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  1. #61
    Registered User metalKS's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Ok, after the struggle to get my dream Volcarona yesterday, I have shifted my eyes to Victini, the one in Liberty Garden. However, I have failed to get the desired IVs the RNG reporter has given me. So my question is, does Victini count as a Stationary Pokemon(therefore one would be able to apply the standard procdures one would to in game Stationary Pokemon like Cobalion/Volcarona..etc)?
    BTW I'm using non C-Gear method at the moment, don't even want to attempt C-Gear method...

    EDIT: So I tried to non C-Gear RNG a few more times now and there seems to be a 'trend'(inverted commas because I tried about 10 times, which isn't really enough to state any conclusions). I have a Timid Synchroniser in front of the party and yet non of the attempts resulted in a Timid natured Victini. In fact, all of the natures were Lax and characteristic was 'Somewhat of a clown'. Also, the IVs were not what they were supposed to be(31/x/31/31/31/31). However, there was once that the nature changed to Quiet and the IVs were the ones mentioned above.
    I'm pretty sure I've been hitting the time at the right moment (BTW my time is 05/07/2011, 07:17:09, which for me is 07:17:08 when I press A, it's a Frame 1). Does anyone know what the problem is?
    Last edited by metalKS; 20th April 2011 at 12:55 AM.

  2. #62
    Flower Power Troggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    @ metalleg

    Have you searched spreads of adjacent seeds? When you generate the seed in the time finder, one of the options will let you generate adjacents. You may be hitting the wrong Timer0 value. That's not hard to correct, but your first priority should be to find what seed and frame you are consistently hitting.

    Are you supposed to hold down a button during the startup? It would tell you that in the Time Finder window also.
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  3. #63
    Registered User deuce's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    the time you did hit quiet, you should have saved once and then encountered victini. every time you got lax nature, the pid was on a frame that tells the game not to use a syncronizer. just advance it by saving once, try and see if the nature is timid. if you get the ivs corrected just take note of the nature, and keep advancing the pid by one by saving until the syncronizer has an effect.
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  4. #64
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    ok, a few things.
    the only encounter types where the IVs are different are eggs and roamers. evetrything else is kind of lumped into 1 group where the IVs are found the same way, so no worries there. as for hitting the time and getting the wrong seed, that can happen. one of the encryption variables(a number grabbed from timer0 at a specific time) can vary by 1 value. so if you normally get C7E as your timer0, it can also be C7F. also, some dses/ds firmwares cause timer0 to go up one when you use certain keypresses, it seems. so you may not be doing anything wrong at all.

    easiest way to tell, if you're sure you booted the game at the right second:

    -go to the parameter finder
    -type in the time and date of the seed you were aiming for
    -add in the ivs of the poke you got
    -lave everything on the right alone, but adjust second to + and - 10 seconds from the time you were trying to hit.
    - you will get a "new" set of parameters. all you ned is the timer0 to see if you hit the wrong one, which you likely did. it's an easy and very useful way of testing.

    also, for the pidrng, keep in mind that the starting frame will NOT always be the same. i've gottem 3-4 different starting frames on the sasme seed in the same place. you need to find this because the pidrng value when you're able to move around is 40-65 past the actual initial pidrng seed. the game advances the frame based off of a gigantic lookup table that is still being researched.

    easiest way to find a consistent starting frame:

    -hit your seed and catch the poke and check the nature. write it down.
    -hit the seed again, and either save once or use a chatot to advance the frame once. check the natyure and write it down
    -hit the seed one last time and advance the rame twice via saving/chatot. check the nature.
    -in themain window of reporter, choose "method 5 pidrng" and search your seed.
    -start looking on frame 35 until you see those 3 natures in a row. the frame with the first nature in your list of 3 is your starting frame.

    the initial->starting frame advances may never be figured out, as it's loads of work for an extrenmely small amount of gain, so you may want to get used to checking your starting frame this way.

  5. #65
    Registered User metalKS's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    All right, thanks for the help guys :D

    EDIT: Ok, I'm seem like a n00b now after all the advice you guys gave me and I still can't get the Victini.
    I've been trying a few things and none of them seems to work out. I'll list the steps of the thing I've been doing.

    *I have 4 Pokemon + 1 fainted Timid Synchroniser in every step, making the Pokemon in my party a grand total of 5.
    1. Hit the time(05/07/2011, 07:17:08), encounter Victini, catch it. The nature turns out to be Quiet with the desired IVs.
    2. Hit the time again, save once and turn off the DS.
    3. Hit the time again, encounter Victini, catch it. The nature turns out to be Timid but the IVs are not what I want.
    4. Repeat step 2.
    5. Step 1 happens again.

    As the process continues, the results of step 1 and step 3 alternates. This is really weird(for me at least) and I have no idea why this happens.

    @ Troggy: I do not know if my timer zero is correct, but I assume it is since it worked for the Volcarona. The RNG reporter did not tell me to press any buttons, and I did exactly that.

    @deuce: I do not seem to be getting Lax natured Victini anymore. I have no idea why. Yet from the process I mentioned above the natures alternate between Quiet and Timid. However, the Quiet natured one always come with the desired IVs while the Timid one does not(I think it's IVs are the same as well since it's characteristic is the same every time I encounter it.)

    @Mat924: I did try the process of finding the starting frame you mentioned, and the results of the natures I caught were Quiet, Gentle and Docile. I searched the first 1000 frames in the RNG reporter and there seems to be no combination of the natures I caught. I typed in the seed, Method (Methond 5 PIDRNG), Encounter Type (Stationary Pokemon), Synch nature (Timid), Max results (1000), Starting frame (1), IVs (31/x/31/31/31/31) and my ID. Is this even correct? (BTW the main window is the first Window the RNG reporter opens right? I'm using 9.74 Beta)

    RNGing for the Volcorana worked quite smoothly, and yet this little Victory Pokemon seems to be actually claiming victory in this war. If you guys or anyone knows what the problem is, please do share :D
    Last edited by metalKS; 20th April 2011 at 11:00 PM.

  6. #66
    Registered User deuce's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    when you save the ds, DO NOT turn off the ds. do everything else the same before, just dont turn off the ds. save once encounter check ivs and nature. if ivs are correct, but nature is not, turn off and hit time again. then save twice and do not turn off. with a syncronizer, you should get a timid one before 4 saves.

    i was able to get a synced timid one yesterday, but i was also having trouble getting the proper ivs, i was missing my timer0 by 1 often.
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  7. #67
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by metalleg View Post
    @ Troggy: I do not know if my timer zero is correct, but I assume it is since it worked for the Volcarona. The RNG reporter did not tell me to press any buttons, and I did exactly that.
    The value you input in your parameters is probably correct. What we are saying is that you have about a 50/50 shot of hitting your Timer0 value based on exactly when you boot up your game.

    Quote Originally Posted by deuce View Post
    i was able to get a synced timid one yesterday, but i was also having trouble getting the proper ivs, i was missing my timer0 by 1 often.
    What I found is that you can boot up your game *slightly* later if you are getting the Timer0 value before the one you want. Still hit the same second, of course.
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  8. #68
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Troggy View Post
    The value you input in your parameters is probably correct. What we are saying is that you have about a 50/50 shot of hitting your Timer0 value based on exactly when you boot up your game.



    What I found is that you can boot up your game *slightly* later if you are getting the Timer0 value before the one you want. Still hit the same second, of course.
    this doesn't actually affect anything. the starting time doesn;t affect the timer0 status when it's pulled from memory and used in the encryption.


    metalleg:

    what i was also saying was that the starting frame can change more than once on a given seed. if those3 natures don't show up in a row(AND you're hitting your seed correctly), then that means you're getting between 1 and 3 different starting frames. there's nothing you can do about changing starting frames, either. you just need to keep trying.

    and like i was saying yesterday, the initial frame advancements to the starting frame may never be fully figured out. i'm not gonna start posting big ARM disassemblies and huge tables, but it's loads of work for something that isn't all that important since standard seeds are so easy to hit.

    and yes, the main window is the one that open when you double click on rngreporter.exe.

  9. #69
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Mat924 View Post
    this doesn't actually affect anything. the starting time doesn;t affect the timer0 status when it's pulled from memory and used in the encryption.
    Oh, alright then. I suppose I just lucked out.
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  10. #70
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    it's hard to determine still. some people say, like you, that starting at a certain time does something, but most have no issue with that. personally, i think it's on the firmware. different firmware revisions/micro-revisions are responsible for the minute differences, so far as i can see.

    the way it works is that on boot, the game reaches out to 4 places, vcount, vframe, timer0, and gxstat and grabs their value at that precise moment. it then uses those integers in the encryption formula. timer0, however, is a fast timer located at 4000100 and is fast enough to vary by just a bit.

    e: if you want an idea of just how quickly the game is creating the initial seed on boot, think of it in terms of delay. you know how quickly delay moves, right? roughly 60/second? well, by a delay of 6, the game has already grabbed all the values and created the initial seed. so in the first 1/10th of a second the game is booted, everything is already done. that's how quick all the timing needs to be.
    Last edited by Mat924; 21st April 2011 at 10:52 AM.

  11. #71
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Mat924 View Post
    it's hard to determine still. some people say, like you, that starting at a certain time does something, but most have no issue with that. personally, i think it's on the firmware. different firmware revisions/micro-revisions are responsible for the minute differences, so far as i can see.

    the way it works is that on boot, the game reaches out to 4 places, vcount, vframe, timer0, and gxstat and grabs their value at that precise moment. it then uses those integers in the encryption formula. timer0, however, is a fast timer located at 4000100 and is fast enough to vary by just a bit.

    e: if you want an idea of just how quickly the game is creating the initial seed on boot, think of it in terms of delay. you know how quickly delay moves, right? roughly 60/second? well, by a delay of 6, the game has already grabbed all the values and created the initial seed. so in the first 1/10th of a second the game is booted, everything is already done. that's how quick all the timing needs to be.
    Well, seeing as I have only done this one time, I don't really have a large sample size on which to base a conclusion. Just thought it might help someone out, since it seemed to work for me.

    Most of what you are saying here makes good sense. However, if all of that information is created in roughly 0.1 seconds, why are there only 2 likely Timer0 values per second?
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  12. #72
    Registered User Julum's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Can someone tell me how to even use it? When I went on it, everything looked like gibberish to me.
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  13. #73
    Registered User deuce's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    watch some youtube videos done by bearsfan something something... just google for it. if you havent done any previous gen rng'n you may want to read some of smogons guides to try and understand some of the basics.

    also what game are you trying to rng for?
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  14. #74
    Registered User metalKS's Avatar
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    @ deuce: Out of curiousity, in the end did you manage to get the Victini you wanted(proper IVs, natures and all that)? How would you even know if you're timer0 value is off by 1, and how would you adjust it?

    I really appreciate the help guys :D

  15. #75
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    Default Re: RNG Help Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by metalleg View Post
    @ deuce: Out of curiousity, in the end did you manage to get the Victini you wanted(proper IVs, natures and all that)? How would you even know if you're timer0 value is off by 1, and how would you adjust it?

    I really appreciate the help guys :D
    I think I mentioned this earlier, but this is where the Time Finder window can help. If you take your seed and generate adjacents, it'll populate results for seeds that have the Timer0 value next to the one you are going for. If you are hitting one of those adjacent seeds and the right frame, then you are probably doing everything right.
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