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  1. #76
    Registered User Chiplet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by pokemon fan 132 View Post
    With May and Dawn it was other way around. They didn't coached or mentored Ash, starting out as beginners which needed guidance and help from others. And Iris doesn't really coach Ash either.
    And with Ash coaching May and Dawn, they, or especially Dawn, repayed him by teaching him stuff too. If there's anyone that has affected Ash the most, it's Dawn. Watching her Contest Battles and watching her train has improved Ash's skill tremendously. Misty might've been the first ''coach'', or whatever she was, but Dawn was the one who helped him improve as a Trainer the most. If it wasn't for her, Ash wouldn't have learned the spinning dodge, the Counter Shield, the Ice Aqua Jet or other stuff like that, and it was thanks to those kind of strategies that having Ash make it up to the best four was realistic.

    So in the longrun, I'd say that Dawn was the one who affected Ash most as a Trainer, while Brock was the one who truly acted as a coach.

    Oh, and Iris might not coach Ash, but saying that she doesn't contribute to his growth as a Trainer is wrong too. That you should've noticed. After all, Iris was the one who taught Ash about the basics when he first arrived to Unova. He taught him about the Battle Club, she (and Cilan too for that matter) taught him about the Unova Pokémon, and always pointed out type advantages in battles. She even inspired him to continue battling, even when everything seemed hopeless. No main girl has ever had such a huge effect on Ash before, but Iris had. During his 8th Gym Battle, she and Cilan was the reason to why he actually considered battling, and didn't give up.

    Misty definitely coached Ash about the minor basics though, just as Brock did.

  2. #77
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty View Post
    I think Dawn wearing that same pink dress in every Contest was worse than if she just wore her normal clothes in Contests. I think that pink dress ruined her image for some people, and is why people only think of her as being girly rather than a regular trainer where she gave the impression of otherwise.

    Dawn was the most active battler of all the main girls, but the fact that she had to wear a pink dress in every contest made it seem less so. Or something like that.
    I don't quite see how Dawn wearing the same pink dress in every Contest until the Grand Festival ruined her image, unless people really wanted her to wear different outfits for each Contest, or how it make it seem like she was less of an active battler. Outfits don't really have that much of an impact on me and the character's development and personality matters much more in my opinion.

  3. #78
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chiplet View Post

    And with Ash coaching May and Dawn, they, or especially Dawn, repayed him by teaching him stuff too. If there's anyone that has affected Ash the most, it's Dawn. Watching her Contest Battles and watching her train has improved Ash's skill tremendously. Misty might've been the first ''coach'', or whatever she was, but Dawn was the one who helped him improve as a Trainer the most. If it wasn't for her, Ash wouldn't have learned the spinning dodge, the Counter Shield, the Ice Aqua Jet or other stuff like that, and it was thanks to those kind of strategies that having Ash make it up to the best four was realistic.

    So in the longrun, I'd say that Dawn was the one who affected Ash most as a Trainer, while Brock was the one who truly acted as a coach.

    Oh, and Iris might not coach Ash, but saying that she doesn't contribute to his growth as a Trainer is wrong too. That you should've noticed. After all, Iris was the one who taught Ash about the basics when he first arrived to Unova. He taught him about the Battle Club, she (and Cilan too for that matter) taught him about the Unova Pokémon, and always pointed out type advantages in battles. She even inspired him to continue battling, even when everything seemed hopeless. No main girl has ever had such a huge effect on Ash before, but Iris had. During his 8th Gym Battle, she and Cilan was the reason to why he actually considered battling, and didn't give up.

    Misty definitely coached Ash about the minor basics though, just as Brock did.
    I disagree. When he came to Sinnoh , Ash was already experienced trainer, knew a lot about strategy with basics being fully covered. Things you counted didn't influenced his growth as trainer nearly as much like Misty and Brock did. What you counted with Dawn is called adding some of new tricks to already established trainer to better your battling style. When you compare Ash from start of Kanto with Ash at end of Johto/start of Hoenn its noticeable he changed under influence of his friends much more as trainer ,than he did when starting as someone who defeated Brandon before entering Sinnoh with how he was at end of DP.
    Where most of improvement he made by himself ,already having knowledge absorbing new things by observing others later deciding to implement them to already created battling style.

    As far as Iris goes she introduced him with Unova customs, what kind of events take place there etc but she wasn't direct causation which influenced Ash development as trainer. You say she inspired Ash to continue battling?
    With Misty she didn't only inspired Ash to continue battling, but also directly influenced flow of battle and continuation of Ash career as trainer. We can see that through plenty examples.
    When he lost to Ritchie in Indigo league Ash fall down in depression, not seeing point to continue nor listening to anyone until Misty gave him reality check. Before league he took participation easily not training much at all until Misty intervened. One of examples which especially come to mind were when he rather decided to watch battles on TV instead of going outside to train.

    When he challenged gym leader Danny from OI, Misty teasing and criticism underestimating Ash abilities,pushed him to go forward wanting to prove her wrong which resulted in passing challenge and earning badge.
    When battling against Rudy with Starmie being close to defeating Squirtle, Ash was on edge of losing giving up until Misty gave him motivation speech and wake up call in using Squirtle true inner strength which leaded to learn of hydro pump turning tide of duel in his favor. List continues.

    Im in no way denying that Ash learned new things when working with May or Dawn, but they didn't contributed to his growth nearly as much like Misty and Brock did. Who trained him, pointed out his mistakes making sure to correct them,and lifted up his spirit far more.

    When he started journey Ash was completely clueless and immature, didn't knew what pokemon are good to use against each other, had no idea how gyms and league works, often used reckless approach deciding to rely more on luck instead of working and training with pokemon intensively and often let success hitting him in head leading to humiliation afterwards.

    It was Misty who kept him on ground giving him reality check when Ash used to act impulsively when being annoyed by Gary or starting to brag how he is better trainer than he really was, learning how to be more patient and wise.
    She often mentored him along with Brock about type weakness and what kind of approach he should tale toward certain pokemon with certain rivalry which was present between them invoking in Ash desire to try harder which later reflected on his battling style.

    Along with Brock, she served as catalyst to help Ashs growth as trainer when he needed help the most during its rookie days with tips, encouragement, teaching and strong friendship which was established between them leaving impact on his gradual change.
    None of other girls and males which came afterwards helped to make Ash familiarized with real life and how things work, about basics and essence of battling and strategies like those two did.

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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by zakisrage View Post
    3. I really hate how they portrayed Skyla. The game Skyla is very good-hearted and understanding. She even goes out of her way to help an injured Pokemon atop Celestial Tower. The anime Skyla, on the other hand, is rather stuck-up and immature. She denies Badges to Trainers who can't keep up with her. I was very disappointed when I saw that. I couldn't believe seeing one of the nicest Gym Leaders given a personality more like Lt. Surge.
    Ugh, this. The whole sky battle or air battle or whatever in Arceus' name they were calling it was ridiculous and was a black mark against Skyla's name. My husband--who liked Skyla--lost a bit of respect for her because of that bullcrap. The writers could have certainly handled that one a lot better.

    Oh and I liked Max. I found him cute. I know a lot of fans hate him but I thought he was adorkable.
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    Registered User Chiplet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    [QUOTE=pokemon fan 132;4398165I disagree. When he came to Sinnoh , Ash was already experienced trainer, knew a lot about strategy with basics being fully covered. Things you counted didn't influenced his growth as trainer nearly as much like Misty and Brock did.[/QUOTE]

    The fact that he already was an experienced trainer doesn't change the fact that he's still able to develop massively. The way Misty had influenced him did absolutely not have the same affect on him as Dawn had. If I recall correctly, Ash never stopped and was like ''oh, wait, Misty taught me that I shouldn't use this Pokémona against that kind of Pokémon, it's a bad typ typing...''. However, with Dawn, the things he learned was taken up several times in battles, and it was even taken so far that his own rival snapped up on what he had learned.

    The basics might be vital for being a Pokémon Trainer, and it might be what Misty and Brock taught him, but that's something every Trainer learns with time, and it's something that also Ash mostly learned by himself by battling, with Misty and Brock occasionally giving him a tip or two.


    As far as Iris goes she introduced him with Unova customs, what kind of events take place there etc but she wasn't direct causation which influenced Ash development as trainer. You say she inspired Ash to continue battling?
    With Misty she didn't only inspired Ash to continue battling, but also directly influenced flow of battle and continuation of Ash career as trainer. We can see that through plenty examples.
    Oh, you mean that time when she screamed at him and he got annoyed with her? She didn't inspire him in the same friendly way that Iris and Dento did, it was more like a ''you better win sucker''-situation. He wanted to prove himself due to her screaming at him, which made him determined. However, with Iris and Dento, Ash got inspired in the way that he didn't want to let his friends down after they actually had put down all that effort in dressing up as well as getting drums to actually cheer their friend all the way through. You see the difference?

    When he lost to Ritchie in Indigo league Ash fall down in depression, not seeing point to continue nor listening to anyone until Misty gave him reality check.
    You mean that time when she once again screamed at him and he got upset? I barely thought Misty did much that time alone, but it was more like the whole gang of Prof. Oak, Brock, Dehlia AND Misty's effort.

    List continues.
    Go on. Name one time when it was just as big as the time Iris cheered him on.

    When he started journey Ash was completely clueless and immature, didn't knew what pokemon are good to use against each other, had no idea how gyms and league works, often used reckless approach deciding to rely more on luck instead of working and training with pokemon intensively and often let success hitting him in head leading to humiliation afterwards.
    You mean like most beginning Trainers? That's... not really surprising. However, getting into the bascis was something that Ash nearly did all by his own. Misty and Brock supported him, of course, but it was clear to me that Ash learned a lot more by himself by participating in battles and going out on adventures than by them.

    Along with Brock, she served as catalyst to help Ashs growth as trainer when he needed help the most during its rookie days with tips, encouragement, teaching and strong friendship which was established between them leaving impact on his gradual change.
    None of other girls and males which came afterwards helped to make Ash familiarized with real life and how things work, about basics and essence of battling and strategies like those two did.
    I think Dawn, especially, did exactly that, and much more. She actually tries her absolute hardest to cheer Ash up when he's depressed, she even created a whole circus to cheer him up after his loss against Paul. Not to mention that Dawn was the on who believed in Ash the most. While others were unsure if Ash was going to win or not, Dawn often remained confident and smiled when she happily said that she knew that Ash was going to win, which he then did. She had confidence in him, she knew and believed in him, and she's surely the one who had the biggest influence on him.

  6. #81
    Seek the sparrow prince Iteru's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    And for those who saw some disaappearing posts, this is why disagreeing and debates are allowed, because those who step over the line will be dealt with to allow everyone else to have fun.

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    Registered User SimH5's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    I prefer it when the anime is serious. I also like Trip.

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    Crimson Fighter Phoenixphlare's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    1. Pokemon Personalities don't matter that much I'd rather see longer battles then watch creatures that can't talk go through emotional stuff. I'd rather see humans go through emotional stuff.

    2. Breeder, Sommeliers, photographers, coordinators are all pretty uninteresting I'd rather see three trainers collecting badges together and multiple trainers in the main cast in the tournament would give the audience more than one person to root for and would be much more interesting. And it would make the sidekicks beating evil doers more believable. Watching the same gym battle three times wouldn't be as bad as the filler we have now

    3. DP was boring at times but that doesn't matter because the anime always had boring parts and it's better than stupid parts. Lots of shows have bad parts.

    4. Burgundy isn't that good of a character.

    5. Having pokemon poachers as bad guys is stupid because they are just catching pokemon. And not everyone has the ability to catch rare pokes themselves so let them sell them. Having some pokemon be endangered goes and thus not aloud to catch goes against the collecting aspect of the franchise which goes against the bloody point of the bloody show.

    6. Badass normals do not belong in pokemon
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  9. #84
    pokemon fan 132 pokemon fan 132's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chiplet View Post

    The fact that he already was an experienced trainer doesn't change the fact that he's still able to develop massively. The way Misty had influenced him did absolutely not have the same affect on him as Dawn had. If I recall correctly, Ash never stopped and was like ''oh, wait, Misty taught me that I shouldn't use this Pokémona against that kind of Pokémon, it's a bad typ typing...''. However, with Dawn, the things he learned was taken up several times in battles, and it was even taken so far that his own rival snapped up on what he had learned.

    The basics might be vital for being a Pokémon Trainer, and it might be what Misty and Brock taught him, but that's something every Trainer learns with time, and it's something that also Ash mostly learned by himself by battling, with Misty and Brock occasionally giving him a tip or two.
    Taking some of moves from other side and implementing in your battling style =/= hold same weight as teaching someone about basics, getting him familiar with how battle and strategies work preparing him for pokemon world. Basics are most important thing someone has to learn as trainer because it creates groundwork on which story can be build upon allowing trainer to grow forward. Without it there is no foundation set for you to develop and go on bigger, and better things.

    Misty without any doubt influenced Ash as trainer more than Dawn did, since she actually influenced outcome of battle with her tips and motivation, encouraged Ash to change strategy and get out of losing situation. It influenced his pokemon which as result of that learned new attacks. Harsh criticism and arguing forced him to start training his pokemon taking things more seriously, which leaded toward change in character, and provided push and moral boost to pass several challenges.

    When Dawn did such thing? Her contest style only helped enrich Ash current battling style with some new combinations, but she didn't caused change in character, didn't influenced outcome of battles directly and never prepared strategies for Ash, provided tips and worked with him in similar vein like Misty and Brock did.

    I remember Brock preparing battle strategies for Ash helping him to defeat gym leaders, having private talks providing encouragement and giving him mass amount of tips about pokemon and tactics. I remember Misty solving clues for Ash allowing him to even earn right to challenge gym leaders(like Blaine), actually forcing him to train and take competition seriously, offering her pokemon and helping him about what is most suitable strategy to use against certain opponents in Kanto and Johto league, Whirl cup, side tournaments such as fire distinguishing contest etc.

    I actually remember her sarcasm and critics forcing him to try harder and find new ways of battling, not relying only on one or two of his strong pokemon. Such as having tendency to spam rookies with Charizard instead of actually using other pokemon and train to create more balanced team.

    Anyone who watched original series can notice how much Misty and especially Brock helped Ash to grow and advance as trainer, when he needed help the most.

    Oh, you mean that time when she screamed at him and he got annoyed with her? She didn't inspire him in the same friendly way that Iris and Dento did, it was more like a ''you better win sucker''-situation. He wanted to prove himself due to her screaming at him, which made him determined. However, with Iris and Dento, Ash got inspired in the way that he didn't want to let his friends down after they actually had put down all that effort in dressing up as well as getting drums to actually cheer their friend all the way through. You see the difference?
    Your mixing cheering with mentoring. Giving someone motivation and reality check through criticism to go forward, pointing out mistakes will leave far more influence on trainer than simple moral support, since it actually forces him to think of finding way out of tough situations, acknowledge his flaws and grow stronger through every battle as result of that. When did we see with Iris and Cilan putting Ash on ground when he got carried away, making him understand what he did wrong? When did we saw their cheering influencing him to change strategy in middle of battle, which reflected on his pokemon and their performance?
    When did we saw them inspiring Ash in same vein that he started to change his behavior taking tips from other side?

    You mean that time when she once again screamed at him and he got upset? I barely thought Misty did much that time alone, but it was more like the whole gang of Prof. Oak, Brock, Dehlia AND Misty's effort.
    Yet he continued lying in bed losing interest for anything, until Misty came and criticized him.

    Go on. Name one time when it was just as big as the time Iris cheered him on.
    We are talking in here about coach and mentor role someone played to Ash,. Not cheering.
    Cheering is just one form of moral support to give encouragement to trainer when he battles, or competes.

    Examples i mentioned actually directly influenced flow of battles, and leaded toward Ash passing challenges put in front of him. Which is something Iris didn't really did.

    You mean like most beginning Trainers? That's... not really surprising. However, getting into the bascis was something that Ash nearly did all by his own. Misty and Brock supported him, of course, but it was clear to me that Ash learned a lot more by himself by participating in battles and going out on adventures than by them.
    If it wasn't for them and help from outer side Ash wouldn't even pass his first gym battle against Brock, let alone lt. Surge, Blaine, Gary etc. Shows how competent and knowledgeable he was back in day, not even knowing to weaken pokemon and capture it, using worst possible pokemon in several situations which had huge disadvantage, didn't knew what attacks some of his pokemon can use etc.

    Ash wasn't prodigy when he started out. He was completely ignorant, brash and full of himself and if there wasn't for Misty and Brock he wouldn't come as far as he did. I don't even need to mention how much unfamiliar Ash was with how things in real life work and sense of danger, with his naivety often leading him toward disaster if it wasn't for Misty.

    I think Dawn, especially, did exactly that, and much more. She actually tries her absolute hardest to cheer Ash up when he's depressed, she even created a whole circus to cheer him up after his loss against Paul. Not to mention that Dawn was the on who believed in Ash the most. While others were unsure if Ash was going to win or not, Dawn often remained confident and smiled when she happily said that she knew that Ash was going to win, which he then did. She had confidence in him, she knew and believed in him, and she's surely the one who had the biggest influence on him.
    Once again your listing typical examples of cheering and moral support every one of Ash traveling companions provided to him. And basing on what i saw Misty and Brock gave him as much moral support, as Dawn did in different way.

    Which did not only gave him encouragement and strength to advance forward, but also actually teach him about essence of battling, influenced outcome of battles, helped him to beat tough trainers and got him familiar with strategies and wise choice of pokemon in battles influencing him to grow as trainer far more.

    Constantly believing someone can win, can often be counterproductive to his growth creating false belief how he already has situation in his hands, which can easily backfire on you. On other hand doubting in outcome of battle, questioning Ash skills and abilities as trainer can help you to realize your flaws, what you might have done wrong and try to work on fixing that.
    Which Misty reality checks and lowering his ego achieved.

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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    I don't like Hunter J or Team Galactic.

  11. #86
    Has converted to Helixism Miles101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Cilan hasn't really come across as "gay" to me. I dunno, I always viewed everyone without an explicit attraction to anyone as asexual until confirmed or denied, so, yeah. He's just really camp.

  12. #87
    ピンクピンク! Gunaydin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Pokemon should've stuck with the original run of eighty episodes.
    This...is Meowth's dream. Meowth strides all over the globe scattering invitations to other Pokémon, insisting they come to "Meowth's Party". At this wonderful party, guests are packed in like sardines as Meowth climbs up the stage with its faithful guitar. It strikes a chord, pauses, and then rocks their world.

  13. #88
    rest in pieces Winterdaze's Avatar Forum Head
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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrosia-san View Post
    Pokemon should've stuck with the original run of eighty episodes.
    While I don't exactly agree with this, I cannot deny it would have been interesting to see how the anime would have turned out if it followed the original plan and gone more in the direction Takeshi Shudo had wanted it to. I guess we'll never know.

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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty View Post
    This is a bit more in general, but I never understood why people care how girly or how tomboyish each female character is. It actually seems like people base how much they like characters not on their actual characters, but simply if they're girly or tomboyish. I especially don't understand why some also see girly as being bad, but whatever.

    Its something I've never understood in the years I've been in the fandom.
    That debate is by no means exclusive to the Pokemon fandom, or fandom itself for that matter.

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    Default Re: Do you have any unpopular opinions about the anime?

    Misty is the worst traveling girl ever. Dawn has more personality than her.
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