Character Discussion Thread

[The Outrage]

Also the fact that its been implied many times that "weak" gym leaders are only so because they limit their powers to test trainers based on their skill-level. It baffles me the amount of people who assume Roark is as weak as the early-game youngsters you fight

[Wyvernphlare]

Simple, Cheren no longer cares only about strength, and by being an early Gym Leader he can test the strength and resolve of many younger trainers now. That had to take alot of character growth on his part.

Yeah but it was never revealed that gym leaders are holding back I think they even imply the opposite. So that doesn't make much sense

[The Outrage]

Simple, Cheren no longer cares only about strength, and by being an early Gym Leader he can test the strength and resolve of many younger trainers now. That had to take alot of character growth on his part.

Yeah but it was never revealed that gym leaders are holding back I think they even imply the opposite. So that doesn't make much sense

The late-game rematches don't mean anything to you? It's quite clear they do hold back. Their position as gym leader would imply that they do. They test trainer's powers. Do you think it's a fair test to give a first grader just learning math a university-level calculus exam? Well the same logic follows here. You don't test a new trainer's powers by simply stomping on their abilities. Other than Clair's boastfulness, Volkner too implied that he's on par with some of the Elite 4.

The very structure of the game makes it strange to not think that. You really think those stronger trainers would be passed up as gym leaders when you have people like Roark and Falkner using low-leveled Pokemon?

[Wyvernphlare]

Simple, Cheren no longer cares only about strength, and by being an early Gym Leader he can test the strength and resolve of many younger trainers now. That had to take alot of character growth on his part.

Yeah but it was never revealed that gym leaders are holding back I think they even imply the opposite. So that doesn't make much sense

The late-game rematches don't mean anything to you? It's quite clear they do hold back. Their position as gym leader would imply that they do. They test trainer's powers. Do you think it's a fair test to give a first grader just learning math a university-level calculus exam? Well the same logic follows here. You don't test a new trainer's powers by simply stomping on their abilities. Other than Clair's boastfulness, Volkner too implied that he's on par with some of the Elite 4.

I support the idea of the holding back and It makes more sense to me. BUT AT TIMES THEY IMPLY THE OPPOSITE. I thought about the rematches but the oppisite seemed to be the case which pissed me off myself.

For instance remember when Roark said "I can't believe I lost to someone without any badges" not to mention this would Geologically unfair

[UnovaCastaway]

Yup. I guess Cheren isn't obsessed with becoming champion anymore...maybe.

Or, maybe he realized that working toward a grandiose goal required starting at a lower level, like as a Gym Leader. (look at how politicians start, for example, from campaign assistants and local government to higher offices)

[The Outrage]

Yup. I guess Cheren isn't obsessed with becoming champion anymore...maybe.

Or, maybe he realized that working toward a grandiose goal required starting at a lower level, like as a Gym Leader. (look at how politicians start, for example, from campaign assistants and local government to higher offices)

That's because they need references, connections, and experience. Cheren beat all the Elite 4 members--he's pretty qualified as it is. There's not much else holding him back from Champion other than the current champion himself (technically N since he's the last one to have actually completed the Elite 4 challenge uninterrupted).

His realization at the end of the game seems more in line with what smallady suggests.

[Ampharos King]

What has GF done to you, Cheren? What happened to the young trainer who wanted to become a strong Pokemon Champion and valued strength above everything else in battling? The radical change in his appearance (getting rid of his glasses, slight muscle tone, whiter clothing) does not match the stereotypical "first gym leader" look that was set up in the past games. All of the previous "first GLs" you fought were either relatively inexperienced trainers who had obtained pokemon from their relatives, or graduates of the trainer school. Well, we know that Cheren had fought and defeated all members of the Unova E4 in the BW games. He is already an expert in battling. I can understand his motives for wishing to battle young challengers to gauge their hidden potential, but it just does not fit him after all of the progress that he made in the first two games.

[The Outrage]

What has GF done to you, Cheren? What happened to the young trainer who wanted to become a strong Pokemon Champion and valued strength above everything else in battling?

I'm guessing you either didn't finish the game or completely ignored the post-game material that demonstrates his character development. While becoming Champion wouldn't have been out there, acting like he valued strength above all else would be character derailment. I'm actually okay with this since we didn't need Cheren becoming a carbon-copy of Alder.

[Ampharos King]

I'm guessing you either didn't finish the game or completely ignored the post-game material that demonstrates his character development.

I did finish the original two games, and I mentioned in my previous post that I can understand why Cheren would choose to do this. It just doesn't seem right in my eyes that someone who is clearly able to fight on that higher level can be satisfied by battling beginner trainers on a lower level just to gauge their potential.

[The Outrage]

The radical change in his appearance (getting rid of his glasses, slight muscle tone, whiter clothing) does not match the stereotypical "first gym leader" look that was set up in the past games.

Brock's white shirt in his first appearance (brown shirt in FrLg), Falkner's traditional Japanese clothing, Roxanne's teacher/student outfit, Roark's mining clothes...I honestly don't see what you're getting at.

All of the previous "first GLs" you fought were either relatively inexperienced trainers who had obtained pokemon from their relatives, or graduates of the trainer school. Well, we know that Cheren had fought and defeated all members of the Unova E4 in the BW games. He is already an expert in battling. I can understand his motives for wishing to battle young challengers to gauge their hidden potential, but it just does not fit him after all of the progress that he made in the first two games.

There was no suggestion of Brock being inexperienced, nor Roxanne. She may have been a Trainer School graduate, but that says nothing about her current battle experience. For all you know, she graduated Trainer School, accomplished as much as Cheren, and that's why she was chosen for her position. Misty and Flannery were confirmed to be new to their gym leader careers. Furthermore, what does it matter who they obtained their Pokemon from? What does that say anything about their power? The PC technically obtained their starters from their neighbours. Basically handouts.

I'm guessing you either didn't finish the game or completely ignored the post-game material that demonstrates his character development.

I did finish the original two games, and I mentioned in my previous post that I can understand why Cheren would choose to do this. It just doesn't seem right in my eyes that someone who is clearly able to fight on that higher level can be satisfied by battling beginner trainers on a lower level just to gauge their potential.

Okay, so you got to that point. Your only objection seems to be that you can't imagine Cheren being in this position because of his resume even though his character development does not contradict this. Furthermore, given that we know trainers can start at any town within a region, Cheren isn't limited to battling low-leveled trainers. He may have trainers on their eighth badge, or even trainers who come from other regions having beaten their local leaders battling him. In essence, Cheren gets more challenges than the Champion ever would.

[UnovaCastaway]

At the end of the original games, Cheren's ambition certainly went back down to earth after being adamantly sky-high. However, taking smaller steps like what he's doing in BW2 would be in character. He could still have a bigger goal, but after contemplating what he wants to do with himself, he aims for a more realistic position as a gym leader.

[Reila]

The only thing that surprised me was the type he choose to be a specialist.

A good surprise, since Normal is one of the my favorite types.
Now he is one my favorite gym leaders.

[Zeb]

Looks like Alder is up to his favourite past time of jumping-off-high-ledges-for-no-good-reason, again.

[Eneci]

Is it confirmed that he is a normal type or is it just a conclusion by seeing Patrat! Maybe he goes all Striaton trio and depending on which starter U choose he has some back up Poke against U!

[Taliesyn]

Is it confirmed that he is a normal type or is it just a conclusion by seeing Patrat!

I think that's what people decided.