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  1. #16
    Geek of the Games CynthiaLover's Avatar
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    Default Re: If you could change the TRio's role or personality in Best Wishes...

    You know... I'll probably be chewed out for this (I always am), but I miss comedic TRio. But I could be satisfied with a mixture of serious and humorous, more the latter than the former, but still fairly even. I miss TR's bad puns, I miss their "blast offs", I miss their little word play and rhyming, I even miss the boss fantasies (and they were probably the most annoying part of their "plans"). They're one of the reasons why I stopped watching BW. They took too sharp of a turn from goofy and incompetent to serious and dangerous. That kind of transition spells bad writing. What in the seven spiral galaxies caused such a sharp transition from one polar opposite to another? Again, I would settle for a roughly 50/50 blend of humor and seriousness, but this is way too much to endure. They seemed to have lost their souls, their passion, their... personalities. While they were serious in Kanto and Johto (as they were the main threat), they at least had the humor element. Here, they're just so... dark... so soulless... so... uncharacteristic.

    Dr. Zager is also a royal pain, and a camera hog. I wish they'd get rid of him for good. How he became in charge of those three so quickly, and without complaint from the TRio baffles me. Plus all their missions, if you can call them that, in Unova seem so... empty. While their hair-brained schemes were tiresome every now and then, at least JJM seemed to enjoy what they were doing. While a little seriousness can go a long way, this is too much to intake. While some of their missions, like the Kami Trio and Meloetta, were pretty awesome, that degree of dedication and hostility was just so unlike JJM. AG seemed to deliver the best of all worlds when it came to TR, while DP was getting a little lackluster, it still made the grade. BW is just the pits with them.

    If I was forced to choose between funny TRio and serious TRio, I'd go for funny without a second thought. I like that kind of humor, I like slapstick, I like bad puns (and I know a bad pun, since I tend to deliver them), I like them blasting off (sometimes more that once an episode). It just seemed to fit their character designs and overall personalities better. TR was designed to be only a weak threat, even Bill... I mean Butch and Cassidy were still a minor threat, and they were more competent and dangerous than Jessie, James, and Meowth could be (though I guess that's not difficult). I mean, ever since they introduced new villains like Aqua, Magma, and Galactic, Team Rocket's overall purpose was reduced, as they had to "compete" with the other teams. While they're the only ones still standing, I still find it hard to believe that Geovonni even believed their lies about being the reasons Aqua/Magma/Galactic were shut down. As he once said "Though you're plans wouldn't buy me a cup of coffee...", so why, all of a sudden, would he believe that Jessie, James, and Meowth, after constant failure, were the "sole" reason the other teams were shut down? So why did the writers feel the need to make us choke this down?

    I'm sorry, but this is not what long-term fans of the series want to see. While some seriousness is fine, yes, too much is too much. I really miss the old days, which is why I continue to treasure any AG and DP DVDs I own, as they reflect how the series was designed. The show as a whole is designed to be fun, not turn into this slag. BW failed in all aspects, especially TRio. That's how I feel. I'd settle for a midway point, but not this. I thought there was hope when Jessie and James switched back to their white uniforms, but I was wrong.
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  2. #17
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    Default Re: If you could change the TRio's role or personality in Best Wishes...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos King View Post
    Unfortunately, the biggest problem with the TRio's role in most of BW was that their missions appeared to be fabricated on the spot. Even though there has been some continuity for these missions (i.e. stealing the Chargestone Cave rocks and the blueprints to Fennel's fossil restoration machine led to the Twist Mountain episodes), there was very little reasoning why TRio transitioned between unrelated missions and goals.
    Er, what? The reasoning why they transitioned was obvious: the previous mission/goal failed. Essentially, it was "back to the drawing board" each time. They went from the Meteonite mission to the subway one because the Meteonite mission failed, then to the Kami Trio one because the subway one failed, and so on and so forth. And they were all connected by the end goal of conquering Unova. It's not difficult to grasp. Honestly, I'll take it over Aqua/Magma and Galactic's style of slooooowly building up just one singular plan that they talk up a great deal and yet stop doing anything for it for long stretches of time until Ash and friends are on hand to go up against them. That was just plain silly.

    It simply felt that all TR wanted to do was to steal powerful and rare pokemon for themselves. Yes, this is a characteristic endgame for this organization, but it is still a poorly executed one at that.
    Stealing rare and powerful pokemon have always been Team Rocket's M.O. Always. From the beginning. Why are you complaining about it now? And how is it "poorly executed" aside from the fact that the Trio aren't acting completely stupid, unvillainous and goofy while doing it?

    Quote Originally Posted by CynthiaLover View Post
    You know... I'll probably be chewed out for this (I always am)
    I'll be glad to accomodate you.

    They're one of the reasons why I stopped watching BW.
    If you stopped watching, then why are you still complaining? And where do you get the basis for your complaints?

    What in the seven spiral galaxies caused such a sharp transition from one polar opposite to another?
    The boss believed in them. Something he hasn't done for well over a decade. That and implied off-screen training.

    Dr. Zager is also a royal pain, and a camera hog.
    HE'S a camera hog!? And yet you're pining for AG/DP TRio, who forced themselves in front of the camera in every goddamn episode even when they weren't needed and even when it distracted from more important things? Also, Zager is a major villain in BW, so of course he'll have a good many appearances. He always does what he's supposed to in them, and usually shares the screentime he has with the TRio, not hog it.

    How he became in charge of those three so quickly, and without complaint from the TRio baffles me.
    Why would the TRio complain? Him being in charge means they're still being taken seriously in the organization, which is what they want.

    that degree of dedication and hostility was just so unlike JJM.
    What is with people's unwillingness to let anything or anyone in the Pokemon anime change?

    Since it seems that's always the crux of the arguments against BW.

    TR was designed to be only a weak threat
    No, they were not. Team Rocket was designed as the main villain group for two generations of games, and a formidable threat. In Kanto, the TRio actually represented that well despite their bumbling, but it went downhill from there. And now, we have alot of people like you who think that "Team Rocket" is the TRio as they are in AG and DP, and get mad when the TRio returns to being part of the actual REAL Team Rocket.

    I mean, ever since they introduced new villains like Aqua, Magma, and Galactic, Team Rocket's overall purpose was reduced, as they had to "compete" with the other teams.
    So you really want the idiot TRio competing with the regional evil teams of the current generation every single time, always doomed to fail yet survive anyway? You don't think that would get the slightest bit old? At all?

    I still find it hard to believe that Geovonni even believed their lies about being the reasons Aqua/Magma/Galactic were shut down. As he once said "Though you're plans wouldn't buy me a cup of coffee...", so why, all of a sudden, would he believe that Jessie, James, and Meowth, after constant failure, were the "sole" reason the other teams were shut down? So why did the writers feel the need to make us choke this down?
    That was NOT why Giovanni promoted them. That was what the TRio thought was the reason, but the real reason was because his secretary, Matori, studied up on the TRio and personally recommended them for promotion, rightly believing that given such a push, they could become competant agents and head the Unova mission. DP191 made that pretty clear.

    I'm sorry, but this is not what long-term fans of the series want to see.
    1. Speak for yourself, not for all long-term fans. Thank you.

    2. Have you not read the 2008 interview with the former director of the anime? The production crew is NOT interested in long-term fans, that is NOT who they make the show for. They in fact make the show under the view that viewers, after a certain point, will move on and leave the show, all the while new viewers are coming in. So what long-term fans want is a moot point.

    I continue to treasure any AG and DP DVDs I own, as they reflect how the series was designed.
    NO. IT. WASN'T.

    The series didn't develop the formula AG and DP used until Johto, once it became clear this was going to be running for as long as the Pokemon franchise existed. Before that, under head writer Takeshi Shudo, the series was designed MUCH differently. AG and DP don't reflect how it was designed at all; in fact, Shudo criticized the way things went in them on his blog, especially how the TRio was portrayed.

    The show as a whole is designed to be fun, not turn into this slag. BW failed in all aspects, especially TRio. That's how I feel.
    Yes...that's the majority view of this fandom. Predictable, formula-driven, sluggish-paced shows like AG and DP are "fun", whereas any effort in trying to do new stuff and be creative like with BW is "slag". SIGH.
    Last edited by ObjectionMan; 16th January 2013 at 10:03 PM.

  3. #18
    ロケット団よ永遠 Dogasu's Avatar Retired Staff
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    Default Re: If you could change the TRio's role or personality in Best Wishes...

    This is not a thread to discuss whether or not we like the BW trio. This is a thread to offer suggestions of what could have been improved / done differently.

    Please get back on-topic everybody.

  4. #19
    Registered User Oddium Wanderus's Avatar
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    Default Re: If you could change the TRio's role or personality in Best Wishes...

    I wouldn't change a thing, I like them how they are :) Much better than AG/DP TR.

  5. #20
    ポケモンマスター はるひ's Avatar
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    Default Re: If you could change the TRio's role or personality in Best Wishes...

    HE'S a camera hog!? And yet you're pining for AG/DP TRio, who forced themselves in front of the camera in every goddamn episode even when they weren't needed and even when it distracted from more important things? Also, Zager is a major villain in BW, so of course he'll have a good many appearances. He always does what he's supposed to in them, and usually shares the screentime he has with the TRio, not hog it.
    I know it's off topicy here but Team Rocket in the D/P saga hasn't really hogged the camera THAT much. I mean they were a big part of the series as well and they got the right amount of screen time, yet the focus was more on Team Galactic then anything.

    I just wish that in later sagas that TR would go back to being where they were around D/P but with a little touch of seriousness. I know everyone likes badasses and all but there's a right and wrong way to be one (of course, nothing wrong with badasses, my favorite character is one but she's not boring either). And being forceful about it doesn't help as well. I mean what's wrong with blasting off every once upon a time or as someone puts it. the fearhug? Can't they have like *any* type of emotions while *still* being competent?
    Last edited by はるひ; 16th January 2013 at 11:19 PM.

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