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Thread: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

  1. #121

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Okay, as much as I disagree with you on the story being "bad," I will admit that I wish Kusaka would take more of his time in writing the series. The reason for that is because the magazines that release each chapter often push for him to end the arc as soon as possible when a new generation of Pokemon has begun.

    Plus, to me and many others, it's at least better than the Anime where they REALLY take their time and pad out the series with useless stories that usually have the same damn formula. You know the one...
    May I ask why you disagree? In terms of GSC, it was a mess of a plot. And I know all about the publishers rushing Kusaka (though I don't know if that has been happening from the beginning or is just recent), though that's hardly an excuse to excuse some of the quality in PokeSpe.

    I agree that they pad it way too much; pure laziness at its finest. I wouldn't mind a slow pace if things were actually happening to grant that slowness. There is no doubt that the anime is worse all around compared to PokeSpe. I would much rather read PokeSpe and facepalm at the problems than suffer through the anime, but at the same time both still suffer from similar problems at times.

    YamiiDenryuu provides a good point; PokeSpe's problems to tend to stick more since it's supposed to make sense and work as a story. I think PokeSpe's problem is that it's trying to be a epic plot rather than a epic story and it takes more than a plot to tell such a story.

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Okay, I can clearly tell that nothing about Pokemon Special is going to impress you so I'm not going to bother trying to "prove you wrong." But I will say this:

    Say what you will about PokeSpe’s story but whether you think its bad or good, you have to admit that it seems like Hidenori Kusaka actually seems to give more of a damn about storytelling than the Anime ever has or would. PokeSpe at least doesn’t try to pad the series with useless filler chapters that show NO EFFORT what so ever or fill it all with CoTDs that amount to nothing. And the characters actually age, develop and DON'T reset themselves every new region. Thought that's due to the fact that each new region has a new cast of characters. Sure, it can seem like it’s going too fast but it at least has a plot, one with much more substance, unlike the Pokemon Anime. Plus, it can be very clever and less asspull-ish (with exceptions) than the Anime.
    I agree, buuuut....

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    And the characters actually age, develop and DON'T reset themselves every new region.
    I don't know about this. The development seems to quite sparse and it seems like little comes of it if it does happen or loads of it happens off panel.
    Last edited by Sakarii; 3rd February 2012 at 06:34 PM.
    "You're a true Samurai, being loyal to such a stupid Master." -Seijuro Hiko

  2. #122

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by Sakarii View Post
    May I ask why you disagree? In terms of GSC, it was a mess of a plot. And I know all about the publishers rushing Kusaka (though I don't know if that has been happening from the beginning or is just recent), though that's hardly an excuse to excuse some of the quality in PokeSpe.

    YamiiDenryuu provides a good point; PokeSpe's problems to tend to stick more since it's supposed to make sense and work as a story. I think PokeSpe's problem is that it's trying to be a epic plot rather than a epic story and it takes more than a plot to tell such a story.

    I don't know about this. The only character I can think of, off the top of my head, that developed was Blue in GSC and her curing her bird phobia.
    The GSC arc is actually my favorite one so far. Yeah, I wish Kusaka took his time rather than breezing through most of Johto but I love how everything in the plot was set up and all the twists I never saw coming. I'm also impressed at how Kusaka set things up as far back at the RGB arc like with Blue (Green) and Silver. I'm sure he didn't really fully plan things out but lucky for him, he left certain things unexplained to pull off a fairly neat addition retcon, something he really likes apparently. I also like how Gold and Silver went M.I.A. before Crystal (one of my favorite female characters) came along. I was very curious as to what happened to the two and what this was all leading up to. The Mask Of Ice's past and pain could've been elaborated better so we'd know what exactly drove him to become evil though. Plus, I love how Gold thought Bugsy was a girl like all of us when we played Gold, Silver and Crystal.

    While the plot might not be "great" to you and Yami, I can enjoy for what it's worth and honestly, I can overlook certain things for my entertainment.

    Okay, I'm just going to come out and admit it: The main reason I disagree with you is because I've been reading Pokemon Special since Viz started re-releasing them and I really like the series. As such, I don't want to feel like I've been reading utter crap this whole time (not that I thought it to be perfect to begin with) and defending a series that I've come to adore for so long. It's hard to accept how flawed a series you thought to be great is and I feel like I'm an idiot with zero taste. I'm basically confused: I know that you guys bring up good points but at the same time, I continue to read Pokemon Special and like it. I just don't know whether to still love it or start to despise it.

    By developed, I mostly mean in how the characters have more to their personalities than Ash and co. on the Anime (most of the time). But the Dex Holders and everyone else tend to change overtime. Red grows up into a mature young man, Green (Blue) even smiles with Chuck, his old master, after being Mr. Serious Business for a while and there is more. Red and Green even grow as trainers during their first journey, absorbing each other's wits and talents in their past encounters. It's kinda subtle.

  3. #123

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Come to think of it, Yami, do you actually like the Anime? I mean, if you don't like PokeSpe, surely you know that the Anime is much worse in many respects, right?
    So the anime being worse than Special is a fact now and not someone's opinion. Yeah, here's the thing, the anime might be "worse" than Special at something it's not even trying to be good at, it's still succeeding at what it's really trying to be: a lighthearted and charming kids show. If you're expecting something different than that out of it, of course you're not going to like it.

    Special, meanwhile, seems to have gained itself a fandom based on being a plot- and character-focused Pokemon series, but the thing is, its plotting and character development aren't even all that good. Yeah, the characters change over time, but they're really nothing too interesting to begin with (or end with). They're just basic character archetypes for the most part, not that much deeper than the anime's characters, except in this case they get brought up to the forefront and made out to be the most important people in the Pokemon world instead of just some kids on a journey. And the plot spends way too much time clinging to the game's storylines without bringing any really original developments into play. What events it does come up with tend to be clumsily inserted into the plotline without any foreshadowing - the legendary evolution stones, Koga's Arbok turning out to have magic regenerating powers when we thought it was dead for like three volumes, White's Tepig suddenly deciding it likes battling and ditching her over it (and White apparently being the one in the wrong for this), the entire hard left turn the GSC arc took when Gold and Silver ended up under a pile of rocks and we jumped to Crystal's story... Yeah, sometimes we get things after the fact pointed out as foreshadowing, but that just makes it feel like a retcon and really shows how badly set up those all were. The fans like Special for what it does, but it does it rather horribly.

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Okay, I'm just going to come out and admit it: The main reason I disagree with you is because I've been reading Pokemon Special since Viz started re-releasing them and I really like the series. As such, I don't want to feel like I've been reading utter crap this whole time (not that I thought it to be perfect to begin with) and defending a series that I've come to adore for so long. It's hard to accept how flawed a series you thought to be great is and I feel like I'm an idiot with zero taste. I'm basically confused: I know that you guys bring up good points but at the same time, I continue to read Pokemon Special and like it. I just don't know whether to still love it or start to despise it.
    ... So you don't even like it that much. Huh.

    Well, I'll tell you what: Just enjoy how bad it is, and maybe have fun bitching about it. Like me. Join the dark side, Matt!

    No, actually, I'm kidding. You can keep liking something even if you admit it has flaws. Hell, even I'll admit the anime could be better (although some of the fan hatred towards it is still completely unwarranted... it's just a kids' show, guys).

  4. #124

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    While the Anime might be a kids show, it doesn't excuse the constant mistakes they make and the often bland and repeated story formulas that come off as if they can't give less of a crap and it gets on fans' nerves. I don't mind it being lighthearted and such but the storytelling REALLY need a major touch up or two. After all, a well-written kids show is NOT outside the realms of possibility and using the "it's for kids" excuse leads to the laziness and bad writing that is shown in Pokemon and other kids shows/movies that make them wastes of time and money.

    Hell, there are a lot of Anime that were aimed for kids and well written (especially back in the day). Believe it or not, Gundam has been aimed at kids since the very first series and its considered (at least, during Tomino's involvement) to be VERY well written, especially since it was very realistic at the time for a Mecha Anime. Now I don't expect Pokemon to be as great as Gundam or even Macross/Robotech but I do want it to be enjoyable and have good, perhaps clever, writing that makes me think: "Hey, this is pretty cool" and takes me on one helluva ride (it does have action).

    So, yeah. I don't expect too much from the Anime but I DO wish that they'd put more elbow grease into writing the series.

    And yeah, I did kinda jump the gun in claiming the Anime is worse than PokeSpe as if it was factual. Yeah, it's all up to opinion but I can't see how the Anime could be better than PokeSpe in storytelling at all. Maybe in some aspects but definitely not storytelling. The two series both have their flaws in their stories but PokeSpe rubs off on me as if Kusaka is actually putting actual thought and effort into the plot and stories unlike the Anime. It might not be "great" but there WAS effort put into Special. And I really respect it for that.

    BTW, I really hope that I don't offend you but I have to point something out: I feel as though you and other naysayers of PokeSpe are looking down on fans of the series, wondering how anyone could like such "tripe" and feel the complete opposite about it all. I know that's not true since you said that anyone can like anything even if they know said thing is flawed but I always get that impression that you haters view us as complete morons with zero taste. Though that would apply to Spidey7...

    I guess I feel like I'm being insulted in a subtle way. Once again, no offense.

  5. #125

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    BTW, I really hope that I don't offend you but I have to point something out: I feel as though you and other naysayers of PokeSpe are looking down on fans of the series, wondering how anyone could like such "tripe" and feel the complete opposite about it all. I know that's not true since you said that anyone can like anything even if they know said thing is flawed but I always get that impression that you haters view us as complete morons with zero taste. Though that would apply to Spidey7...

    I guess I feel like I'm being insulted in a subtle way. Once again, no offense.
    That's called having someone disagree with you. I'm trying to be civil and just keep this to an impersonal debate, and I'm pretty sure I (and Spidey, for that matter) haven't done anything to attack you personally, though if I slipped up somewhere I'm very sorry. You can say we're looking down on you when we start doing whatever the equivalent of calling Ash "Ass" is for Pokespe. :P

    And yeah, I can't honestly say I feel Kusaka has put that much effort into the series, but hey, opinions.

  6. #126

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    No one's insulting anyone here. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion on the series and it's not a personal attack in any way. Don't take the fact that someone disagrees with you personally.


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  7. #127

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    I meant in a sort of subtle way but I know that you weren't at all.

    Also Kusaka actually seems like he's trying to write a good series and putting a good amount of effort into it. He may be failing in your opinion but to me, he comes off like a big fan of the Pokemon games who wants to write a story based on them. I once heard that the writers for the Pokemon Anime don't play the games personally and aren't suppose to. Again, I heard so I'm not sure. In fact, I view it like this:

    The writers for the Pokemon Anime: (Couldn't give less of a crap about their job) God, this job is so tedious. Let's just reuse this story and get this over with. It's not like anyone cares about good storytelling in Pokemon.

    Kusaka: The Pokemon games are so amazing and inspiring. I think I'll write my own Manga based on this. This ought to be fun.

    Yeah, I might be exaggerating and not be right but, you know, opinions.

    No one's insulting anyone here. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion on the series and it's not a personal attack in any way. Don't take the fact that someone disagrees with you personally.
    Yes, I know that.

  8. #128

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    That's... really dismissive of the anime writers, and they really don't reuse plots as often as that implies. And given that the anime is kind of written to promote the games, the fact that the story often goes beyond what happens/can be done in the games, not by just ignoring game mechanics (though they do do that... the again, a lot of those mechanics don't really work that well outside of the games) but through things like deepening the interactions between Pokemon and trainers or coming up with stories to showcase a certain Pokemon or feature of the games when something less than that would suffice for promotion tell me that they do put some effort into their work.

    As a case in point, there's those three recent episodes that were written to go with some ads for Pokepark that were subsequently moved up to go with the game being released earlier - the photography episode (advertising some sort of camera feature), the Musical episode (advertising the equivalent of Musicals in Pokepark, though they made it more similar to the thing in the main games), and the Gothita episode (I honestly have no idea what this one was for, but it was moved up with the others and had an ad with it, so... yeah). The writers took just those features and managed to wrap them up in a story: the photography episode had a guy out to fulfill a dream of photographing all of Sawsbuck's forms at once, the Musical episode focused on a guy trying to work with his Pokemon to perform in a musical, the Gothita epsiode had that whole thing with Koharu being bossed around by her Pokemon. None of them are entirely defined by the feature they're promoting or are limited to how that feature works in the game.

    Pokespe, on the other hand, has no obligations to fill regarding advertising the games, but still doesn't really go too far from the game's plot, even though it could go as far as it wants to. It's great that Kusaka's a fan and all, but I'm not really sure "effort" is exactly the word I'd use here.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Okay, the Anime's stories aren't all bad. I do like how it shows Pokemon and their Trainers interacting better than in Special and most of the time, it's pretty nice to see. And it would be even more so if we had more episodes that showed the Pokemon training and not just learning moves and evolving whenever the writers feel like it. It's that aspect that they definitely put a decent amount of effort into when they're not making things totally predictable like the typical rebellious Pokemon that grows to like his/her Trainer after he/she beats Team Rocket to save the Pokemon. Seen it.

    Sure, they referenced a few things in other games like Pokepark but with the exception of the Gothita episode, the Musical episode and the photographer episode weren't episodes to write home about in terms of story. In fact, one of the problems with the CoTD stories is that their impact on the overall series was zilch and we could've had Ash and co. do something that would help develop their characters but no, we have to help out people who we'll never see again. It wouldn't be so bad if there weren't so many of them, especially in Johto. Everytime I watch a new CoTD episode, I think: "Ugh, again?!" or "gee, I wonder how this will turn out?" sarcastically. There are good episodes that shine brighter than the rest but they're a dime a dozen, if you ask me. And don't even get me started on the dialogue from TPCi...

    PokeSpe has characters that stood out to me in terms of Pokemon, especially in comparison with Ash and co. While they may be achetypical, when I read them, they had personality traits that I never expected to see in Pokemon, especially from the good guys. Gold was a delinquent, Juniper lost her temper at times and that's just to name a few.

  10. #130

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    How exactly does the anime handle worldbuilding, anyway?

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    Claimed Volcarona on 03/04/12.

  11. #131

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    The GSC arc is actually my favorite one so far. Yeah, I wish Kusaka took his time rather than breezing through most of Johto but I love how everything in the plot was set up and all the twists I never saw coming. I'm also impressed at how Kusaka set things up as far back at the RGB arc like with Blue (Green) and Silver. I'm sure he didn't really fully plan things out but lucky for him, he left certain things unexplained to pull off a fairly neat addition retcon, something he really likes apparently. I also like how Gold and Silver went M.I.A. before Crystal (one of my favorite female characters) came along. I was very curious as to what happened to the two and what this was all leading up to. The Mask Of Ice's past and pain could've been elaborated better so we'd know what exactly drove him to become evil though. Plus, I love how Gold thought Bugsy was a girl like all of us when we played Gold, Silver and Crystal.

    While the plot might not be "great" to you and Yami, I can enjoy for what it's worth and honestly, I can overlook certain things for my entertainment.

    Okay, I'm just going to come out and admit it: The main reason I disagree with you is because I've been reading Pokemon Special since Viz started re-releasing them and I really like the series. As such, I don't want to feel like I've been reading utter crap this whole time (not that I thought it to be perfect to begin with) and defending a series that I've come to adore for so long. It's hard to accept how flawed a series you thought to be great is and I feel like I'm an idiot with zero taste. I'm basically confused: I know that you guys bring up good points but at the same time, I continue to read Pokemon Special and like it. I just don't know whether to still love it or start to despise it.

    By developed, I mostly mean in how the characters have more to their personalities than Ash and co. on the Anime (most of the time). But the Dex Holders and everyone else tend to change overtime. Red grows up into a mature young man, Green (Blue) even smiles with Chuck, his old master, after being Mr. Serious Business for a while and there is more. Red and Green even grow as trainers during their first journey, absorbing each other's wits and talents in their past encounters. It's kinda subtle.
    I see. I looked over the first volume of the GSC arc and it had a lot more going on than I remember. I think GSC may be a classic example of a good beginning, but a weak end. I'm not sure if he actually set things up that far back (was the GSC games even out when he was doing RGBY?), but it isn't a good thing if he likes relying on retcons... Speaking of which, what retcon are you talking about? I don't remember any but RS'... I really do need to reread GSC one day. Agreed, I also like Kusaka's tidbits he adds since it makes him feels like a player like us.

    I can do the same, but I'm very character-driven and PokeSpe has a hard time juggling its dark plot and the characters to the point where plot > characters at times. So, I have a hard time ignoring the lack of depth of the characters when the plot is too busy hogging everything.

    Sorry to say it, but I've been reading (sort of) before Viz starting to re-release it. I really like RGB when I read it years ago, but it doesn't hold up as much anymore when I started to reread as I got involved with the fandom (hardly read after the first time). So, I think it's okay to like and continue to read PokeSpe even when it is as flawed as it is if it did improve in DP and BW as everyone says. I still do; I just don't like coddling it like other fans do (not you, per say). You don't have zero taste since you've showed you don't think it's a flawless or better than any other manga. Those fans would have zero taste. xD

    But, it's also easy to have more personality than Satoshi and friends (especially Satoshi who practically is a blank slate), but at the same time nothing much is done with PokeSpe's personalities unless needed for the plot or comedy most of the time. It's sorta like: Is it still a good thing that characters develop if we (almost) never see it?

    With Red, you said he grows up into a mature young man, but when exactly did this happen? It could of happened in Yellow, but the Red in FRLG seems even more mature than the Red in GSC, so what made him continue to develop? One or two events? His friends? When did it happen? (I could have completely forgotten it, so if I did please do scold me.) Red, sadly, is one of the characters that we probably know next to nothing about beyond a few things. Same thing with Green; I don't remember Green developing at all other than him going from somewhat serious to Srs Bzns. (What the heck is up with that anyways? Isn't that going backwards? not that I mind...) Smiling is hardly development; I couldn't see why he wouldn't smile as Shijima/Chuck. And I believe that growth was told through exposition; they hardly interacted enough in RGB(Y?) to develop off each other and suddenly they're great friends. Heck, I remember reading in FRLG that they had come back from training together and all I could think was, "Why on Earth didn't you show any of that?!". I personally believe Red and Green's rivalry barely had time to develop into friendship and I dislike that Kusaka couldn't even give them a friendly rivalry.

    And as of now, I think that off panel development happens to other characters as well. HGSS could change some of that, but from what was given, I doubt it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saiga View Post
    How exactly does the anime handle worldbuilding, anyway?
    I don't know about Best Wishes, but the anime does/did showcase the mains going through the region. We "see" what the world is like as a trainer; going through woods (and more woods...) and the routes, seeing the cities/towns and its people. Well, it isn't done really amazingly, one can feel like they know about the Pokemon World better in the anime. The places aren't just there to be there, but that does lead to many CotDs. At least that's how I saw it.
    Last edited by Sakarii; 4th February 2012 at 06:42 AM.
    "You're a true Samurai, being loyal to such a stupid Master." -Seijuro Hiko

  12. #132

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    But wait, by the end of the RGB chapter, Red and Green appeared to respect each other after their battle. They didn't mock each other or anything so I'd say that's close to being friends if not on the way. Hell, Green helped look for Red and defeat the Elite Four. While he still came off as no-nonsense, he did seem as thought he wasn't as uptight as before. At least, that's the implication I got.

    one can feel like they know about the Pokemon World better in the anime.
    More like their own Pokemon World. There are different regions, different locations in the regions from the games and more. Hell, I wonder where half the Anime-Exclusive locations are on the map since all the regions appear to be much smaller on the Map in the Anime and the games. For me, it's a bit confusing.

  13. #133

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    I'm also impressed at how Kusaka set things up as far back at the RGB arc like with Blue (Green) and Silver. I'm sure he didn't really fully plan things out but lucky for him, he left certain things unexplained to pull off a fairly neat addition retcon, something he really likes apparently.
    I wouldn't say he likes to pull retcons. A retcon means he is going against something already established, and it usually is used negatively. And if memory serves, it was always just a case of him not previously explaining something but then finally explaining it with some neat, unexpected twists. Which is a good thing, and something I love about Special as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sakarii View Post
    I'm not sure if he actually set things up that far back (was the GSC games even out when he was doing RGBY?), but it isn't a good thing if he likes relying on retcons... Speaking of which, what retcon are you talking about? I don't remember any but RS'...
    Gold and Silver were out during the release of the last two volumes of the Yelllow arc. Now, I'm not sure where the magazines were at when they first came out, but the last two volumes came out after them so at the very least, it might have been a magazine-chapter-to-volume-release change. But nah, I doubt he sets things up that far back, but it is interesting how some things he did before end up working out with something the games did and that he can add different things than you were expecting to stuff. (none of which are retcons, by the way, so it's not a bad thing) And out of curiosity, what retcon do you remember from RS?
    Last edited by 1dbad; 4th February 2012 at 09:48 AM.

  14. #134

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Actually, a retcon doesn't only mean that a later event in a story goes against something previous establish in a bad way. There are addition retcons that are pulled off in very neat twists and can actually make sense. Akira Toriyama was famous for this when writing Dragon Ball (Z) since Goku being a Saiyan and Piccolo/Kami being a Namekian was thought up when planning the Saiyan Saga. Hell, Freeza and his empire hadn't been thought up until later on since Raditz says that Saiyan pirate planets and there's no mention of Freeza's other soldiers. Though that could be accounted for his Saiyan pride and boastfulness.

    In the case of PokeSpe, the addition retcons worked wonders many time with Sird of Team Galactic being the biggest one of all since she was in the FRLG saga way before Diamond & Pearl came out.

  15. #135

    Default Re: Overall honest opinions of Pokemon Adventures/Special

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    But wait, by the end of the RGB chapter, Red and Green appeared to respect each other after their battle. They didn't mock each other or anything so I'd say that's close to being friends if not on the way. Hell, Green helped look for Red and defeat the Elite Four. While he still came off as no-nonsense, he did seem as thought he wasn't as uptight as before. At least, that's the implication I got.

    More like their own Pokemon World. There are different regions, different locations in the regions from the games and more. Hell, I wonder where half the Anime-Exclusive locations are on the map since all the regions appear to be much smaller on the Map in the Anime and the games. For me, it's a bit confusing.
    Yeah, I agree that they did respect each other by the end, but it would of still of been interesting to see that develop more. Just going off his expressions in RGB every arc after, especially Yamamoto's, made him seem more uptight; he probably is less uptight (I'm remembering a few relaxed moments he had in FRLG) it's just that the later arcs' art doesn't make it seem like he did.

    Well, the anime's Pokemon World is certainly better than PokeSpe's. And doesn't the anime show most, if not all of the locations from each region that's in the game? Well, someone used the map for Kantou and put all the anime locations on it. Though, either way, half of the anime-exclusive locations are useless so it's probably not worth getting confused over.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1dbad View Post
    Gold and Silver were out during the release of the last two volumes of the Yelllow arc. Now, I'm not sure where the magazines were at when they first came out, but the last two volumes came out after them so at the very least, it might have been a magazine-chapter-to-volume-release change. But nah, I doubt he sets things up that far back, but it is interesting how some things he did before end up working out with something the games did and that he can add different things than you were expecting to stuff. (none of which are retcons, by the way, so it's not a bad thing) And out of curiosity, what retcon do you remember from RS?
    Hmm, I see. Then chances are Kusaka was somewhere between RGB and Yellow (magazine) when the games come out, but a magazine-to-volume change is probably the more possible answer. I have to agree with that; he has some good luck that his stuff worked so well. I was thinking of the whole Celebi thing, but I realize that wasn't a retcon, but more like an Ass Pull and I wasn't thinking then. Sorry about that!

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    In the case of PokeSpe, the addition retcons worked wonders many time with Sird of Team Galactic being the biggest one of all since she was in the FRLG saga way before Diamond & Pearl came out.
    Would Saque actually count, though? I always thought it was more of "I'll explain it later, trust me?" rather than an addition. I mean, Kusaka kept her alive at the end of FRLG rather than have her be seemingly "dead".
    "You're a true Samurai, being loyal to such a stupid Master." -Seijuro Hiko

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