Thread: BW090: The Junior Cup Gets Underway! Kairyu VS Tunbear!!

Originally Posted by Gym Leader Burgh

I DUNNO GUYS, HOW ARE THE WRITERS GOING TO WRITE OUT OF THIS ONE?

They better do something, because from what we know so far this tournament might be another Iris writers wankfest.

I really don't get the logic with the writers giving Iris a Dragonite before the tournament. Axew just learned a new move, poor guy is getting neglected again so Iris can take the easy route.

Having Iris use Dragonite really isn't too weird if you ask me. After all, it is Langley she's battling. I don't know if you've missed it or not, but if I recall correctly, Langley loves to crush Dragon-types. She has several times asked Iris to hurry up and become a Dragon Master, so that Langley can finally start recognizing her as a worthy rival, and she's always upset when Iris isn't using her Axew, the Dragon-type, in battles. Like that time Ash and Iris battled in the finale, and when she in the Don Tournament was irritated because of Iris using Excadrill instead of Axew.

We all know that Langley doesn't care too much about a victory if it's not against a Dragon-type, and she's even trying to act like a loss doesn't really matter either as long as it's not a Dragon-type. Now, when Langley finally gets the chance to battle a Dragon-type user, knowing that Iris has Axew, she might once again mock (like she did in BW33) to make her use Axew, as she won't be satisfied with Excadrill and Emolga. Iris, who previously lost big time when she used Axew against Langley, will definitely feel persuaded in using Axew to shut the mouth of Langley's by using a Dragon-type, and since Axew is still a bit too weak to handle an Ice-type she naturally goes with Dragonite, her newly caught and certainly very strong Dragon-type.

I mean, Iris hasn't been afraid to use Pokémon that doesn't completely obey her before during dire situations. Just look at that time when Scolipede attacked, or when she, Emolga and Axew were caught with those Swoobat. She's very impulsive, and can be annoyed rather easily, so I can definitely see Langley easily persuading her to use a Dragon-type against her Ice-type.

Axew defeating Beartic would have a whole lot more impact than Iris just randomly being given a Dragonite, and using that to defeat her. It's lazy on Iris' part using Dragonite, given that Langley has trained that Beartic since the beginning.

Why, of course it would. Although all I was saying is that I really didn't think it'd be strange for her to use Dragonite against Langley, as she conveniently enough had it in her possession. I wouldn't have used Axew if I was her, considering how it even didn't get a hit in their last battle. And as lots of people have already stated, ''Axew hasn't done a single thing since that battle against Golett'', so why would she want to use Axew in a battle like this? The best thing to do would be for her to save it to a battle where she won't have to battle an Ice-type, increasing Axew's chance by winning slightly, right? And you might consider it to be lazy, but that won't change the fact that it was still a better choice than to you Excadrill, and it's not really like Axew won't get a chance to battle later if they actually proceed.

Now, I'm still not a fan of her getting Dragonite, all I'm saying that having Iris use Dragonite against Langley really isn't too strange.

Fuck Iris, Ash, Trip, Georgia, Bianca, Dawn, or Cilan winning. #Team Cabarnet bitches!

Really and truly speaking now, at this point I wouldn't be surprised if Iris in fact whipped out a secret badge case, had other Pokemon somewhere in storage, and revealed that she would be Ash's new rival this saga.

When one of Ash's friends threatens how well he does on his quest that's when you know things are craptastic. I really wonder how the writers are going to make any logic of this.

While I have no problems with the Dratini line in general I just had a bad feeling about the heavily Dragonite promotion in the preview vids and poster. Honestly, how did Iris eveb get that thing into a ball?

I can't say I'm surprised by this because I kind of had a feeling that this tournament would be shitty as soon as Trip being the winner looked like a very likely outcome. Having Iris win again would literally just make me slap myself a thousand times and scream "Why!" And to think I actually am an Iris fan, off the battle field of course and I'm pretty sure you all can see why. It's...just...not...right.

In any profession in life, if you want something you HAVE to work hard to get it. If you don't it's just meaningless. It doesn't matter if you sleep with your boss or your family's in the business. If you want to be taken seriously you have to bust your ass.

Iris' ass has yet to even break a sweat, therefore no one can take her development seriously. Still appreciate her unique design and her funny moments on the side though and I'll even still say I like her off the battle field. Yeah I now, she could train more and be more productive but when she's doing other things she can be likeable and fun. That's the Iris I like and wish was showed more.

And to think, Misty beating Ash was such a big deal back in 2002. Honestly based on the way Iris has been handled(and I promise I'm not trying to start a flame war), but I am SO happy I never took Misty for granted when she was on the show.

Misty left a lot up to imagination with her team, her battles(or lack thereof) and her goal; but Iris just leaves me scared.

On the plus side though, it's good to know Georgia is entering. Let's hope Cabby is too :)

Originally Posted by ivantuga2

Originally Posted by Adyniz

Title: BW090: ジュニアカップ開幕！カイリューVSツンベアー！！
Translation: The Junior Cup Gets Underway! Kairyu VS Tsunbear!!

Originally Posted by Adyniz

Screenplay: Junki Takegami

Goodness me, where are the glory days of Sinnoh, when Atsuhiro Tomioka was charged with almost all the important stuff (heck, he wrote all the Wallace Cup episodes!) and was an ACTUAL head writer of the series!?

Washed away in a sea of executive meddling and fan whining

Let's see how long this tournament will last... around 3-5 episodes, I guess?

That's what I'm wondering about. Wouldn't susrpise me if after all that hype, the Jr. Tournament is basically a glorified version of the Don tournaments with Important Game Characters getting screwed over/short changed instead of recurring & anime exclusive ones (I weep for Tanooki Suit Guy and Pink Haired Vegeta ;_; )

Tournament has to be at least 5 episodes there's too many characters.

Sweet goodness, I will vomit if this is the writers way of giving Kibago the run around. Iwane said a little while back that Kibago evolving wasn't ruled out completely, I'm guessing that now it is ruled out, and Kairyu is going to be Iris' "Ononokusu" oh, gawd why. Why is my favorite Dragon Family being given the middle-finger for Poke-Barney? Kairyu, please kindly fuck off.

I'm actually formulating theories regarding the matter.

Theory 1#

-Kairyu is the NEW Lizardon, disobedient. Iris will have him temporary. Shaga will be spectating the World Tournament, he'll see Kairyu and see something's up. Iris will give Kairyu to Shaga or will send the Dragon knight off to the Charicific Valley a.k.a Dragon Village.

Theory #2

-Iris was planning to use Kibago, but Kairyu jumped in and took its place coming out of the ball on its own. It fights on its own and gets its shit busted and has to go live with Shaga for further healing or something.

Theory #3

-The Sanzandora Kairyu was fighting last episode is connected to Iris in the aspect that Kairyu was trying to fight it or something. Or Sanzandora is Langley's and Kairyu wants to spite Langley, thus fights under Iris.

Theory #4

-Kairyu is the type of Dragon Langley hates. Or the Pokemon itself is responsible for her past experiences and somewhat hatred toward Dragons. I'm thinking this Pokemon itself beat her before or was under her ownership at some point.

On a somewhat different note, I hope Takeshi returns. The Pokemon Center is bound to need more doctors for all the injured Pokemon or something. I could totally picture Takeshi following Nurse Joi to Isshu.

Originally Posted by Moe

There's a big difference though - dragons are specifically mentioned as hard to train and evolve. It's why Gible was always unlikely to evolve, because compared to other Pokemon they take such a significant amount of work and near exclusive training.

The only problem that Ash's Gible ever had with battling was mastering its Draco Meteor attack, and it took the pokemon well over twenty episodes after it was caught to actually perfect the move. No other Dragon-type pokemon so far ever experienced any problems using this attack, so this problem was one that Ash's Gible in particular had to overcome.

Also keep in mind that some of Ash's other pokemon, such as Corphish or Buizel, had been in his party for over a hundred episodes and never evolved. Whether one or more of Ash's pokemon evolve in a series is determined at the writing staff's discretion, and does not necessarily reflect the notion that Dragon-type pokemon are harder to train than pokemon with other typings.

The writers could have easily given Iris a Dratini or some other non-evolved pokemon that she had to spend dozens of episodes to train and raise for evolution, but instead they went with the quicker route and decided to have her catch a fully evolved pokemon instead.

It is clear that Iris, with her current team of pokemon, was going to be at a disadvantage during the Junior Cup, so the writers decided to "level out" the playing field by giving her a third-stage pokemon as well. Excadrill and Emolga probably would not have made it past the first round of this tournament if they were used; Excadrill barely etched out a draw when it fought Georgia's Beartic last time. We can't say that Emolga is particularly powerful, either. Cilan has a powerhouse that he can use to win a few matches in this tournament. Ash has nearly half a dozen powerhouses that he can use in this tournament. Now Iris has a powerhouse in the form of this Dragonite.

Originally Posted by Moe

Something that should have been made clear with Iris and Axew's slow progress, but instead Axew seems to power up on demand before big tournaments.

And the difference between Axew learning a new attack while it is in the losing end of a battle and another character's pokemon learning a new attack immediately after evolving or after experiencing an emotional upheaval is?

Originally Posted by Masurao

Axew defeating Beartic would have a whole lot more impact than Iris just randomly being given a Dragonite, and using that to defeat her.

But if that was the case and Axew did win against Beartic, there would have been a storm of complaints that Axew's victory over Beartic in this situation was "cheap and undeserved" because it learned a few attacks without training on-screen first.

Originally Posted by Gliscor'd

Tournament has to be at least 5 episodes there's too many characters.

Yeah, and especially with the fact that the battle between Iris and Langley is the first battle.

If the Iris/Langley battle together with the exhibition match takes up the whole episode it surely won't be enough with just four episodes, not with the addition of Dawn to cast, and Langley (and hopefully Burgundy) joining too.

Originally Posted by Chiplet

inb4 bomb of Iris bashing

No, but seriously, I really don't like the idea of Iris getting Dragonite at all, and I must say that I was quite disappointed when I was told about it. It's just not... right. Hopefully it won't be anything that will stick with her forever, maybe it's just a temporary capture or something (please).

Now, I do not at all hate Dragonite as a Pokémon, in fact it's one of my favorites, although seeing Iris getting such a powerful Pokémon just like that is just the same thing as that time when Dawn received Togekiss. I'll be praying for Dragonite to at least have an interesting personality, and for it to not steal away focus from Axew. I've gotten the feeling that Iris has finally began to take Axew's training more seriously, and I really hope that this capture won't be the end of all that training.

Hm, I believe that I'll wait until the episode has actually aired before I make any stupid conclusions.

Now then, on the bright side, Langley might actually be in this tournament after all? Awesome! I was feeling really down when I didn't see her (or Burgundy) in the opening, but I guess they were only focusing on Ash's rivals in it? No matter, seeing her again might mean that Burgundy returns too, so I won't complain. Although seeing either her or Iris going out in the first round, in the first battle, really isn't an idea that I'm fond of. :/

I have to agree with you on the Iris catching Dragonite bit. A Pokemon of that standard doesn't deserve to be with Iris. She's not good enough. I sure hope this is just a one-shot deal, because if they're not willing to have the star character (Ash) have a pseudo-legendary, then why is Iris so special that she can have one??? Ever since Ash caught Gible, I was so looking forward to a Garchomp in his possession (along with the head-biting quirk, which would've been pretty funny if it happened), but NO. So why does that arrogant dragon trainer wannabe get a pseudo-legedary!? I hope Georgia CRUSHES her, DESTROYS her, ANNIHILATES her!!! Iris should've been axed long ago, and if this whole Dragonite thing is a reality, then the show has really gone too far. Besides, Iris has finally taken Axew's training seriously, and all of a sudden, this beefed up dragon shows up!? Then what is the point of Axew at this point!? Seriously... this is the last straw.

Please for the love of Mike let Iris loose before Dento and Ash, for the love of Mike. Shes done no training, hasn't had the right to earn any of this all of her Pokemon getting these powerful moves out of the air and now this? Why? Do the writers just think we love Iris or some thing? As far as I know shes the least liked of the female cast and Pokemon Best Wishes cast altogether, so why keep giving her all this special treatment? Don't they want fans to like her?

Since I don't know the background story behind Dragonite's capture (none yet does, actually) , I can't say how illogical it is but on the whole I don't mind it that much, though I'm not thrilled about it either. I've learned to accept the fact that Axew probably won't evolve ever, no matter what his dream may be , because the writers made him to be a comic character like Ash's Oshawott. Imagine a Fraxure or a Haxorus coming out of Iris's hair, the fact that he has learned Outrage and Giga Impact alredy proves that he won't go beyond this; maybe they'll give him Dragon Dance but that's about it.
It's true that Iris doesn't deserve any last stage Dragon type pokemon because she is very low on the trainer scale, and the fact that I didn't like her from the start doesn't help her case ( if I hear her one more time say " kodomo nee" = what a kid I'm going to scream). What I would really like like is to see her lose to Ash in a crushing defeat, am I the only one who want's to see this?

Originally Posted by Shinneth

But I can't enjoy the show when it's a constant stream of bullshit... and I can't relax when I know the writers can do WAY BETTER than this. There's only this empty shell that vaguely resembles hope that keeps me going to look for the good bits. It's like finding a straw of hay in a pile of needles. ._.

No, no, by enjoying the show I meant the shitstorm in the forums that happened because of the whole Dragonite-thing. It is sometimes more entertaining than the anime itself. ^^ Maybe it is just me but I enjoyed Pokémon the most whenever I lowered my expectations. Satoshi's plot in DP was the only exeption to me. I like Pokémon for its wacky plots, sad episodes, the Pokémon itself and good animated battles which is why usually I don't have strong feelings for badly written stuff like the whole Dragonite stuff.

Originally Posted by Shinneth

It's the Unova equivalent of Ursaring. Just like how Venipede are the new Beedrill/Onix before Onix reappeared.

It is really too bad though. I really like the Kumasyun line but the overexposure is overkill. :/

Originally Posted by Lucian947

It's true that Iris doesn't deserve any last stage Dragon type pokemon because she is very low on the trainer scale, and the fact that I didn't like her from the start doesn't help her case ( if I hear her one more time say " kodomo nee" = what a kid I'm going to scream). What I would really like like is to see her lose to Ash in a crushing defeat, am I the only one who want's to see this?

I couldn't agree more. Iris has not deserved such an honor. She's done the least of all female protagonists. I used to hate Misty, but compared to Iris, I'm would kiss that redhead's feet, begging her to come back, axing Iris forever. I would LOVE, that's L-O-V-E, LOVE LOVE LOVE to Iris get crushed by Ash. I have had enough of those "You're such a kid." lines to the point if she says it once more, I will scream so loud you can hear me in space! Please, merciful heavens, remove the bane of the Pokemon world's existence forever with a CRUSHING defeat!!!