Thread: Will Ash battle Drayden?

We can speculate and go back-and-forth all we want, but the way TPTB have been over the years, I don't think we can say anything with any degree of certainty. Just because he's in the opening theme sequence doesn't mean squat.

I think there's a chance of Ash battling Drayden, but after the league is over, because there's really not a logical reason for him to appear in the anime at this point. I think Drayden's appearance will possibly be the writer's reason for writing Iris off the show once it's time for new traveling companions.

Still keeping my hopes up that he will, but I don't think its very likely now.

Originally Posted by Chiplet

In this case, I really couldn't care less about how much the characters train or not, when the victory won't serve as of any purpose but making the other character, who actually has some story background to this whole encounter and battle, look bad (that is if Iris loses while Ash wins).

I think that looking bad can serve a purpose, especially if through Satoshi and Shaga's battle, Iris realizes something that there's something wrong with the way she's training her Pokémon. I think there's oodles of potential in a storyline like that because there's many ways to turn that scenario into development for Iris while at the same time establishing Satoshi as a threat. Two birds, one stone.

I've followed him in every episode, and I know what he's capable of doing

He's shown to be able to all but lose to the eighth gym leader and lose against Iris, Masaomi and Shooti in tournaments,

This battle was meant for Iris.

Actually, I would prefer none of them battle Shaga, but that we rather see Bel or Cabernet earn a badge here. XD No seriously, we all know Iris is going to battle Shaga, it'll be rushed, it'll have minimal impact on her character because the writers again won't want to pull a break the haughty or actually show Iris needing to do anything different, not learn anything. Shaga'll beat her, wet himself about how gloriously overflowing with potential she is, suggest she should stay to become his apprentice, she'll decline for the moment, but will nonetheless end up there at the end of BW2. The end. What I think will happen is that Satoshi won't battle Shaga, because why actually give some screen time to his Pokémon, where we can see their personality and root for them in the League when they can just show up there like the bland boring battling machines most of them are, evolve to pull Satoshi out of trouble again?

I don't know, but he should...

Seeing as some of Ash's pokemon look like pushovers (Unfezant) they could use a good battle against someone like Drayden.

Who is saying Iris will battle Dray? She only battles in tournaments. xD

I would like to see Satoshi battle Shaga on the grounds that he knows that this was who Iris lost her 100th battle to all that time ago. By no means would it be to avenge Iris or anything like that, just in the Satoshi sense of "oh wow he must be a really strong trainer then!" It wouldn't have to be for a badge, just for the challenge.

Either way, I'd like to see Shaga make a legitimate anime appearance outside of a flashback.

May be , Drayden see Ash defecting someone using Krookodile & become impress with Krookodile Power So he challenge Ash & his Krookodile a battle against his Haxorus !

I don't think Ash will battle Drayden. I assume Iris, or Trip or Georgia will battle him.

There's no necessity for him to do so now, but I wouldn't rule it out. I fully expect Drayden to battle Iris again though.

Honestly , I'm not even interested in seeing Drayden!
I just want Ash's Pokemon to develop quickly and Unova League to start as soon as possible!
Drayden seem nothing more then a waste of time to me .
I don't care if Ash battle Drayden or Not unless it develop Ash and redeem him.
Because , Now Ash is looking like the most pathetic Protagonist !
WTJC has completely ruined Ash.

Again, there's no point in Iris battling Drayden. Ash battling him would make far more sense, people.

Originally Posted by Hurricane Kishore

Honestly , I'm not even interested in seeing Drayden!
I just want Ash's Pokemon to develop quickly and Unova League to start as soon as possible!
Drayden seem nothing more then a waste of time to me .
I don't care if Ash battle Drayden or Not unless it develop Ash and redeem him.
Because , Now Ash is looking like the most pathetic Protagonist !
WTJC has completely ruined Ash.

Um.

Originally Posted by Hellion

I think that looking bad can serve a purpose, especially if through Satoshi and Shaga's battle, Iris realizes something that there's something wrong with the way she's training her Pokémon. I think there's oodles of potential in a storyline like that because there's many ways to turn that scenario into development for Iris while at the same time establishing Satoshi as a threat. Two birds, one stone.

How, exactly, would she realize that there's something wrong with her way of training her Pokémon when we as of yet even hasn't seen enough to be able to judge it as bad? I mean, Ash is pretty much the only one we've seen doing training, neither Iris or Cilan have, except for maybe a few instances when we've seen them helping Ash out in his training, or that short clip we got in the Onix episode. Are we just going to assume that the training she's doing off-screen is automatically bad?

So, only having Ash beat Drayden will suddenly establish him as a threat? Ash is already a threat in my opinion. Naturally, it'd be nice seeing him challenge Drayden too, and maybe it'd be way better if he actually managed to beat Drayden, since he is a Gym Leader, and since Ash also is on his way to the League, but regardless if he wins or not he'll still be the same Ash in my eyes. I certainly won't consider him to be any stronger than I already knew he was.

He's shown to be able to all but lose to the eighth gym leader and lose against Iris, Masaomi and Shooti in tournaments.

So, his losses against Iris, Masaomi AND Trip made him look weak, or what? Well, in his battle against Iris, he had Pikachu nearly beat Iris and Excadrill, despite the fact that it only was able to use two moves that both were not very effective. In his battle against Masaomi, he used Scraggy. Once again, the typing was not in his favor, but Scraggy had been established to still going through training in order to reach higher levels, while Throh had been established to be extremely powerful, beating a Mienshao and Excadrill without getting hit by a single move. And Trip is powerful too. That Serperior might have been overgloryfied, but it was able to beat two Fire-types and as well beat Cilan's Crustle, which surely is Cilan's strongest Pokémon. Ash still managed to hold his grounds for longer than any of Trip's previous opponents, so I really wouldn't say that those losses made him look weak.

Actually, I would prefer none of them battle Shaga, but that we rather see Bel or Cabernet earn a badge here. XD

Okay. Cool, I guess. I'd totally want to see Bianca earn a badge here, but I don't even think Burgundy is going to participate in the League.

No seriously, we all know Iris is going to battle Shaga, it'll be rushed, it'll have minimal impact on her character because the writers again won't want to pull a break the haughty or actually show Iris needing to do anything different, not learn anything.

I know Iris is going to battle Drayden, but I have no idea about the rest. But, I guess that's what you're hoping for to see, right? Personally, I'm hoping for the opposite, and even though there's a high chance of the battle being rushed if it'll be put in together with the episode that Ash & Gang encounter Drayden (I doubt they'll make a whole arc out of it, I mean, she's just a sidekick character) I still think that it'll have a huge influence over her character for the future. I'd probably follow the stream and say that Iris will be taken as Drayden's apprentice.

Shaga'll beat her, wet himself about how gloriously overflowing with potential she is, suggest she should stay to become his apprentice, she'll decline for the moment, but will nonetheless end up there at the end of BW2. The end.

To be honest, I don't think Drayden will praise Iris that much more than saying ''you still got potential bla bla bla''. I mean, there must be a reason to why Iris didn't want to go to Opelucid Gym, right? We did see in Ash's battle against Brycen how she immediately felt somewhat insecure as soon as Brycen mentioned Opelucid City, and how she got overjoyed as Nurse Joy informed the gang that the Gym was closed. He'll definitely compliment her in some way, we all know that, but I don't think he'll be so pleased after he has seen her progress with Axew.

Originally Posted by Chiplet

Are we just going to assume that the training she's doing off-screen is automatically bad?

Not necessarily her training, but her approach to dragons, to battles, any kind of flaw will do. If the defeat doesn't confront her, then there's no story there at all, which is sadly what I think will happen. She really hasn't earned beating Drayden through hardship and overcoming obstacles, so there'd be nothing compelling about seeing her beat him, and if the defeat doesn't expose a flaw, sets up a storyline, then the whole battle against Shaga is pointless. You're kinda proving my point here. The writers haven't done anything with Iris, with the problems that were set up in front of her, have never really had her confront her own flaws and grow from it, while on the other hand piling up achievements and karmic freebies on her character, nullifying any potential for being interesting. Sure she has a tie with Shaga, but the last battle didn't actually prompt any change in her character and so there's really nothing there to resolve, and if there's nothing that's born out of it, then what's the point in having the two battle other than glorify Iris?

Ash is already a threat in my opinion.

I think his eighth gym battle disproves that and beyond two strong Pokémon on his roster who received some believable powerups, evolved, got some screen time to feature their personality and really make the audience care about them, half of his team received neither of these things and the rest of them got one or the other. It's not just about making Satoshi a threat, it's also about making his team a threat, it's also about making the Pokémon on his team shine as individual characters, so that when they get in some tough battles down the road, we actually care.

So, his losses against Iris, Masaomi AND Trip made him look weak, or what?

Not so much against Masaomi, since he was using Zuruggu, but the other two definitely made him look weak.

Okay. Cool, I guess. I'd totally want to see Bianca earn a badge here, but I don't even think Burgundy is going to participate in the League.

Sadly, I agree about the latter. She really would have been awesome in the League, but that would have required not throwing her under the Iris bus. It seems strange though that they'd show her having earned a badge and not having it lead anywhere.

I know Iris is going to battle Drayden, but I have no idea about the rest. But, I guess that's what you're hoping for to see, right?

I'm not hoping for it to go one way or the other, that's just what I think will happen based on past events. The writers had plenty of opportunities to pull a break the haughty moment with Iris, they never did. They had plenty of times to set up storylines they never saw through, plenty of occasions to really establish something about Iris that needed resolution, only to have it vanish when it's about to cost her something. I see no reason to assume a Shaga battle would deviate from that. The writers don't want to commit to showing Iris flawed, vulnerable, so what's left? Sure, Shaga could comment on Kibago... who knows Imperial Wrath and Giga Impact and nearly knocked down Shirona's Gablias... Sure, Shaga could comment on Kairyu (if the problem's not already solved by then) ... but it's still being portrayed as being so much stronger than any Pokémon on the main cast ever, on par if not stronger than Goukazaru and Lizardon with none of the effort and hardships. We're not exactly crossing the line into forming a story around Iris.

Which is the whole point. I don't see the Iris/Shaga thing having much impact, so at least, Satoshi could get something out of it. That being said, I think there won't be an arc, it'll be one episode and centered around Iris.

I don't care if Ash does it, I don't care if Iris does it, I don't care if Mary Sue does it. Hell, I will even be okay if they write Max back into the show and have him do it! I just want to freaking see Drayden, and Cheran too, but definitely Drayden. The anime has showcased every Gym Leader in the games, and I swear I will never forgive the writers if they throw out yet ANOTHER consistency. Ash gets to test his skills in a new region using everything he learned about pokemon in the other 4? Nah. Ash takes on a team of 6 pokemon who chose him as their trainer to strengthen their skills and power? Yeah right. Let Team Rocket stay funny? LOLNOPE!

But I digress, Ash fighting Drayden would be good for "The Iris Show" because, despite the fact that no, we have NOT seen her do anything other than chastise Ash and occasionally enter a random tournament, it WOULD give her a chance to question herself and her training methods, or lack thereof. Imagine, Iris sitting there watching Ash get his ass kicked by the final evolution of her test pokemon. She'll watch as Haxorus takes down Ash's pokemon one by one *because if they intended for Ash to defeat Drayden, they would have made him the 8th gym leader, not poor Roxie* and think "Wow, Haxorus is really strong. Axew is too, but why hasn't it evolved yet? What am I doing wrong?" And then decide that yes, she actually has to TRAIN her pokemon, and beg Drayden for a match too. They`ll fight, Axew will get beaten to a pulp, and Drayden will pity her and drag her kicking and screaming to a serious training session, leaving Ash free of the shackles of the worst mary sue the anime has ever seen.

And yes, I did forget about Dragonite, but come on, it's going up against Drayden the fecking Dragon Master, how much of a chance does it really stand against him if it can't even get past a Krookodile that gets all weepy if it loses its sunglasses? We all know Dragonite will do whatever he damn well wants to, get pissed halfway through the battle, and rely on Iris' commands halfway through the battle in a desperate bid to win, only to fail miserably. That is what we learned in the Junior Cup.

Then again, a match against Drayden would prove to be a great character development for Iris, and we all know how the writers hate giving the cast proper development. Case in point: Trip and Unfezant.

Originally Posted by Chiplet

He'll definitely compliment her in some way, we all know that, but I don't think he'll be so pleased after he has seen her progress with Axew.

She's made progress with it? Where? When? All I've seen are obviously hacked moves randomly show up in the middle of an otherwise pointless battle. Seriously, a base stage pokemon that can evolve twice has no business knowing the last moves it can learn by levelup, let alone Outrage and Giga Impact. Someone take away her Action Replay and destroy it before it magically turns Shiny. Tell her it HAS to evolve before we can let her do anything else to it.