically, two Pokemon got replaced, why is the blame being put on Archeops? Why aren't you complaining Excadrill replaced Skarmory? Because Skarmory and Archeops are both flying types? Well, we know Steven's specialty is Steel and rare rocks, so common sense dictates a flying type was not replaced by a flying type, but a Steel type replaced a Steel type. We also know his other half is composed of rare rocks, so obviously Archeops replaced the member of that part of his team that was removed. The flying type is simply incidental.

    It's kind of ridiculous to say "Steven isn't Roxanne, he's Steven!" when it makes absolutely no sense for Roxanne to have mostly fossils other than being rock types (she's the only rock specialist not stated to have some relation to mining). Steven is a rock collector. His team now is even more consistent to that. Skarmory was the only thing that didn't fit that, whereas Excadrill can help him excavate rocks, just like Aggron.
    Last edited by The Outrage; 22nd July 2012 at 12:06 PM.

  12. #237
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Yeah, champions aren't type-themed. The only one was Wallace, but only because he was promoved from being a Gym Leader.

    For example, Lance (in GS and remakes). His team was Dragon-themed, but not Dragon-type-themed, rather featuring Dragon-looking Pokémon, like Gyarados, Charizard and Aerodactyl. In fact, his whole team was Flying-type. if any.
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  13. #238
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Outrage View Post
    @FairyRed;

    Giovanni didn't die. People need to get over that and stop saying something that disconfirms their theory is noncanon because they want to cing to it.
    I think the only thing that will well and truly settle the matter is Giovanni's dialogue in the World Tournament, if indeed the Tournament has some relevance to game canon. And even if the tournament is completely storyline-irrelevant, I doubt Game Freak would violate canon so far as to put in a dead character.

    However, the real question will probably remain unanswered: What WAS that mysterious splash?

    --Does anybody know if the Tournament is canon/part of the storyline yet, or what Giovanni says, at this point? Can anyone fill me in? O_O;;--
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  14. #239
    In glorious technicolor The Outrage's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    You'd have to be in a ridiculous amount of denial to use "PWT isn't canon" to justify a fan theory as being real.

  15. #240
    Cranky Curmudgeon Signas's Avatar
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    Default Re: World Championship Thread.

    The Giovanni suicide theory needs to stop. For one thing, that sound you hear is radio static. Just listen to it instead of running to Tvtropes to scream about how he killed himself. Secondly, I highly doubt they'd put even implied suicide in a game originally aimed at children.

    Still the Unova Champion in my book.

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