Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

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    Cool Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    This is more of a rant, but I would like to see the Pokémon anime release on DVD and Blu-ray with both the English and Japanese openings, endings, and audio tracks. Viz media currently only releases the episodes with the English dub and openings. I don't mind it as much in the early episodes, but lately the show has gone down hill. The openings seem uninteresting, like they were made as quick and cheap as possible in order to get them out for the anime, and most of the time the voice acting can seem lazy and dull, like they aren't trying all that hard, especially with the side characters. It seems like stuff happens in the episodes for no other reason than to just happen. This is more of a complaint about the anime as a whole, not just the English dub, but when ever a large cast of characters get together, like during the Pokémon League, it seems that characters just run off for stupid reasons, only for the sake of getting them off screen so they won't have to speak. Maybe the Japanese voice acting and dialog is good enough to justify this and make it sound realistic, but the English track sure doesn't. Most of the anime Viz releases has both the English and Japanese subs, dubs, openings and endings, but for some reason not for Pokémon. I would like to go back and re-watch the Original series with the Japanese openings and endings. I actually look forward to new openings and endings in Japan, and I only look forward to the openings in America only because I hope that they might finally make one that is somewhat interesting. They don't even have a legit ending! I understand the need for the English dub because the anime is targeted to little kids and is shown on Cartoon Network on Saturday mornings, but the DVDs could at least include these features as extras, and it probably wouldn't cost them a whole lot of money, since they probably have the footage anyway.

    Example of Release:

    Pokémon: Indigo League - Complete Season One
    Includes all 81 Episodes of the Original Series of Pokémon in Original Japanese order and includes missing or skipped episodes, also in original Japanese Order
    Special Features
    English and Japanese Dub Track
    English and Japanese Subtitles
    Option to play episodes with either English or Japanese Opening
    Option to play episodes with either English or Japanese Ending
    Complete Pokérap
    Pikachu's Jukebox
    Professor Oak's lectures (Japanese with English subs, and English Dubs)
    Trailers

    This formula would continue on to Adventures in the Orange Islands, The Johto Journeys, and etc.. I think that some of the missing episodes should be added as well, not necessarily the Porygon episode since it can't be shown for legal reasons, but at least The Legend of Dratini episode, and a dub is said to exist so adding this in should not be a problem, and even so, and Japanese dub with English subs could be added, and it could be skipped for viewers of English dub if wanted. Even a re-dub would be OK. The inclusion of this alone would grab people's attention and create a boost in sales. Also this episode, along with Holiday Hi-Jynx and Snow Way Out!, should be place in their correct, original Japanese spots when watching the episode all at once. Also, I wouldn't mind at least the option to watch the episode in an uncut manner, especially sinc early episodes were notorious for cuts. The dubs included in the releases could also be the original cast dub and a re-dub by the new cast, though this would cost a lot of money and time, and not too many people would be interested in it, maybe some would, but not me too much. It might be interesting. Also I added Professor Oak's lectures. I think they would be cool to add as extras, at least some of them. In the Japanese showing of the episodes, these lectures come on after the episode, and it would be interesting to see a dubbed version of this. I would also like to see the Pikachu's Jukebox segments on the release as well. I really like watching them back in the day, and they add a nostalgia factor to the episodes. I would be glad to pay for these releases. It isn't unreasonable to ask for a blu-ray release of these episodes, especially since they release the blu-ray of the first movie in Japan not too long ago. I think this would appeal to people of all types and they would make a lot of money if they did this. They need to start paying a little more attention to the fans who grew up with Pokémon since the beginning and this is a good way to start.

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    Back into Pokemon Lord_Mewtwo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    I too would love to see this, but the problem would be Viz doesn't want to market Pokemon to hardcore fans, only to children and children don't care about the Japanese version.
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    Registered User The Fighting Misty's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Viz didn't even want to re-release Johto on DVD when HGSS came out back in 2009, so I doubt they ever will.

    They re-released Kanto and Orange Islands but stopped there. I guess they figure Johto won't sell?

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    ロケット団よ永遠 Dogasu's Avatar Retired Staff
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    While it would be *nice* to have bilingual DVDs like the ones you're proposing, there are unfortunately a number of things preventing them from doing that:

    Includes all 81 Episodes of the Original Series of Pokémon in Original Japanese order and includes missing or skipped episodes, also in original Japanese Order
    They're not going to put any of the "banned episodes" on anything with "Pokemon" on it in the U.S. And no, it really isn't as simple as slapping a "Teen" rating on the box. The "Pokemon" brand is too important to all the companies involved to risk the bad press they'd get from having a DVD with material "too hot for TV."

    English and Japanese Subtitles
    Translation of 81 episodes of an animated series takes a lot of time and money. Time and money that Viz, unfortunately, doesn't see any reason to spend.

    at least The Legend of Dratini episode, and a dub is said to exist
    That's just an Internet rumor. Nobody has ever been able to provide any proof for this claim in the over decade and a half since it's been made.

    It isn't unreasonable to ask for a blu-ray release of these episodes, especially since they release the blu-ray of the first movie in Japan not too long ago.
    Japan probably doesn't want Viz releasing the TV series on Blu-ray because of reverse importation (the U.S. and Japan do share the same Blu-ray region, after all). Viz would also have to request HD masters of the series, which OLM / Shogakukan may not be willing to hand over.


    Also,

    Pokémon: Indigo League - Complete Season One
    Season One only goes up to the first Yamato and Kosaburou episode.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty View Post
    Viz didn't even want to re-release Johto on DVD when HGSS came out back in 2009, so I doubt they ever will.

    They re-released Kanto and Orange Islands but stopped there. I guess they figure Johto won't sell?
    I seriously doubt that they didn't think that Johto wouldn't sell. Not everyone dislike Johto with a passion and it would probably be new to a lot of kids watching Pokemon for the first time, so I don't think it would do that poorly. I'd definitely buy them since I'd actually like to rewatch the whole saga on DVD, as opposed to whenever they're up on Pokemon.com or spending a good chuck of money on the out of print Johto League Champions DVDs.

    I think that they stopped after the Orange Islands because the re-release were in part for the tenth anniversary and those seasons were when the series was at his peak of popularity and it focused on first generation Pokemon for the most part. Going into the Johto sets would have been nice, but it wouldn't have tied in with the anniversary theme they were going for. My theory is that TPCI were waiting for HG/SS for Viz to re-release Johto, but because of how Universal got the distribution rights to the Giratina movie when Viz was finally able to distribute the Darkrai movie, there was some conflict between TPCI and Viz Media that prevented them from re-releasing those seasons when Johto was more relevant, as well as any other season set. That would explain why it took such a long time for Galactic Battles to be released, especially when that didn't get a release date until the Arceus movie, which was distributed by Viz Media, news came out.

    Anyway, while I agree that it would nice to have bilingual DVDs, as Dogasu mentioned, there are a lot of factors preventing something like that from happening. Probably the biggest one is that Viz and TPCI aren't going to target the fans who watch the Japanese version since they're most likely in the minority compared to the kids who just watch the dub. It might also cost them more to do it than what profits they would get back from bilingual DVDs.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    You have to keep in mind that the overwhelming majority of Western viewers who grew up with the earlier sagas of the pokemon dub aren't aficionados for the Japanese originals. Including comprehensive billingual versions of everything in order to please the very small minority of fans who would give a damn either way would be an awful lot of hassle for Viz, when they can make more than enough profit by exploiting the nostalgia market, which only cares about reliving memories with the version of the show that they grew up with.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Quote Originally Posted by Hidden Mew View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty View Post
    Viz didn't even want to re-release Johto on DVD when HGSS came out back in 2009, so I doubt they ever will.

    They re-released Kanto and Orange Islands but stopped there. I guess they figure Johto won't sell?
    I seriously doubt that they didn't think that Johto wouldn't sell. Not everyone dislike Johto with a passion and it would probably be new to a lot of kids watching Pokemon for the first time, so I don't think it would do that poorly. I'd definitely buy them since I'd actually like to rewatch the whole saga on DVD, as opposed to whenever they're up on Pokemon.com or spending a good chuck of money on the out of print Johto League Champions DVDs.

    I think that they stopped after the Orange Islands because the re-release were in part for the tenth anniversary and those seasons were when the series was at his peak of popularity and it focused on first generation Pokemon for the most part. Going into the Johto sets would have been nice, but it wouldn't have tied in with the anniversary theme they were going for. My theory is that TPCI were waiting for HG/SS for Viz to re-release Johto, but because of how Universal got the distribution rights to the Giratina movie when Viz was finally able to distribute the Darkrai movie, there was some conflict between TPCI and Viz Media that prevented them from re-releasing those seasons when Johto was more relevant, as well as any other season set. That would explain why it took such a long time for Galactic Battles to be released, especially when that didn't get a release date until the Arceus movie, which was distributed by Viz Media, news came out.
    I figure Kanto and Orange were re-released on DVD because that's what the nostalgic Pokemon fans fondly remember from their childhood. Most people originally stopped watching at some point Johto was airing, so they couldn't cash in on any nostalgia there. And the ones who actually did watch all of Johto had a negative response to it.

    HGSS would have been the perfect time for Johto DVDs, why would they miss the opportunity for the Johto episodes when the games were remade? The simple conclusion is they knew they wouldn't sell much.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    I don't think we ever will see them released, especially not on Blu-ray, although yeah. I would love it. The cost would be insane. I have SD versions of every season on my computer, minus BW2 and so far the folder is over 120gb. Double that in HD. I think i'd have to sell a kidney to able to afford the full collection, but yeah. In theory I would love it. As far as Johto not selling well, I disagree. I know lots of Johto fans. I'm one myself.

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    Moderator Hidden Mew's Avatar Forum Head
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty View Post
    I figure Kanto and Orange were re-released on DVD because that's what the nostalgic Pokemon fans fondly remember from their childhood. Most people originally stopped watching at some point Johto was airing, so they couldn't cash in on any nostalgia there. And the ones who actually did watch all of Johto had a negative response to it.

    HGSS would have been the perfect time for Johto DVDs, why would they miss the opportunity for the Johto episodes when the games were remade? The simple conclusion is they knew they wouldn't sell much.
    Well, Kanto and the Orange Islands were when Pokemon was at its peak of popularity and it focused on first generation Pokemon. Going right into Johto sets, while it would have been nice, wouldn't have fit with the anniversary. Also, please stop speaking for others with your opinions. I watched all of Johto while it aired on TV and I didn't have a negative response to it. It had problems, but nothing that made me dislike the saga for years. I'm sure that there plenty of other people who did enjoy Johto, in spite of its flaws, and aren't full of negative feelings towards it. I already explained why they would miss the opportunity for the Johto seasons re-released when the games were remade. If Viz had some conflict with TPCI when they didn't get the distribution rights to the Giratina movie, then that could have prevented them from releasing any season sets, which still makes sense to me when it took so long for Galactic Battles to get a release and during that year, I don't think anything other than those Best of DVDs were released. Saying that they knew they wouldn't sell much seems like a bit of a conclusion to jump to, especially when one ignores the state of DVD releases during HG/SS, and gives you an excuse to bash Johto some more.

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    ロケット団よ永遠 Dogasu's Avatar Retired Staff
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Yeah, like Hidden Mew said, the lack of Johto DVDs during the HGSS hype (something I talked about here) most likely has to do with the licensing issues at the time. By the time everything was worked out, HGSS was no longer relevant.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    I don't really see the point of the DVDs having the Japanese version as well. ever since TPCi took over, it's been way more accurate to the Japanese version than ever before. Plus it would be redundant if they paid to use the original background music they replaced in the English version.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    First off, it wouldn't be too hard to include the Japanese track, since they probably receive the film with Japanese track anyway. They also get the intros as well, as evident by the clips used to make the new American intros. It wouldn't be too expensive to subtitle, since they do both a sub and a dub for plenty of other anime, and none of them would make the kind of money a pokemon release would. A dub actually costs more than sub with Japanese audio. Showing the Japanese intros and endings wouldn't cost a lot either, since again they own the footage already, and a release would make the kind of money to justify their inclusion. One season one Blu-ray wouldn't cost that much, since there are a lot of Anime Series that have been released on Blu-ray that are somewhat affordable, and they could release them as part of a collectors edition or something at higher price if it helps them justify making them. To build interest in the new DVDs, they could re-show them on Cartoon Network during the same block as the new episodes so that kids now can see the original series. I mean, they show the original Power Rangers season on ABC on Saturday mornings, so I think this could work. Also, the Dratini episode was only cut because it was to be shown on Kids WB, which has higher standards and censors more stuff than Cartoon Network, a cable channel, which could get away with the content, and even so, they could cut some of the footage like they did Beauty and the Beach and it would work if they have too. Inclusion of guns does not make a cartoon instantly teen rated. Many cartoon have guns, like Batman and other superhero shows. The only reason that episode was skipped was because they waited too long to do anything about it and it became irrelevant. Also a dub does exist, according to cast interviews, just like a dub exists to the Porygon episode. This isn't a huge gripe though, it could be cut if necessary, but I think it might attract more sales. As far as reverse importation, there are laws in place that would prevent this. I have been on anime sites where they ban shipping to Japan for this very reason. And everybody has their own opinion. You might not think something is necessary or need, but others do. That is why it would be nice to have these options available to consumers.

    And there is no good reason why the Johto seasons aren't on DVD. They still release the Advanced Generation episodes on DVD, and their still hasn't been a remake of their games yet.
    Last edited by Hidden Mew; 27th April 2013 at 03:44 PM. Reason: Merging Posts

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonace View Post
    First off, it wouldn't be too hard to include the Japanese track, since they probably receive the film with Japanese track anyway. They also get the intros as well, as evident by the clips used to make the new American intros. It wouldn't be too expensive to subtitle, since they do both a sub and a dub for plenty of other anime, and none of them would make the kind of money a pokemon release would. A dub actually costs more than sub with Japanese audio.
    The anime titles that do have subs, along with the dub, are aimed at an older audience. Pokemon, like other anime titles primarily aimed at kids, are given a dub-release since there aren't a lot of kids who want legal subs compared to teenage and young adult fans of titles that licensors like Funimation have. It probably would cost more to include the legal subs since they'd have to pay royalties for the music and other aspects of the Japanese version. Subbing isn't as expensive as dubbing is, but it does cost a bit on top of what they already pay for the dub and if it costs more to do than what they would get back, then it wouldn't be an appealing option to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonace
    Showing the Japanese intros and endings wouldn't cost a lot either, since again they own the footage already, and a release would make the kind of money to justify their inclusion. One season one Blu-ray wouldn't cost that much, since there are a lot of Anime Series that have been released on Blu-ray that are somewhat affordable, and they could release them as part of a collectors edition or something at higher price if it helps them justify making them. To build interest in the new DVDs, they could re-show them on Cartoon Network during the same block as the new episodes so that kids now can see the original series. I mean, they show the original Power Rangers season on ABC on Saturday mornings, so I think this could work.
    They would have to pay royalties to use the music, which would probably be more than what they could get back. I don't know if they'd want to release a season on Blu-ray when most kids may not care about the upgraded visual qualities that are in Blu-rays. I don't think that ABC has shown Power Rangers since their Saturday morning block ended about a year or two ago. I also doubt that Cartoon Network would be interested in using up another slot on their Saturday morning lineup, especially for an older series of Pokemon.

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonace
    Also, the Dratini episode was only cut because it was to be shown on Kids WB, which has higher standards and censors more stuff than Cartoon Network, a cable channel, which could get away with the content, and even so, they could cut some of the footage like they did Beauty and the Beach and it would work if they have too. Inclusion of guns does not make a cartoon instantly teen rated. Many cartoon have guns, like Batman and other superhero shows. The only reason that episode was skipped was because they waited too long to do anything about it and it became irrelevant. Also a dub does exist, according to cast interviews, just like a dub exists to the Porygon episode. This isn't a huge gripe though, it could be cut if necessary, but I think it might attract more sales. As far as reverse importation, there are laws in place that would prevent this. I have been on anime sites where they ban shipping to Japan for this very reason. And everybody has their own opinion. You might not think something is necessary or need, but others do. That is why it would be nice to have these options available to consumers.
    If that's the case and a dub for the Dratini episode did exist, then it would have aired on Cartoon Network when they were airing Kanto. They aired the Tentacruel episode I think that only aired once on Kids' WB. There's no chance that they were able to dub the Porygon episode. Even though Maddie Blaustien said that and I really enjoyed her work, there is just no chance 4Kids, or any company for that matter, would have been able to dub that infamous episode. A dub for the Dratini episode is a bit more likely, but I still don't believe it because of how they could have aired it on Cartoon Network or heavily edited like with the Beauty and the Beach episode. I think that saying that it has banned episodes would turn parents off more than anything else.

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonace
    And there is no good reason why the Johto seasons aren't on DVD. They still release the Advanced Generation episodes on DVD, and their still hasn't been a remake of their games yet.
    They released the AG episodes on DVD when the series was still going on and shortly after it finished. Aside from two episodes from Johto Journeys, the Johto seasons were released on DVD. We were talking about re-releases of the Johto seasons, which didn't happen during HG/SS most likely for some legal complications between TPCI and Viz Media. The AG seasons are still fairly easy to find, although a few DVDs have gone out of print, while it's incredibly hard to get anything from the Johto seasons without either importing the season sets that were released in Australia or paying a good amount of money for out of print DVDs.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    I think among even the older forum-going English-tongue people who watch Japanese Pokemon, most do it to see either the banned episodes or the latest episodes from Japan (since the latest episodes aren't available first in English). The English version is the most concerned about (with the exception, maybe, of TPCI's dubbing), as shown, for one thing, by how most people use the English names. So I don't see enough people being interested in the older Japanese episodes.

    I'd go to buy such a release, though. I do believe it bites that there's so simple and legal way for people to watch the Japanese version.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fennekin
    I don't really see the point of the DVDs having the Japanese version as well. ever since TPCi took over, it's been way more accurate to the Japanese version than ever before.
    There are many anime with English dubs intended to be as faithful as possible to the Japanese versions, and they still get Japanese releases. So faithfulness hasn't stopped the Japanese versions from being released for other shows. Personally I don't think that just because an English dub is a certain amount faithful it means the original Japanese version shouldn't be included.

    Of course, there's still the matter of too few people caring for the Japanese version in Pokemon's case.
    Seasons =/= Regions

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    ロケット団よ永遠 Dogasu's Avatar Retired Staff
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    Default Re: Pokémon Seasons on DVD/Blu-ray

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonace
    First off, it wouldn't be too hard to include the Japanese track, since they probably receive the film with Japanese track anyway.
    Nobody's arguing that they don't have access to the footage / soundtrack.

    It wouldn't be too expensive to subtitle, since they do both a sub and a dub for plenty of other anime, and none of them would make the kind of money a pokemon release would.
    I think you're overestimating how well Pokemon home releases do. The video games sell. The TV show gets great ratings. The DVDs, on the other hand...

    A dub actually costs more than sub with Japanese audio.
    The difference here is that the dub for these Pokemon episodes is already done. A sub, on the other hand, would have to be created from the ground up, and right now Viz has absolutely no reason to believe that the time and money required to make it - which is an amount that is not at all negligible - would be worth it.

    Showing the Japanese intros and endings wouldn't cost a lot either, since again they own the footage already
    The songs themselves, though, would require separate licensing since the Japanese version uses artists from a variety of record labels. Which, yes, other series deal with all the time, but Viz isn't going to go through the legal hoops to do it for this series.

    To build interest in the new DVDs, they could re-show them on Cartoon Network during the same block as the new episodes so that kids now can see the original series.
    So why would anyone bother to buy the DVDs if they can just watch the episodes for free on Cartoon Network? To watch the Japanese version of the show they have absolutely no interest in?

    I mean, they show the original Power Rangers season on ABC on Saturday mornings
    ...to get kids interested in buying Kyouryuu Sentai Zyuranger DVDs? DVDs that also don't exist because, like Pokemon, any interest people have in the series is based on the English dub and *not* the original Japanese version?

    Also, the Dratini episode was only cut because it was to be shown on Kids WB
    The Dratini episode actually predates the series' move to Kids' WB!

    Inclusion of guns does not make a cartoon instantly teen rated. Many cartoon have guns, like Batman and other superhero shows.
    Japanese Episode 035

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogasu's Backpack
    But you have to remember two things. The first is that the censors absolutely make distinctions between things that you and I wouldn't think twice about. There's a difference between actually firing a gun and simply pointing it at someone. A gun being held up close to someone and a gun being pointed at someone from far away are two different things, in the eyes of the censors. A gun being on-screen for ten seconds might be OK, but fifteen seconds of screentime is taboo. It's not uncommon to see rifles and bazookas allowed, but not handguns.

    The difference between the guns in this episode and the guns in other episodes is that in this episode, the guns were actually fired. In this episode, the guns were held right up to people's heads. In this episode, the guns were onscreen longer than all those other instances combined. In this episode, there were no other adults around to stop the would-be shooter(s). In this episode, the guns in question were the same type of handguns a kid can find in his dad's sock drawer.

    The only reason that episode was skipped was because they waited too long to do anything about it and it became irrelevant.
    "Beauty and the Beach" debuted in the middle of the Orange Islands arc. The "Pokemon Chronicles" episodes featuring Brock and Misty coming home aired way after they had already returned / made their cameo in Hoenn.

    Also a dub does exist, according to cast interviews, just like a dub exists to the Porygon episode.
    Nope.

    Japanese Episode 038

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogasu's Backpack
    We have quotes from Maddie Blaustein saying that they dubbed an edited version of the episode, but I have my doubts about that for a number of reasons.

    For one thing, the idea that 4Kids was given a tape to dub and then distribute to American TV networks in the first place just doesn't make any sense. We know that TV-Tokyo, OLM, Nintendo, and everyone else involved with the creation of this episode wants us to all act like this whole thing never happened. So why, then, would they give a tape to 4Kids so they could release it overseas? We know from the Pokémon 4Ever DVD commentary that they didn't start dubbing the series until April 1998, and we know that the versions of the episodes they got were the post-Porygon edits. Yet we're to believe that, despite all this, 4Kids was given a tape anyway?

    I know it sounds like I'm calling Maddie Blaustein a liar, but I'm not. I'm just saying that it's entirely possible that she was mis-remembering things. She made the comments ten years after Season One premiered on American TV; it's entirely possible that she got it mixed up with one of the other hundreds of episodes she had done up to that point. You can argue that an episode like this would stand out, but can we really know that for sure? 4Kids edits the episodes before the voice actors ever step into the recording booth, so she wouldn't have noticed anything out of place in this episode.
    This thread we had up a few years ago also addresses the lack of any proof of dubbed versions of these episodes and is worth a read through.

    As far as reverse importation, there are laws in place that would prevent this.
    ...laws that people circumvent all the time.

    And there is no good reason why the Johto seasons aren't on DVD. They still release the Advanced Generation episodes on DVD, and their still hasn't been a remake of their games yet.
    Johto episodes *have* been put out on DVD, but those DVDs have long since gone out of print. What everyone else here is talking about is a box set re-release.
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