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  1. #46
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Silktree View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Weavile Warrior View Post
    Why on earth would they make another anime with another pikachu? That doesn't make sense. Many people would get confused whether the Pokémon Origins special is a part of the Pokémon Anime, which they won't want. I seriously doubt they would create Pikachu in another anime.
    That's some very shallow reasoning. Origin is separate from the regular anime regardless of whether or not Red has a Pikachu, which he does in the games. If he has a Pikachu, it won't be his starter, not will it follow him outside its Poké Ball.
    No ones saying its impossible it's just very unlikely. Doubt there will be a Meowth in the main cast either. I think they want to put as much room between Origins and the Real anime as possible, hence why they made Oak and Brock look so different as well. To have the main character with a Pikachu, I don't think would be a very good idea, it could happen I guess, I just think it's very unlikely as Pikachu is such an icon.

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    Legendary Pokemon クリスタル's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    This is the kind of anime I was hoping for Pokemon for a decade!! With a competent protagonist truly talented as being a Pokemon Trainer, with well-written appropriate adventurous plot and no slice-of-life nonsense slapstick, with a truly villainous antagonist await in the journey ahead!

    So excited, but yet disappointed that this is merely an anime special. I really wish this is not just a special, but a stand-alone anime on its own, with at least 13~26 episodes being air. And also wishes this was the "main canon anime" of Pokemon series. Men, why can't the current canon anime having the plot quality just like this special!?

    For the issue of Red having Pikachu or not, actually I hope he has one rather than not. But of course not being his starter, but a regular Pikachu he catches in the wild. That is because Pikachu had became almost like an icon for one of the handheld Pokemon for the protagonist(s) in the all sorts of works based on the RGB series. Red without a Pikachu just feels something lacking.

    I haven't watch Pokemon anime since middle of AG, with the exception of Movies. I'll definitely watch this special. And good thing is that I know Japanese. I'll just watch its raw version.
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by クリスタル View Post
    This is the kind of anime I was hoping for Pokemon for a decade!! With a competent protagonist truly talented as being a Pokemon Trainer, with well-written appropriate adventurous plot and no slice-of-life nonsense slapstick, with a truly villainous antagonist await in the journey ahead!

    ... Men, why can't the current canon anime having the plot quality just like this special!?[/SIZE]
    ... You can tell this all from that one-minute-and-a-bit preview, how? Or are you just projecting everything you want the anime to be onto this because it's not the anime and therefore must be better? :/

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    The animation looks solid. Having a special that is a much tighter adaption of the games would be a real treat. So would an ongoing series. Hopefully this sees a NA release with solid voice work. I want this to be successful. I want the Pokémon Company to know that this franchise can survive beyond Ash Ketchum, that kids can follow a new protagonist, a far more successful protagonist. Hopefully this means Red will act far more competent and evolve as a trainer, and actually win. Plus, I see Red is getting a Charmander, so this has already won me over.

    Going after my nostalgia, using my favorite gen, and my favorite Pokémon getting a more prominent role, that's a key to my heart.
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Quirky Circuit View Post
    I want this to be successful. I want the Pokémon Company to know that this franchise can survive beyond Ash Ketchum, that kids can follow a new protagonist, a far more successful protagonist.
    Can it? Because of course Pokemon Chronicles was a huge success without him. I agree I'd like to see him more competent, Johto and Sinnoh had it about right, but I don't want him to be in game good. The fact that a 10 year old child can go from complete beginner to greatest trainer in the region, in less than a year is a little mind baffling at best.

    Ash and Pikachu, ARE Pokemon, you can't have one without the other. I know in Japan the games came first, but in the UK, and probably the rest of Europe, (and probably the rest of the world) it was the cartoon that was the huge success and made people want to go out and buy the games. Still to this day, Ash and Pikachu are the most recongisable of the franchise. How many kids on the GTS name themselves Ash or Satoshi? He is still an icon.

    Just look at Digimon with that Tamer series, or Yugioh with what they are currently doing, they replaced the main characters, and the new seriess just don't pull in strong enough numbers, Digimon folded eventually, while Pokemon continues to soar, I think YUGIOH is still going, but not here in the UK, (well I dont know what channel its on if it is) and it's faded away if not died altogether.

    EDIT: Apparently Digimon is still lingering on too so maybe they can survive, just not have any level of success or exposure outside of Japan.
    Last edited by Genwunner; 17th August 2013 at 05:53 PM.

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post

    There's no need to be rude. You can't say my logic has failed as we don't know the answer yet. Of course Pikachu can appear in different media, they appear in the wild in almost every game, but in terms of the anime there is only one Pikachu anyone pays attention to, I'd be extremely surprised if this new Red had one, but like I said we won't know until it comes out.

    And Yellow is based off the anime for aspects to which you referring, Ash got a Pikachu, so Yellow got a Pikachu, Ash was able to get all 3 Kanto starters, so Yellow allowed you to get all 3 of the starters. Now whether for the Mt Silver battle they decided to get the idea straight from the anime, or the aspects of yellow that derived from the anime, either way the root of it is still the anime.

    Ash already had 1 water type in Blastoise but then they added Lapras, his iconic Pokemon from the Orange Islands which meant he had 2 water types. You are right that they are all ingame events in yellow, but it's a bit weird that in the remake out of all ingame events they only picked ones Ash owned, no Porygon, Eevee line was removed, no fossil Pokemon for example.
    Porygon is no more of an event than any of the other Game Corner Pokemon, and in HgSs where they removed gambling references in international releases, would have incredibly unfortunate implications of Red owning one. As for the fossils, you had to choose between Omanyte and Omastar and the only one that I can see him owning in his team is Aerodactyl (which they likely decided against since Lance had one). The Eevee line being removed also makes sense since it meant they didn't prefer one choice over another.

    The starters and Pikachu meant no version was preferred (even though it makes it look like Yellow), but combined with Blue's lack of starters/Eevee definitely points to Game Freak not trying to make a preference for any starter.

    The root can't possibly be the anime because we know where Red got that Lapras.

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    本物の神様 FANG-TAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Satoshi doesn't MAKE the Pokemon name. The POKEMON make the Pokemon franchise what it is. Otherwise Game Freak would have picked that up and kept Red as the main protagonist for subsequent releases and went with their original plan to name Red "Satoshi".

    He has his own anime. The people in charge of this (most likely Game Freak for scenario writing) should keep supposed complexes and formulas people think the anime has to follow 100% out of this particular anime adaptation, because otherwise it will suck because it's not given as much freedom as it should.

    Quote Originally Posted by Weavile Warrior View Post
    Why on earth would they make another anime with another pikachu? That doesn't make sense. Many people would get confused whether the Pokémon Origins special is a part of the Pokémon Anime, which they won't want. I seriously doubt they would create Pikachu in another anime.
    What kind of reasoning is this? It's a Pokemon owned by another trainer in a different world. It's obviously a different Pokemon that's just in the same species. That's like saying they shouldn't have made Origins in the first place simply because they're using more characters that are modeled off of the RBGYFRLG protagonist and rival, or that people would be confused about why Orchid and Takeshi are acting and looking different from the ones in the main show. Or why the Rocket Gang are still running around in the main anime even though they were disbanded here.

    The viewers aren't dumb. The kids aren't dumb. Why does the Pokemon fandom create logic like this with the viewers being dumb in mind in their favor? People will get confuse by that but not there being another Mewtwo in the 16th movie? I don't get it.

    All of Red's incarnations have had a Pikachu. He has just as much of a chance getting it as all of the other Reds. People don't get confused when they give other "Reds" a Pikachu in manga outside of the most popular ones (the Pocket Monsters gag series and Pocket Monsters Special). The same logic should apply to a different anime.
    Last edited by FANG-TAN; 17th August 2013 at 06:54 PM.

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  8. #53
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Outrage View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post

    There's no need to be rude. You can't say my logic has failed as we don't know the answer yet. Of course Pikachu can appear in different media, they appear in the wild in almost every game, but in terms of the anime there is only one Pikachu anyone pays attention to, I'd be extremely surprised if this new Red had one, but like I said we won't know until it comes out.

    And Yellow is based off the anime for aspects to which you referring, Ash got a Pikachu, so Yellow got a Pikachu, Ash was able to get all 3 Kanto starters, so Yellow allowed you to get all 3 of the starters. Now whether for the Mt Silver battle they decided to get the idea straight from the anime, or the aspects of yellow that derived from the anime, either way the root of it is still the anime.

    Ash already had 1 water type in Blastoise but then they added Lapras, his iconic Pokemon from the Orange Islands which meant he had 2 water types. You are right that they are all ingame events in yellow, but it's a bit weird that in the remake out of all ingame events they only picked ones Ash owned, no Porygon, Eevee line was removed, no fossil Pokemon for example.
    Porygon is no more of an event than any of the other Game Corner Pokemon, and in HgSs where they removed gambling references in international releases, would have incredibly unfortunate implications of Red owning one. As for the fossils, you had to choose between Omanyte and Omastar and the only one that I can see him owning in his team is Aerodactyl (which they likely decided against since Lance had one). The Eevee line being removed also makes sense since it meant they didn't prefer one choice over another.

    The starters and Pikachu meant no version was preferred (even though it makes it look like Yellow), but combined with Blue's lack of starters/Eevee definitely points to Game Freak not trying to make a preference for any starter.

    The root can't possibly be the anime because we know where Red got that Lapras.
    As far as I'm aware Red does not specifically say where he caught his Lapras, you are assuming it's the one given by Green in Silph Co.
    He has Pikachu and all 3 starters which is only possible in Pokemon yellow. The only reason it is possible in Pokemon yellow, is because those aspects come from the anime.
    They even went to the lengths of giving Pikachu the same moveset as it had in the anime at that time.

    Fang-tan would you seem to be confusing two arguments, one which is being made, one which isn't. You are arguing as if we are saying that it's impossible, what we are actually saying is that it is very unlikely. There is 1 Pikachu in the cartoon who is known to all and has never had his dominance threatened in the cartoon, yes plenty of Pikachu appear in the games, yes plenty of Pikachu probably appear in these comic books, but in terms of the cartoon, there has only been one Pikachu with any prominent role and that is Ash's.

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post

    As far as I'm aware Red does not specifically say where he caught his Lapras, you are assuming it's the one given by Green in Silph Co.
    It was given by the Silph Co. president, not your rival. It certainly wasn't caught in the Orange Islands. Occam's razor would suggest that the Lapras Red holds is the one he was handed rather than one he caught at Four Island or that he went on a journey to Johto and caught one at Union Cave. The other ones require much more assumptions on your part, especially when every other Pokemon Red has is either a starter or a forced encounter (e.g., Snorlax).

    I'm not saying it's not more heavily drawn from Yellow, but that Lapras isn't there just because of Orange Islands.

    Quote Originally Posted by FANG-TAN View Post

    The viewers aren't dumb.
    Obviously they are since people are canon-meshing everything together....though as far as I can tell from what you've told me, that's only in the Western fandom? So perhaps having this anime will confuse the 20+ year olds in the Western fandom who assumes all incarnations of Pokemon are in the same canon :P

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Outrage View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post

    As far as I'm aware Red does not specifically say where he caught his Lapras, you are assuming it's the one given by Green in Silph Co.
    It was given by the Silph Co. president, not your rival. It certainly wasn't caught in the Orange Islands. Occam's razor would suggest that the Lapras Red holds is the one he was handed rather than one he caught at Four Island or that he went on a journey to Johto and caught one at Union Cave. The other ones require much more assumptions on your part, especially when every other Pokemon Red has is either a starter or a forced encounter (e.g., Snorlax).

    I'm not saying it's more heavily drawn from Yellow, but that Lapras isn't there just because of Orange Islands.
    It is there because it was at one stage part of Ash's team, which all of the other people match at one point.

    *All of the Pokemon on that team Ash once owned, he even had them on his team at the same time, coincidence you say.

    *Well out of all the gift/forced encounters they could choose from they are all final forms of Ash's OI team, coincidence again you say.

    *Well originally they had an Espeon who wasnt on his team, but they replaced it with Lapras who was, isn't that a big hint, no coincidence again I hear you say.

    *The only game where this combination was possible was Pokemon Yellow which was based off the cartoon, don't you think that means it relates to the cartoon either directly or indirectly through yellow, no just another coincidence.

    *The Pikachu even has the exact same moveset as Ash's Pikachu, surely you're not saying that's... yep you guessed it, just another coincidence.

    How many coincidences does there have to be, for you to actually start to think, maybe all these coincidences aren't coincidences at all, but might actually be intended?

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    本物の神様 FANG-TAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post
    As far as I'm aware Red does not specifically say where he caught his Lapras, you are assuming it's the one given by Green in Silph Co.
    It's not an assumption if it actually happens in the games and can be taken to be what happens canonically.

    And Green doesn't give Red Lapras. A person from Silph gives Red the Lapras.

    He has Pikachu and all 3 starters which is only possible in Pokemon yellow. The only reason it is possible in Pokemon yellow, is because those aspects come from the anime.
    It wasn't a reference to Yellow. I mean, it *could* be. But for the most part, it was to keep any particular starter choice and version from being more canon than the other. Making Yellow canon would be acknowledging one optional choice over the other.

    And, for the record, Pikachu is considered a starter in Yellow. Thus they gave him Pikachu.

    They even went to the lengths of giving Pikachu the same moveset as it had in the anime at that time.
    Only in HGSS. In GSC, it was a generic moveset everyone gives to their friggin' Pikachu.

    Fang-tan would you seem to be confusing two arguments, one which is being made, one which isn't. You are arguing as if we are saying that it's impossible, what we are actually saying is that it is very unlikely. There is 1 Pikachu in the cartoon who is known to all and has never had his dominance threatened in the cartoon, yes plenty of Pikachu appear in the games, yes plenty of Pikachu probably appear in these comic books, but in terms of the cartoon, there has only been one Pikachu with any prominent role and that is Ash's.
    No, I'm just saying he's just as likely to have a Pikachu as any other Red including Satoshi.

    There has been many Pikachu that appeared in the Pokemon anime. There was a forest of wild Pikachu. Vincent had a Pikachu. Hiroshi had a Pikachu. Why is it suddenly confusing now that a character from a different world has a Pikachu? That's the last thing people would think is confusing. They would be more confused as to why these incarnations of the same characters are here and doing what they're doing.

    Even then, it's only because they've only ever green-lit Pokemon anime from one universe before Origins came around. They never had a chance to show another Red with another Pikachu unless you can't Hiroshi as a Red (which I don't). Now that we finally get another Pokemon canon in anime form, if Game Freak limits itself due to the regular anime, then that's friggin' stupid.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Outrage View Post
    Obviously they are since people are canon-meshing everything together....though as far as I can tell from what you've told me, that's only in the Western fandom? So perhaps having this anime will confuse the 20+ year olds in the Western fandom who assumes all incarnations of Pokemon are in the same canon :P
    Heh, I'm not gonna say it doesn't happen in the Japanese fandom... but it certainly happens in the Western fandom more often as much of the manga canons doesn't get exposed in the west.

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by FANG-TAN View Post
    He has Pikachu and all 3 starters which is only possible in Pokemon yellow. The only reason it is possible in Pokemon yellow, is because those aspects come from the anime.
    And, for the record, Pikachu is considered a starter in Yellow. Thus they gave him Pikachu.
    Pikachu is not "considered a starter" he is THE Starter. And why is he THE starter, because it's based off the cartoon. I think the Red in Mt Silver is based off the cartoon, you're saying it's based off the specific game which is based largely off the cartoon, thus not the cartoon, I don't understand???

    They even went to the lengths of giving Pikachu the same moveset as it had in the anime at that time.
    Only in HGSS. In GSC, it was a generic moveset everyone gives to their friggin' Pikachu.

    Probably because people didn't take the hint the first time and they had to make it more obvious, you are admitting yourself that they made a conscious decision to give him the same moveset as cartoon Pikachu and yet deny outright the possibility that Red's team is based off the cartoon.

    Fang-tan would you seem to be confusing two arguments, one which is being made, one which isn't. You are arguing as if we are saying that it's impossible, what we are actually saying is that it is very unlikely. There is 1 Pikachu in the cartoon who is known to all and has never had his dominance threatened in the cartoon, yes plenty of Pikachu appear in the games, yes plenty of Pikachu probably appear in these comic books, but in terms of the cartoon, there has only been one Pikachu with any prominent role and that is Ash's.
    No, I'm just saying he's just as likely to have a Pikachu as any other Red including Satoshi.

    There has been many Pikachu that appeared in the Pokemon anime. There was a forest of wild Pikachu. Vincent had a Pikachu. Hiroshi had a Pikachu. Why is it suddenly confusing now that a character from a different world has a Pikachu? That's the last thing people would think is confusing. They would be more confused as to why these incarnations of the same characters are here and doing what they're doing.
    I quite clearly said prominent role, I don't think some Pikachu in a forest in a one off episode is going to confuse people, and the examples you all listed were from the original series, lately, they have steered pretty clear of having additional Pikachu, because they know that Pikachu is like the sacred cow in the cartoon world.

    Even then, it's only because they've only ever green-lit Pokemon anime from one universe before Origins came around. They never had a chance to show another Red with another Pikachu unless you can't Hiroshi as a Red (which I don't). Now that we finally get another Pokemon canon in anime form, if Game Freak limits itself due to the regular anime, then that's friggin' stupid.
    It's not stupid, it's very likely, they don't like to mix the two. They can get away with Charizard, but everyone identifies Pikachu with Ash, so having another Pikachu running round, with a guy who's based on the same character as Ash is based, but is not Ash, traveling in the Pokemon World, meeting Brock and Oak, but they're not the Brock and Oak we know etc.

    I don't think we're going to settle this, we will just keep going round in circles and it's getting a little tiring. The only thing we can do is wait, for the series to air, you think it's likely Red will have a Pikachu in this series, I highly doubt it, we shall have to just wait and see.

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    My first thoughts on seeing the trailer: "Those character designs look weird". Sure, they're based more on Ken Sugimori's original illustrations but something feels off about them in motion. I'm personally not hyped for this at all; not because of the designs, but because nothing screams out to me that it will be anything more than what we already have.

    Also, I'm starting to grow concerned with just how much The Pokémon Company is focusing on nostalgia of previous generations in the run-up to XY's release - such as Mega Mewtwo being the Gen VI poster Pokémon in the latest movie, Mega Evolutions focusing on old Pokémon and now this - airing just under 2 weeks before XY's release. It's actually sorta damaging my faith in the games, like TPC are trying to say that they don't think XY have enough merit to do well on their own. Yeah, they're already selling like hotcakes on pre-orders and will no doubt sell well, but still...

    At the very least, an XY special should be airing then, not a Red/Green one.

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    本物の神様 FANG-TAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post
    Pikachu is not "considered a starter" he is THE Starter. And why is he THE starter, because it's based off the cartoon. I think the Red in Mt Silver is based off the cartoon, you're saying it's based off the specific game which is based largely off the cartoon, thus not the cartoon, I don't understand???
    No, it's considered "a" starter because he has three more starters on his team, and it's unknown which one is his actual starter.

    They gave him all the starters you can possibly receive in Gen I as to not make any version more right than the other. How hard is this for you to understand...?

    Probably because people didn't take the hint the first time and they had to make it more obvious, you are admitting yourself that they made a conscious decision to give him the same moveset as cartoon Pikachu and yet deny outright the possibility that Red's team is based off the cartoon.
    Its moveset in HGSS may be a minor reference to the anime and nothing more. Just because it's a reference doesn't mean it's based on the anime adaptation. That's like Takeshi saying he's a breeder in Yellow suddenly means the character himself is based on his anime version. What?

    I quite clearly said prominent role, I don't think some Pikachu in a forest in a one off episode is going to confuse people, and the examples you all listed were from the original series, lately, they have steered pretty clear of having additional Pikachu, because they know that Pikachu is like the sacred cow in the cartoon world.
    Or perhaps because they didn't need to focus on a Pikachu in the specific episode plots they wrote? Concept.

    And if they can do it without "confusing" people or breaking sacrilege in the original series, they can do it anywhere. Why does the current anime writers' "lack-of-sack" have to hinder these writers from doing whatever the hell they want?

    Aside from that, if Red was given a Pikachu in this anime, it's clearly not going to be his starter, which is already a less prominent role than Satoshi's Pikachu. Additional points for keeping it in its damn ball.

    It's not stupid, it's very likely, they don't like to mix the two. They can get away with Charizard, but everyone identifies Pikachu with Ash, so having another Pikachu running round, with a guy who's based on the same character as Ash is based, but is not Ash, traveling in the Pokemon World, meeting Brock and Oak, but they're not the Brock and Oak we know etc.
    And why would Red having a Pikachu make or break the confusion factor? That's like saying "I'm going to give this calculus problem to a grade schooler and confuse him, but this science problem? Nah, it would confuse him too much."

    If these writers take the anime's "formula" and viewership into consideration with everything they writes, it is stupid. It no longer has a chance to stand out from all of the other Pokemon adaptations because it's limited by the regular anime. Whereas the others aren't.

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    Default Re: Pocket Monsters: The Origin anime special to air Oct. ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genwunner View Post
    Pikachu is not "considered a starter" he is THE Starter. And why is he THE starter, because it's based off the cartoon. I think the Red in Mt Silver is based off the cartoon, you're saying it's based off the specific game which is based largely off the cartoon, thus not the cartoon, I don't understand???
    Possibly because it stopped being based on it before Cinnabar Island if Blaine's team is at all indicative.

    Though I will admit that GSC and by extension its remakes does take cues from the anime since GSC Blaine has a Magmar and Misty says she wants to travel, but I still maintain that they aren't exclusively based on any one in particular.
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshawott View Post

    Also, I'm starting to grow concerned with just how much The Pokémon Company is focusing on nostalgia of previous generations in the run-up to XY's release - such as Mega Mewtwo being the Gen VI poster Pokémon in the latest movie, Mega Evolutions focusing on old Pokémon and now this - airing just under 2 weeks before XY's release. It's actually sorta damaging my faith in the games, like TPC are trying to say that they don't think XY have enough merit to do well on their own. Yeah, they're already selling like hotcakes on pre-orders and will no doubt sell well, but still...
    Red's known as a Legendary Trainer in-game (as evidenced by the man-in-black at PWT) and that's not explained. Mewtwo's origins are not explained, and why Giovanni goes from his usual M.O. of making money through Pokemon trafficking and money laundering to outright taking over a city for a Master ball despite having spies at Silph Co. is not explained. Nor is Mega Evolutions. I think they're all related.

    For instance, I think that Giovanni knows about Mewtwo's existence and may have learned from it from one of his agents (we know they encountered Fuji, and perhaps they learned it from the Pokemon Mansion). Now of course, Giovanni has spies at Silph Co., so why take over the company for a Master ball when he could have waited for the plans and mass produced his own?

    Well there's an email message that indicates that a research team was setting out on an expedition to the cave:

    There’s an e-mail message.

    … … …

    There are three legendary bird POKéMON.

    They are ARTICUNO, ZAPDOS, and MOLTRES.

    Their whereabouts are unknown.

    We plan to explore the cavern close to CERULEAN.

    From: POKéMON RESEARCH TEAM…
    (I forget which game this was, I took the quote from @Silktree;)

    Perhaps Giovanni felt that having the research team discover Mewtwo first would hinder his plans (which in HgSs was actually revealed to be world domination) and was forced to take a more direct approach at obtaining the Master Ball.

    Then we have scenes from The Origin which includes a scene in a cave and what seems to be a rainbow aura and Red holding a round item....and apparently the official site mentions Red fighting an unknown Pokemon after defeating Giovanni.

    I'd say it's Mewtwo and during his fight, he and his Charizard were the first to create a (natural) Mega Stone from their bond with each other and Mega Evolve. The research team, being there, observed this and went to work and created many artificial Mega Stones which are now used in Kalos today, making Mega Evolution more accessible (much like how Pokeballs made Pokemon training more accessible). It is Red's achievement in Mega Evolution that makes him a legendary trainer.

    It would be nice for them to tie events together without having to actually shove Gen I into the games. I think this is a nice compromise if that's the route they take.

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