Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from? - Page 2

View Poll Results: Can Ash Re-challenge Brock (or Forrest), Misty, Erika, and Sabrina?

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  • Yes! I want to see Ash earn those badges the right way.

    9 28.13%
  • No! Ash shouldn't waste his time with them.

    19 59.38%
  • I'm not sure.

    4 12.50%
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Thread: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

  1. #16

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Satoshi will inevitably return to Kantou for another storyline, so I don't see the problem with Satoshi battling some of the gym leaders again. A rematch with Natsume might be tricky unless Satoshi is portrayed as being at the top of his game. In the first series Natsume was so powerful that it would be a shame if that was dumbed down or ignored.

  2. #17

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    I dislike pity badges as much as the next guy, but I don't think it would be worth it.
    If Ash went back to Kanto for rematches on specific gyms we would most certainly get another filler arc. One that would go nowhere because everyone knows he is not going to take the Indigo League again, so why even bother? Seems like a big waste of time.
    The best the anime could make of it is the opportunity to see some previous characters of the day again, but this is a stunt I don't think the writers could pull off properly.

  3. #18

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Gym battles are not all about the battle. It's about the knowledge the challenger has, and the bond you share with your Pokémon, too.

  4. #19

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    What'd be the point now?

  5. #20
    Only 70 new Pokemon? Hoopa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    A badge is a badge. It matters not how you obtain it.

  6. #21
    Reader and Writer Legacy's Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Meh, why not? If for no other reason than a Misty/Ash reunion.

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  7. #22
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    I don't want to see it purely for the matter that it would be redundant. We've seen Kanto. We've been through the gyms before. I know they weren't won properly, but we don't need to see this again. I hardly think we'd get a G/S sort of situation where they now have different teams or something. What would it prove anyway? We already know Ash can go through a league properly. He's done it several times already. Has that not satisfied you? Or do you honestly want to solve the age old mystery of who would win the battle of the Metapods? I don't think they would do this for new viewers, either. They still have at least SOME regard for continuity. (even if it was misplaced in BW) The past is in the past and it's time to move on.
    Step into the Fairy circle

  8. #23

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yash View Post
    I don't know if I'd even call them "pity badges" for how much people complain about them.

    Ash beat Brock by using the field to his advantage (and Ash originally conceded the match but Brock gave him the badge anyway).
    Wasn't that in accident, the thing with the sprinklers? Oh well, Brock knew that and gave Ash the badge so... okay. But for this next one...

    Misty's sisters were right in that if Ash had Pikachu battle, he would have won easily.
    ... Ash tried to have Pikachu battle and it didn't want to. Ash couldn't/didn't convince Pikachu to battle against Misty, so the sisters using that as a reason Ash got a badge doesn't make sense to me. (One of the sisters mentioned that as a reason, but it doesn't make sense to me.)

    That same sister (and I'm assuming the Japanese version wasn't different) said that the other reason Ash got the badge was because Pikachu saved the day from Team Rocket. I think maybe since it was one of the first times Ash's Pokemon saved the gym leaders' day, that it was all right, but since that became more routine as time passed yet Ash still had an episode where he battled the gym leader........ meh.

    Well that one's kind of sketchy but Kadabra wasn't able to continue battling.
    If I'm not mistaken, Sabrina and Kadabra were connected in some sort of Psychic way, so Sabrina getting distracted by Haunter and laughing caused Kadabra to laugh too.

    I think this is a case where Ash technically deserved the badge because his opponent messed up her own chances of victory (by having herself and her Pokemon connected the way they were), but at the same time, where Ash didn't prove his and his Pokemon as having a high amount of strength. Meh...

    Quote Originally Posted by R!ck
    (I bet many people that got badges the right way got a lower rank than him in the league haha)
    I was starting to come up with a counterargument for this, but... The more I think about it though............ you don't really need badges to prove your strength. You technically need them to participate in the Pokemon league, but hey, if you train your Pokemon really hard in various Trainer battles and wild Pokemon matches, maybe you could beat the Champion of the Pokemon League even with them earning all their badges by knocking out Pokemon.........................

    All that being said, I don't think Ash should re-challenge those gyms. (Lots of time has passed for that, as I and many people think.) I think back in that saga he should've just gotten "pity badges" from Misty and Brock, since later on Ash could happen to challenge and defeat them both in serious Pokemon battles while having eight Kanto badges and training for the league. Brock and Misty did travel with him, so they'd have been the easiest to re-challenge. That didn't happen though so now I'm just... meh.

    I'm still in favor of the GS Ball mystery being resolved in the TV show, though. That's an unresolved storyline. The badges thing was resolved in those episodes where Ash got the badges in question.

    I think it'd be cool if Trainers got medals or something, for doing heroic things like what Ash did with Erica's burning gym. The badges themselves would be for defeating gym leaders' opponent Pokemon.
    Seasons =/= Regions

  9. #24

    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    I think the writers are more concerned with having Ash move forward to winning new badges from new gyms and probably put his old gym battles behind him, regardless of the exact circumstances of how he got those badges. They probably think "He got them, and that's that".

  10. #25
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    We don't even have any reason to believe that the writers see any problem with the way Satoshi got those badges way back then. For all we know they could be perfectly happy with the way those turned out.

    Besides, it's not like some of Satoshi's "legitimate" badge wins weren't complete bullshit either (cough THUNDER ARMOR cough cough FINAL FRONTIER SYMBOL cough)
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  11. #26
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Actually, didn't Ash and Misty battle over Totodile during the first half of the Johto arc? And this time, Ash actually won fair and square in a 3-vs-3 match. Misty even mentioned that Cerulean Gym where Ash got the pity badge, and said to the tune of the gym badge issue being settled one and for all. So at least that settles Misty's.

    Having said that, it would have been a brilliant opportunity to have a fully fleshed out PWT at the end of the Unova saga. Of course that would provide Ash and Sabrina/Erika to do a proper battle. Going off topic, it would also have provided a goal for Ash to work with and an plot-writing opportunity to delegate the gym badge collection to Iris, and spare Ash of the writing-induced stupidity/regression. Furthermore, the PWT would be a great opportunity to showcase the PC counterparts: Jimmy, Marina, Brendan, Lucas, Hilbert, Hilda (possibly also Nate and Rosa), and finally Calem to give the call to Ash to go to Kalos.
    Last edited by henrymidfields; 18th May 2014 at 01:14 AM.

  12. #27
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    I don't think so, there really is no reason to anymore. Not to mention that I'm pretty sure Ash himself may not consider them "free badges" just cuz he didn't battle for them, and he probably doesn't even care about the way he got them anymore.

  13. #28
    pokemon fan 132 pokemon fan 132's Avatar
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Looking back i don't think those badges were necessarily "free" or "pity". It was more reward and compensation from gym leaders for help, undelfishness and solidarity Ash displayed when saving Erica Gloom from burning gym. Or when he showed sportsmanship not wanting to finish battle vs Brock Onix in weakened state admitting himself how if sprinkles didn't turned on match could have gone differently. Because of his merits and lot of devotion, fighting spirit and sincere emotion in way he treats his pokemon those gym leaders already recognized in Ash skill, talent and passionate heart assesing how even without battle he passed their test to be viewed as worthy and good enough trainer to compete in Indigo league.

    It draws nicely parallel with real life. Where sometime hard work and honesty can bring you far without following strictly procedure written on paper. Like professors for example haying right(in my country they do) to reward top students freeing them from taking final exam if through whole semestar they were delivering high scores, provided exemplar behavior and displayed lot of knowledge finding unnecessary to further test their knowledge.

    But regardless should Ash battle Kanto gym leaders again? Sure, why not?

    Purpose could be in Ash trying to take on Indigo Plateau league once again winning major tournament from region he was born and originated from. Afterwards earning right to challenge Kanto E4 and champion Lance. Wanting to work his way forward through traditional, hard working way with no shortcuts involved. Meaning battling for all 8 badges again representing symbol of new, fresh start and second try in conquering league where he still learned ropes poluting lowest result.

    It would serve as nice roadtrip to past and early days of pokemon journey, but also giving us treat in seeing gym leaders like lt. Surge, Sabrina, Koga etc updated with new designs and looks, new pokemon, new changes in ther lives and characterization(it did passed a lot since than). Playing relevant role in modern times once again making new history and building future through older, but renewed and by now iconic faces.

    Not to mention maybe than we could finally see Misty comeback finishing that match in Cerulean between her and Ash. Maybe even joining Ash through Kanto again, to catch new ookemon, resume on advancing water master career through tournaments and appointing to become E4 Lorelei apprentice getting some more growth.

    Now that i think about it Ash going through Kanto again winning first league from hometown rehion and challenging good old Kanto leaders sounds like it has potential for feasible and cool story. Reviving on all those memories, revisit of nostalgic places, exploring new towns, areas not showed before from Kanto and resume on friendship and strong relationships years later. Succeeding in something Battle Frontier failed at.

    Nintendo and Gamefreak also seem to love first generation fitting its characters in some way through every new region. So in case Kanto games get sequel or something following on events and character lives from where they were left in that case provides marketing potential and even bigger justification for revisiting Kanto again.
    Last edited by pokemon fan 132; 29th May 2014 at 07:46 AM.

  14. #29
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    Pokémon Fan 132, you're a genius! Now the honourary gym badges makes good sense now! Yes, there is a reason why people get honourary degrees, and there is a reason why people can get admitted into universities without necessarily having the required entry score! And yes, you're right, Ash can and should go through the Kanto region again as his climax for the whole anime. I salute you, sir!

  15. #30
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    Default Re: Should Ash Re-challenge the Kanto Gym Leaders whom he got the "Free Badges" from?

    He doesn't really need to. As long as they make new regions, Screw Kanto!
    No really though, I don't think it really matters. He's challenged Brock and Misty many times already fairly.

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