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  1. #31

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lacquer Head View Post
    I tend to ignore the Pokedex entries. It seems like even basic Pokemon are capable of a high level of destruction...so how the hell are humans even alive? Let alone the top of the food chain. Alakazam has an IQ of 5000...yet can't communicate with humans. Yanmega can rip TREES out of the ground with a flap of it's wings. etc etc
    On Alakazam, there's many different ways to measure I.Q. and one's intelligence.
    I've always thought of Alakazam's brain as more of a fast computer rather then capable of higher cognitive functions.
    That isn't to say one wouldn't be capable of something such as Human speech. It's just that that's not how it's brain works.

    As for Yanmega, well, it IS a Pretty Big Bug.

    Of course, I've also always felt that Pokedex entries were often exaggerations and hyperbole,
    more often quoting human's myths and superstitions rather then given scientifically documented facts
    (evidenced by how often the Pokedex uses the phrase "It is said to" prior to giving it's description.)
    Then again, that's not to say that A Yanmega was strong enough to rip trees our of the ground once,
    and all Yanmega have since been held to that standard.

  2. #32

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCableGuy View Post
    Of course, I've also always felt that Pokedex entries were often exaggerations and hyperbole,
    more often quoting human's myths and superstitions rather then given scientifically documented facts
    (evidenced by how often the Pokedex uses the phrase "It is said to" prior to giving it's description.)
    Then again, that's not to say that A Yanmega was strong enough to rip trees our of the ground once,
    and all Yanmega have since been held to that standard.
    Hmm, that's a very good point...fucking shitty Prof. Oak

    ...wait, if the Pokedex is empty and we're filling it...does that mean the character is the one making these descriptions? >.> That would make even more sense...coming from a 10 year old.

  3. #33

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lacquer Head View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCableGuy View Post
    Of course, I've also always felt that Pokedex entries were often exaggerations and hyperbole,
    more often quoting human's myths and superstitions rather then given scientifically documented facts
    (evidenced by how often the Pokedex uses the phrase "It is said to" prior to giving it's description.)
    Then again, that's not to say that A Yanmega was strong enough to rip trees our of the ground once,
    and all Yanmega have since been held to that standard.
    Hmm, that's a very good point...fucking shitty Prof. Oak

    ...wait, if the Pokedex is empty and we're filling it...does that mean the character is the one making these descriptions? >.> That would make even more sense...coming from a 10 year old.
    As far as the anime is concerned, Prof. Oak isn't the one writing the entries. That would be Professor Westwood and maybe some other researchers. Remember, the Pokedex had this for Slowpoke:

    "Slowpoke, the Dopey Pokemon. No one can tell what a Slowpoke is thinking, if it ever DOES think." (rather mean isn't it?)

    And when Misty said it wasn't nice to call it Dopey, Westwood said "Maybe one of my assistants wrote that particular entry...though dopey does seem to an accurate description of Slowpoke's mental capacity."

    And again, about the Yanmega, I lean more towards the idea that they can rip out trees, but usually don't because of precise muscle control. Now that I think about it, if the species knocked down trees every time it took off, you would think Pokemon that lived in those trees would have started complaining. So maybe that could be another reason why Yanmega might try not to do that when it flies. I don't know, that's just the way I look at it.

  4. #34

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    I'm not talking about "why are there trees", I'm saying that a bug that's able to rip a tree out of the ground on command is just impossible. Think about the force that is necessary to do so, with just wind. That takes one hell of a source...

    Also, I'm not talking about the anime regarding the pokedex

  5. #35
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    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    I only sometimes adhere to the games' logic data and other things. Some of what the games says about a Pokemon makes no sense whatsoever.

    Weights of Pokemon is a big one. While some weights of Pokemon from the Pokedex DOES makes sense, others are just absolute lies. Take Wailord for example, at 47'07" it's impossible to even believe it weighs 877.4 pounds; that makes zero sense. A real-life whale measuring 50 feet weighs around 90,000 lbs. So they're telling me Wailord of the same size is only ~1/100 the weight of a real whale? Many large Pokemon have weights that really do not fit them. Take another example: Giratina (Altered Form), 14'09" and 1653.5 pounds. No. An elephant 150% the height of humans weigh around 9900 pounds. You're saying an elephant would weigh more than Giratina, even if Giratina dwarfs the elephant? If I were to analyze all the Pokemon, a good 50 would have incorrect weights.

    Another is the size of the routes and cities. A city is not a couple of buildings and random people roaming around in the city. I understand it's probably just a limitation for the console, so I tend to ignore the fact that in games, the sizes of cities, routes, and the entire region to be much smaller than they really are. The anime realistically depicts sizes of cities and buildings; if it was blasted up to real size, it would probably be a bit boring, waiting hours just to get to new cities and towns and getting lost in the city itself. Who knows? In the future, we may have treadmill gaming, where you would literally be able to "walk" in virtual reality. That would be fancy...

    Legendary Pokemon in the games is a big one for me. I would say some DO have genders and able to mate. There's more than one of many Legendaries out there. Legendaries probably don't have any gender is probably the result of the game developers not wanting every person's party to be full of Legendaries. And when you do look into the anime, there aren't many scientists that do study Legendary Pokemon... so they probably can't tell the difference between a female and a male legendary. If they were to somehow get a hold of Legendary Pokemon without getting killed or causing massive devastation, it would be cruel and awkward to study... this... ("HEY YOU! NOW GO HAVE 'FUN' WITH THE OTHER ONE WILL YA?"). I group Legendaries into 3 groups: The 580's, The Lesser 600's, and The 680's (most Legendary Pokemon have a base stat total that falls into one of these stats). I'm assuming most of the 580's and the 600's are capable of breeding, and only a two from the 680's (Lugia and Ho-Oh). They probably breed far, far, away from civilization (If you were a Legendary Pokemon, would YOU want to make out in a city where people may say "OMG I SAW [Insert] MAKING OUT IN THE BUSHES!"?) And also, Legendaries are probably a lot more harder to catch than in the games. I'm assuming even Master Balls may not work... If you do catch one, it's probably one without overly special abilities or you are well trained to take care of them.

    And I'm sure genetics are completely ignored in the games.



    P.S. Pokemon defies the laws of physics, not that I'm mad about that, I'll probably be happy to have infinite energy...
    Last edited by KaiserLugia; 10th May 2013 at 02:58 PM.
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  6. #36
    エリカは俺のy(ry Utsune's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    That's a very interesting point you've raised.

    Personally I selectively adhere to facts, from games and from the anime. While most things are cool in the games, there are certain aspects you can't help but to notice all the reason there is to them is for the purpose of the game. For say, the Pokemon raised by Gym Leaders in World Tournaments: Erika with an Abomasnow just seems really out. Most of the times, I believe the 'official' Pokemon own by Gym Leaders are the ones from the anime. However there is one instance with Skyla and her Unfezant in the anime, which is male, but in the games (ignoring PWT which is random gender) and other manga depicts her Unfezant as a female. This could be due to that Ash's Unfezant is a female and they want to distinguish hers from it, and it is here when I would officially recognise her Unfezant to be female rather than the anime counterpart.

    There are also instances when you wonder if the developers didn't plan ahead with future installments: The mating issue with Nidoqueen; Leafeon evolution has nothing to do with the leaf stone introduced in Gen 1 (and you thought it would make sense;) Magnezone, Magmortar, Electivire, and all those Gen 1 Pokemon receiving a further evolutionary stage in Gen 4... (which also goes back to my previous point.) True, it is interesting to add different kinds of evolutionary methods, like levelling up holding a Razor Claw, but it's really difficult to overlook how they have forcibly implemented those logic.

    That being said, the manga Pokemon Special has done an excellent job in rationalising all the game logic, not necessarily by explaining, but by 'see-for-yourself' kinda way. Things like trading to evolve doesn't have an explanation, but seeing it in action in the manga somehow makes everything all better.

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  7. #37

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Utsune View Post
    That's a very interesting point you've raised.

    Personally I selectively adhere to facts, from games and from the anime. While most things are cool in the games, there are certain aspects you can't help but to notice all the reason there is to them is for the purpose of the game. For say, the Pokemon raised by Gym Leaders in World Tournaments: Erika with an Abomasnow just seems really out. Most of the times, I believe the 'official' Pokemon own by Gym Leaders are the ones from the anime. However there is one instance with Skyla and her Unfezant in the anime, which is male, but in the games (ignoring PWT which is random gender) and other manga depicts her Unfezant as a female. This could be due to that Ash's Unfezant is a female and they want to distinguish hers from it, and it is here when I would officially recognise her Unfezant to be female rather than the anime counterpart.

    There are also instances when you wonder if the developers didn't plan ahead with future installments: The mating issue with Nidoqueen; Leafeon evolution has nothing to do with the leaf stone introduced in Gen 1 (and you thought it would make sense;) Magnezone, Magmortar, Electivire, and all those Gen 1 Pokemon receiving a further evolutionary stage in Gen 4... (which also goes back to my previous point.) True, it is interesting to add different kinds of evolutionary methods, like levelling up holding a Razor Claw, but it's really difficult to overlook how they have forcibly implemented those logic.

    That being said, the manga Pokemon Special has done an excellent job in rationalising all the game logic, not necessarily by explaining, but by 'see-for-yourself' kinda way. Things like trading to evolve doesn't have an explanation, but seeing it in action in the manga somehow makes everything all better.
    Hmm, I agree that Erica having an Abonasnow does seem a bit strange, it being a Grass and Ice type. And with Erica being so busy as a Gym Leader and owner of a perfume shop, you would think she wouldn't have the time to go to the right region to find it. Maybe you could explain it as being a gift that someone brought to her. I don't know, that's just a thought that crossed my mind.

    The Nidoqueen thing is rather stupid, and just weird. Why is it that the female Nidoran loses the ability to breed at the second and third stages of growth and the male does not? Leafeon...you raise a good point. Why didn't I think of that before? The rocks used for that and Glaceon really should be something more like Evolutionary Stones, more available to find rather than seemingly confined to specific places.

    When it comes to creatures like Magnezone and the like, it sort of works out in fiction. I mean, Pokemon is an ongoing study, so maybe researchers just discovered these new evolutions, or maybe they were discovered a while ago, but their research wasn't fit to publish yet. And since I have never seen Magmortar before, let me say that those arm cannons are AWESOME.

    When it comes to the evolution methods, I really agree that it's messed up. Evolving when traded doesn't work at all in a story, not as the only way to evolve. It only makes sense as a coincidence. And the items...

    Evolutionary stones make some sense, since they come off as radioactive stones of sort that have affects on specific creatures. I could even go with weaker concepts like the King's Rock. But other items really don't work. For example, Clamperl and how it evolves. In the game, it makes sense. But then they used the exact same thing in the anime, and I couldn't help but cringe at it. I get that they are trying to advertise for the game, but it just doesn't work so well there. A special stone is one thing, but how does exposure to a scale, or a tooth, cause Clamperl to evolve into different creatures? I see that the scale looks like it comes from the corresponding evolution, and so does the tooth. Maybe with a little more explanation it would have made more sense, like maybe Clamperl reacts to traces of DNA in the scale or tooth or something.

  8. #38
    エリカは俺のy(ry Utsune's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post
    Hmm, I agree that Erica having an Abonasnow does seem a bit strange, it being a Grass and Ice type. And with Erica being so busy as a Gym Leader and owner of a perfume shop, you would think she wouldn't have the time to go to the right region to find it. Maybe you could explain it as being a gift that someone brought to her. I don't know, that's just a thought that crossed my mind.

    The Nidoqueen thing is rather stupid, and just weird. Why is it that the female Nidoran loses the ability to breed at the second and third stages of growth and the male does not? Leafeon...you raise a good point. Why didn't I think of that before? The rocks used for that and Glaceon really should be something more like Evolutionary Stones, more available to find rather than seemingly confined to specific places.

    When it comes to creatures like Magnezone and the like, it sort of works out in fiction. I mean, Pokemon is an ongoing study, so maybe researchers just discovered these new evolutions, or maybe they were discovered a while ago, but their research wasn't fit to publish yet. And since I have never seen Magmortar before, let me say that those arm cannons are AWESOME.

    When it comes to the evolution methods, I really agree that it's messed up. Evolving when traded doesn't work at all in a story, not as the only way to evolve. It only makes sense as a coincidence. And the items...

    Evolutionary stones make some sense, since they come off as radioactive stones of sort that have affects on specific creatures. I could even go with weaker concepts like the King's Rock. But other items really don't work. For example, Clamperl and how it evolves. In the game, it makes sense. But then they used the exact same thing in the anime, and I couldn't help but cringe at it. I get that they are trying to advertise for the game, but it just doesn't work so well there. A special stone is one thing, but how does exposure to a scale, or a tooth, cause Clamperl to evolve into different creatures? I see that the scale looks like it comes from the corresponding evolution, and so does the tooth. Maybe with a little more explanation it would have made more sense, like maybe Clamperl reacts to traces of DNA in the scale or tooth or something.
    I've seen funny fan-made explanations for Nidoqueen, the most obvious one because she reached her menopause. But seriously, it was probably some sort of difficulty in coding. Not that Game Freaks will admit to either!

    There is also another thing I forget to raise. The thing with breeding. Back in Gen 2, you breed Chansey you get Chansey. And then the creators probably realised how on earth could a baby Chansey be so massively human-sized? (or for that matter, Snorlax haha) And so they have invented the Incense. Hold Luck Incense and breed for Happiny. Which is totally a display of tweaking the Pokemon universe to suit the developers' needs. While I'm still happy about Pokemon games and the universe, it just feels sooo incomplete if you get what I mean.

    I think the Clamperl and other similar evolutionary methods somehow just seem so random, not saying it should have been impossible within the Pokemon universe. However, not sure if you've come across of this before, but the King's Rock thing with Slowpoke has actually been pretty well attempted by a combination of games and anime. Slowpoke evolves into Slowbro by having a Shellder bite on its tail (something I'd love to see in games, but the loss of a Shellder probably had this idea dropped lol,) though when holding a King's Rock, Shellders are attracted to biting their heads instead, hence they become Slowking. I guess the developers could try to force a more "scientific" or at least a "logical" explanation onto other cases like this one if they really wanted to. To be really honest, I personally think that anything is fine, as long as I get some sort of explanation rather just being told "hold the scale and trade to somehow evolve." The Slowking explanation is enough to satisfy me.

    Magmortar and Electivire also makes sense, I guess. Boxes holding enormous amounts of energy (Magmarizer and Electirizer respectively) may somehow unleash the supplementary energy required for the evolutionary process.

    But in any case, I agree with your point about the never-ending study of Pokemon. I guess as simple as an explanation it may be, it does give creators the possibility to expand on the Pokemon universe, and I won't complain about that.

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  9. #39

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post
    Hmm, I agree that Erica having an Abonasnow does seem a bit strange, it being a Grass and Ice type. And with Erica being so busy as a Gym Leader and owner of a perfume shop, you would think she wouldn't have the time to go to the right region to find it. Maybe you could explain it as being a gift that someone brought to her. I don't know, that's just a thought that crossed my mind.
    I'd imagine that, as a Lover of Grass Types, she wouldn't be so concerned about it's Ice type.

    It's no different from someone who loves Dragon types, Flying Types, Dark Types, Etc...
    If you love that type, it's secondary type is coincidental and inconsequential.

    The Nidoqueen thing is rather stupid, and just weird. Why is it that the female Nidoran loses the ability to breed at the second and third stages of growth and the male does not? Leafeon...you raise a good point. Why didn't I think of that before? The rocks used for that and Glaceon really should be something more like Evolutionary Stones, more available to find rather than seemingly confined to specific places.

    When it comes to creatures like Magnezone and the like, it sort of works out in fiction. I mean, Pokemon is an ongoing study, so maybe researchers just discovered these new evolutions, or maybe they were discovered a while ago, but their research wasn't fit to publish yet. And since I have never seen Magmortar before, let me say that those arm cannons are AWESOME.

    When it comes to the evolution methods, I really agree that it's messed up. Evolving when traded doesn't work at all in a story, not as the only way to evolve. It only makes sense as a coincidence. And the items...

    Evolutionary stones make some sense, since they come off as radioactive stones of sort that have affects on specific creatures. I could even go with weaker concepts like the King's Rock. But other items really don't work. For example, Clamperl and how it evolves. In the game, it makes sense. But then they used the exact same thing in the anime, and I couldn't help but cringe at it. I get that they are trying to advertise for the game, but it just doesn't work so well there. A special stone is one thing, but how does exposure to a scale, or a tooth, cause Clamperl to evolve into different creatures? I see that the scale looks like it comes from the corresponding evolution, and so does the tooth. Maybe with a little more explanation it would have made more sense, like maybe Clamperl reacts to traces of DNA in the scale or tooth or something.
    I have a hypothesis that most Pokemon that Evolve by external influences have within them the ability to Evolve the same Naturally,
    Only that these external factors force the evolution process.
    The only Pokemon who do not abide by this trait is the ones whose Alternate evolution deviates from their natural Course.

    So, in a way, all Pokemon evolve by being "Coaxed" in some way by the pressures being applied to them,
    whether that pressure is from Intense Training, Emotional Bonds, Shear Force of Will, or by Factors, both Natural and Artificial.

    (Wish I could map these out, one of these days.)
    Last edited by TheCableGuy; 23rd April 2013 at 06:44 PM.

  10. #40
    Requiem Raver Drakon's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    I pick and choose what makes sense and what doesn't from the anime and games.
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  11. #41

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by Utsune View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post
    Hmm, I agree that Erica having an Abonasnow does seem a bit strange, it being a Grass and Ice type. And with Erica being so busy as a Gym Leader and owner of a perfume shop, you would think she wouldn't have the time to go to the right region to find it. Maybe you could explain it as being a gift that someone brought to her. I don't know, that's just a thought that crossed my mind.

    The Nidoqueen thing is rather stupid, and just weird. Why is it that the female Nidoran loses the ability to breed at the second and third stages of growth and the male does not? Leafeon...you raise a good point. Why didn't I think of that before? The rocks used for that and Glaceon really should be something more like Evolutionary Stones, more available to find rather than seemingly confined to specific places.

    When it comes to creatures like Magnezone and the like, it sort of works out in fiction. I mean, Pokemon is an ongoing study, so maybe researchers just discovered these new evolutions, or maybe they were discovered a while ago, but their research wasn't fit to publish yet. And since I have never seen Magmortar before, let me say that those arm cannons are AWESOME.

    When it comes to the evolution methods, I really agree that it's messed up. Evolving when traded doesn't work at all in a story, not as the only way to evolve. It only makes sense as a coincidence. And the items...

    Evolutionary stones make some sense, since they come off as radioactive stones of sort that have affects on specific creatures. I could even go with weaker concepts like the King's Rock. But other items really don't work. For example, Clamperl and how it evolves. In the game, it makes sense. But then they used the exact same thing in the anime, and I couldn't help but cringe at it. I get that they are trying to advertise for the game, but it just doesn't work so well there. A special stone is one thing, but how does exposure to a scale, or a tooth, cause Clamperl to evolve into different creatures? I see that the scale looks like it comes from the corresponding evolution, and so does the tooth. Maybe with a little more explanation it would have made more sense, like maybe Clamperl reacts to traces of DNA in the scale or tooth or something.
    I've seen funny fan-made explanations for Nidoqueen, the most obvious one because she reached her menopause. But seriously, it was probably some sort of difficulty in coding. Not that Game Freaks will admit to either!

    There is also another thing I forget to raise. The thing with breeding. Back in Gen 2, you breed Chansey you get Chansey. And then the creators probably realised how on earth could a baby Chansey be so massively human-sized? (or for that matter, Snorlax haha) And so they have invented the Incense. Hold Luck Incense and breed for Happiny. Which is totally a display of tweaking the Pokemon universe to suit the developers' needs. While I'm still happy about Pokemon games and the universe, it just feels sooo incomplete if you get what I mean.

    I think the Clamperl and other similar evolutionary methods somehow just seem so random, not saying it should have been impossible within the Pokemon universe. However, not sure if you've come across of this before, but the King's Rock thing with Slowpoke has actually been pretty well attempted by a combination of games and anime. Slowpoke evolves into Slowbro by having a Shellder bite on its tail (something I'd love to see in games, but the loss of a Shellder probably had this idea dropped lol,) though when holding a King's Rock, Shellders are attracted to biting their heads instead, hence they become Slowking. I guess the developers could try to force a more "scientific" or at least a "logical" explanation onto other cases like this one if they really wanted to. To be really honest, I personally think that anything is fine, as long as I get some sort of explanation rather just being told "hold the scale and trade to somehow evolve." The Slowking explanation is enough to satisfy me.

    Magmortar and Electivire also makes sense, I guess. Boxes holding enormous amounts of energy (Magmarizer and Electirizer respectively) may somehow unleash the supplementary energy required for the evolutionary process.

    But in any case, I agree with your point about the never-ending study of Pokemon. I guess as simple as an explanation it may be, it does give creators the possibility to expand on the Pokemon universe, and I won't complain about that.
    About Slowking: Really? All this time I thought that Slowking was a further evolution of Slowbro and the Shellder migrated or something. Huh. I would think that makes more sense than an alternate. I mean, is Slowking particularly more powerful than Slowbro? Otherwise, what's the difference? Slowpoke are supposed to evolve into Slowbro because it is beneficial to both parties, but if the Slowking for isn't really more powerful than Slowbro, then why didn't Slowpoke adapt to go for Slowking right away?

    And the Nidoqueen thing really is unfair.

    And about Magmortar, can you imagine how it would go in a story if someone evolved it exactly like in the game? "Well...I'm holding this thingy here and now that I have this and that I have been traded, I have suddenly decided to evolve! Why? I have NO IDEA. Maybe it's to spite my trainer who just traded me after tossing me this...whatever it is."

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCableGuy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post
    Hmm, I agree that Erica having an Abonasnow does seem a bit strange, it being a Grass and Ice type. And with Erica being so busy as a Gym Leader and owner of a perfume shop, you would think she wouldn't have the time to go to the right region to find it. Maybe you could explain it as being a gift that someone brought to her. I don't know, that's just a thought that crossed my mind.
    I'd imagine that, as a Lover of Grass Types, she wouldn't be so concerned about it's Ice type.

    It's no different from someone who loves Dragon types, Flying Types, Dark Types, Etc...
    If you love that type, it's secondary type is coincidental and inconsequential.

    The Nidoqueen thing is rather stupid, and just weird. Why is it that the female Nidoran loses the ability to breed at the second and third stages of growth and the male does not? Leafeon...you raise a good point. Why didn't I think of that before? The rocks used for that and Glaceon really should be something more like Evolutionary Stones, more available to find rather than seemingly confined to specific places.

    When it comes to creatures like Magnezone and the like, it sort of works out in fiction. I mean, Pokemon is an ongoing study, so maybe researchers just discovered these new evolutions, or maybe they were discovered a while ago, but their research wasn't fit to publish yet. And since I have never seen Magmortar before, let me say that those arm cannons are AWESOME.

    When it comes to the evolution methods, I really agree that it's messed up. Evolving when traded doesn't work at all in a story, not as the only way to evolve. It only makes sense as a coincidence. And the items...

    Evolutionary stones make some sense, since they come off as radioactive stones of sort that have affects on specific creatures. I could even go with weaker concepts like the King's Rock. But other items really don't work. For example, Clamperl and how it evolves. In the game, it makes sense. But then they used the exact same thing in the anime, and I couldn't help but cringe at it. I get that they are trying to advertise for the game, but it just doesn't work so well there. A special stone is one thing, but how does exposure to a scale, or a tooth, cause Clamperl to evolve into different creatures? I see that the scale looks like it comes from the corresponding evolution, and so does the tooth. Maybe with a little more explanation it would have made more sense, like maybe Clamperl reacts to traces of DNA in the scale or tooth or something.
    I have a hypothesis that most Pokemon that Evolve by external influences have within them the ability to Evolve the same Naturally,
    Only that these external factors force the evolution process.
    The only Pokemon who do not abide by this trait is the ones whose Alternate evolution deviates from their natural Course.

    So, in a way, all Pokemon evolve by being "Coaxed" in some way by the pressures being applied to them,
    whether that pressure is from Intense Training, Emotional Bonds, Shear Force of Will, or by Factors, both Natural and Artificial.

    (Wish I could map these out, one of these days.)
    Both of your points are really good. Your theory makes so much sense. It must be true!

    And one other question. How exactly does the multi-quote system work? I'm still new here and I seem to have gotten it to work somehow, but could someone give me a good explanation?

  12. #42

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post
    About Slowking: Really? All this time I thought that Slowking was a further evolution of Slowbro and the Shellder migrated or something. Huh. I would think that makes more sense than an alternate. I mean, is Slowking particularly more powerful than Slowbro? Otherwise, what's the difference? Slowpoke are supposed to evolve into Slowbro because it is beneficial to both parties, but if the Slowking for isn't really more powerful than Slowbro, then why didn't Slowpoke adapt to go for Slowking right away?
    Actually, Slowking is just the mirror Image of Slowbro.
    The have the same stats except that their Def and SpDef are swapped.
    Their reasoning for doing this is a little odd, as Slowking seams a little Superfluous,
    although Slowking does tend to be a little better at being a Special Tank while Slowbro is a fairly decent Physical Tank.

    And about Magmortar, can you imagine how it would go in a story if someone evolved it exactly like in the game? "Well...I'm holding this thingy here and now that I have this and that I have been traded, I have suddenly decided to evolve! Why? I have NO IDEA. Maybe it's to spite my trainer who just traded me after tossing me this...whatever it is."
    To understand how Magmortar and Electivire Evolve,
    one has to ask what exactly is a Electirizer and Magmarizer.

    Honestly, I don't have an answer for this....
    I kind of got the impression that much of the recent Evolution invoking Items
    were just thrown in at the last minute with no Rhyme or Reason.

    But I figured they work like the Upgrade/Dubious Disk does for Porygon.
    They're Artifical devices that cause a reconfiguration of the
    Pokemon's DNA during the Digitization that occurs in Trade.

    Quote Originally Posted by reynard View Post

    Both of your points are really good. Your theory makes so much sense. It must be true!

    And one other question. How exactly does the multi-quote system work? I'm still new here and I seem to have gotten it to work somehow, but could someone give me a good explanation?
    Frankly, I just delete anything that I'm not Responding to.
    Takes a bit to sort through long Quote-chains but I think it's worth cleaning up the thread a little.
    If there's another way to do it, I have yet to discover it.

  13. #43
    エリカは俺のy(ry Utsune's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCableGuy View Post
    I'd imagine that, as a Lover of Grass Types, she wouldn't be so concerned about it's Ice type.

    It's no different from someone who loves Dragon types, Flying Types, Dark Types, Etc...
    If you love that type, it's secondary type is coincidental and inconsequential.

    I think the thing that gets at me is, it seems as if she possesses all the grass types in the world even though she's a mere gym leader from Kanto. Not saying it can't happen, but looking at all the gym leaders with dual-types, you can't help but to notice the game makers did that just to make the PWT more of a challenge. Then again, she did travel all the way from Kanto to Unova for the PWT, so from that point of view it can make sense, only if they would expand a bit (or at least give some more implication) on it to consolidate this side issue for story canon.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheCableGuy View Post
    I have a hypothesis that most Pokemon that Evolve by external influences have within them the ability to Evolve the same Naturally,
    Only that these external factors force the evolution process.
    The only Pokemon who do not abide by this trait is the ones whose Alternate evolution deviates from their natural Course.

    So, in a way, all Pokemon evolve by being "Coaxed" in some way by the pressures being applied to them,
    whether that pressure is from Intense Training, Emotional Bonds, Shear Force of Will, or by Factors, both Natural and Artificial.

    (Wish I could map these out, one of these days.)
    Can't agree more. Always have a hunch on this, I'm totally down for the innate ability to evolve naturally without item assistance.

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  14. #44

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Another thing that comes to mind for me is the genderless issue. I know the game says that several Pokemon are genderless, but I think part of that is an extension of the egg-group system. I do feel like some Pokemon could actually work as genderless. For example, Staryu and Starmie. With real starfish it can be pretty much impossible to tell the gender until they start reproducing. And real starfish can reproduce asexually by spilling off limbs or their disc (central part) and those pieces regenerate into new starfish.

    Given that the two can regenerate, I could understand them working that way.

    But take other Pokemon, like Magnemite. In the anime episode it first appeared in, Brock called it "inorganic", and that's a rather spot on description. It's a metal sphere with magnets. It certainly doesn't seem like it has a gender. But automatically classifying it as genderless may be a stretch. So it's inorganic. Just because it's a form of inorganic life doesn't mean it can't produce eggs like other species. It's just harder to tell gender.

    Besides, if you want to say Magnemite is genderless purely based on looks, then consider Ghastly. It's a ball of gas...a ball of gas with eyes and a mouth, and yet somehow, you can have a male and female Ghastly, and they can produce eggs with the likes of Chimecho, Grimer, Muk, Koffing, and Weezing.

    And then there is the single-gender issue. Most of it you can work out. Many species can have gender counterparts. And for all female species like Kangaskhan and Chansey, you can work that out with parthenogenesis (something suggested by TV Tropes). Parenthogenesis is asexual self-reproduction. It's used by a species of New Mexico lizard that is made only of females.

    But the one problem that can't be worked out with either parthenogenesis or an official/unofficial gender counterpart is the Hitmons. They are all male, and that's a problem. Parthenogenesis or other means of self reproduction work for all female species, but not all male. Yeah, you could say the Hitmons do that thing where they temporarily switch genders like some real animals, but that doesn't work.

    That particular strategy is employed in real life under special, emergency circumstances. And there's a logic to that. After all, why would you bother making gender switching your main means of producing offspring? Why not just have separate genders? Isn't that simpler?

    Then I look at other Pokemon like Machop/Machoke/Machamp. They have males and females. You can't say the Hitmons are all male for the extra muscle, because female Machamp (as in the Pokemon that can send you to the Moon) does quite well. You could try to say that the Hitmons can't be female because they don't look it...but that doesn't work. Machoke can be female, and so can Machamp, and they have muscles on top of muscles, certainly not what we as humans would consider typically "female". Or take Alakazam. While a female may have a shorter mustache, it still has a mustache, and that's perfectly acceptable as a trait for Alakazam women.

    So in the end, I say that the Hitmons should have both genders. Let them have the gender ratio of Machamp or something. It's certainly better than an all-male species.

  15. #45

    Default Re: How much do you adhere to the game?

    Just a note on the Hitmons, I think it kind of makes a little sense with them all being male.
    All three Hitmons originate from Tyrogue, a Male only species so when discussing the Hitmons,
    we must do so from the Perspective of Tyrogue and not the Hitmons.

    I could imagine that Male-Only species reproduce, almost like a Retro-viral species,
    where that Pokemon's Genes are so dominate that it'd over-ride and rewrite the Genes of the Mother,
    Much like the opposite of how reproducing with a Ditto works,
    Which will rewrite it's own DNA to match that of the other Parent.

    (FYI, we're also talking about a Universe in which Children can literally be
    Genetic Clones of a Parent so a single Gender Species isn't that hard to imagine.

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