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Thread: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

  1. #2176

    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Sorry if I'm posting this in the wrong place (I probably am), but who do I contact to get my Bulbapedia username changed? Currently I'm Dannyjenn but I want it changed to Xenidal (which is what I go by now). If an admin here has the power to do so then you can go ahead and do it for me...

    Also, I was wondering if there's a way to clear my user talk page? I deleted everything from it but someone undid the edit, saying it was against the rules. I just want to get rid of some old clutter that's no longer relevant (not wure why there's a rule against that...). After looking at the rules, I see something about archiving the page but I'm a bit confused on how that's done and what it does exactly. Anyone know?

  2. #2177
    Rocket traditionalist Hunter Blade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Okay, to start off. The Pedia is different than the forums. Can't just have your name changed whenever you feel like you want to go by a different name. I'm not sure if you'd even be allowed to, since you've only made 3 edits since last March. If you're never around to use the account, why bother trying to change your Pedia name? Just a thought.

    Second, are you sure you really want to archive your page right now? You barely have anything on it. Most users won't make an archive page until it hits between 15-25 sections. But yes, it's against the rules to delete comments on most talk pages except under extreme circumstances (or if you figure out an answer to your own question within a few minutes of asking), but most of the time that will be an admin's job. It's not so much as "We don't want you doing it just because we say so" as it is a sort of record keeping of who said what, where they said it, and what it's a response to. Not all conversations take place on the same page, moving from an article's talk page, to a user's talk page, to somebody else's talk page when we're trying to figure stuff out. If half of those comments are deleted then it'd get very frustrating to try finding the details if something goes wrong.
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  3. #2178
    Fish fingers and custard Werdnae's Avatar Former Bulbapedia Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    To archive your talk page, use the "move page" function to move it to the location of your choice (provided it stays in your user talk or userspace). Then replace the redirect that automatically gets created with a link to that page so that people can find the archived talk pages.
    Thanks Jo The Marten for the avatar.
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  4. #2179
    A real monstrosity SnorlaxMonster's Avatar Bulbanews Deputy Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Aviator Zero View Post
    Shows what I know. According to the most recent edition, which we don't have have a page for yet, the first 646 Pokémon all have official pronunciations. In the preview for the B/W guide, Ampharos is said to be pronounced Amf-uh-ross, one of its original pronunciations (the other being Amf-uh-rous). That makes 648 explicitly phoneticized names (though Kel-di-ou and Mel-ou-et-uh have been said enough times to be essentially official, and the Gen VI starters aren't very difficult to guess).

    So, we have the official pronunciations of nearly every Pokémon's name in English. I know it's been denied before, but why can't we put this information on each Pokémon's page? I mean... it's official. It'd just be adding a little extra section to the main info box called "English Name Pronunciation".

    I really dislike the officially used phonetic system since it mixes actual phonetic symbols with convenient English words. It reminds me of kiddy science books that typed out STEG-guh-SOAR-us and the like. Could we use it in conjunction with the IPA (not the shorthand I typed two paragraphs ago, but the symbols used in my previous comment)?

    I really don't see how a little text box with useful, official information and a link to the IPA guide can be discouraged. I wouldn't bet against it, though. Hell, I'd buy the guide myself if no one else has it and is willing to either edit each page themselves or paste all of the pronunciations on the forum to share.
    I have The Official Pokémon Handbook, The Official Pokémon Handbook 2, The Official Pokémon Handbook 3, Pokémon Kanto Handbook (no BP article), and Pokémon Ultimate Handbook (the latter of which I can't find), both of which have pronunciations in them. Some of these even conflict (e.g. BLAST-oys in OPH and BLAS-toys in PKH; GLIE-gar in OPH2 and GLIE-ger in OPH3), as well as minor formatting differences that still essentially result in the same pronunciation.

    Someone has made a list of all the pronunciations here. While I disagree with a lot of the way they interpretted the Pokedex 3D Pro names (e.g. the game goes say BUL-buh-sore like guides say, not BUL-bul-zore), it is a fairly detailed list.

    The issue I have with using IPA over the official system is that IPA is not official. There will be arguments about which is correct if we use IPA, whereas if we only use sourced pronunciations there is no subjectivity issue. Of course, with all the different official pronunciations, I don't know if it is even practical to list them.

  5. #2180

    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by SnorlaxMonster View Post
    Someone has made a list of all the pronunciations here. While I disagree with a lot of the way they interpretted the Pokedex 3D Pro names (e.g. the game goes say BUL-buh-sore like guides say, not BUL-bul-zore), it is a fairly detailed list.

    The issue I have with using IPA over the official system is that IPA is not official. There will be arguments about which is correct if we use IPA, whereas if we only use sourced pronunciations there is no subjectivity issue. Of course, with all the different official pronunciations, I don't know if it is even practical to list them.
    Well, the Pokédex 3D Pro also says things like Ven-oʊ̯-mɑθ and Ven-oʊ̯-næt, unnaturally turning the second syllable of each from an unstressed "uh" to a falling "oh." I'd trust the most recent edition of the complete handbook (Ultimate) over an app that lists things like Char-MEAL-un, Po-NEE-tuh, and ILL-eck-trode.

    I suggested in conjunction with, not over the official phonetics. If precision is an issue, we'd have to agree on a Handbook pronunciation first and then base the IPA on it. If you'd let me, I'd add the IPA text below it since I: can read IPA, am a phonetics enthusiast, always try to be perfectly accurate, have heard these names in plenty of English media to know what they are, and have read enough kids books to know what "Bell-LAHS-um" sounds like.
    If arguments arise, or it proves to be problematic from the outset, we'll just stick with one of the official pronunciations. If multiple, I say we vote. Or, just omit that Pokémon's pronunciation until later publications/anime appearances/name-dropping consecutively confirm one (Kyurem comes to mind).

    If this is seriously being considered (please!), it would need its own thread.

    P.S. Better IPA link.
    Last edited by Aviator Zero; 16th January 2013 at 01:33 AM.

  6. #2181

    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter Blade View Post
    Okay, to start off. The Pedia is different than the forums. Can't just have your name changed whenever you feel like you want to go by a different name. I'm not sure if you'd even be allowed to, since you've only made 3 edits since last March. If you're never around to use the account, why bother trying to change your Pedia name? Just a thought.
    It's not like I'm requesting to change it willy-nilly "whenever I feel like it"... Xenidal is the name I go by now (here and on other forums) and I'd prefer it be the same on Bulbapedia. I'm not asking for a name change on Bulbapedia every time I change my name on here (which I haven't done except that one time)... surely a one-time name change is possible.
    And as for me not making many edits with it, that is true, but when I occassionally do use it then it'd be nice to go by the name I now use and not my old name. I guess it's not too big a deal but I'd still like a name change.
    @Werdnae - you're an editor, so could you please do it (for the reason I just gave)?

    Second, are you sure you really want to archive your page right now? You barely have anything on it. Most users won't make an archive page until it hits between 15-25 sections. But yes, it's against the rules to delete comments on most talk pages except under extreme circumstances (or if you figure out an answer to your own question within a few minutes of asking), but most of the time that will be an admin's job. It's not so much as "We don't want you doing it just because we say so" as it is a sort of record keeping of who said what, where they said it, and what it's a response to. Not all conversations take place on the same page, moving from an article's talk page, to a user's talk page, to somebody else's talk page when we're trying to figure stuff out. If half of those comments are deleted then it'd get very frustrating to try finding the details if something goes wrong.
    Yeah, but all that stuff that's on my talk page is old (as in, the most recent post on that page was from March of last year). Maybe it's just me but I don't see the point in keeping useless clutter around that is no longer relevant (not even useful for "figuring out details of a conversation" since those conversations are long-since dead). If it were more recent I wouldn't care. But anyway, maybe I'll just archive it. Or leave it as it is, since I hardly use it.

  7. #2182
    A real monstrosity SnorlaxMonster's Avatar Bulbanews Deputy Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Aviator Zero View Post
    Well, the Pokédex 3D Pro also says things like Ven-oʊ̯-mɑθ and Ven-oʊ̯-næt, unnaturally turning the second syllable of each from an unstressed "uh" to a falling "oh." I'd trust the most recent edition of the complete handbook (Ultimate) over an app that lists things like Char-MEAL-un, Po-NEE-tuh, and ILL-eck-trode.
    Just so you know, I strongly disagree with a lot of that user's phonetic respellings of the Pokedex 3D Pro names (e.g. Charmeleon is undeniably 4 syllables in Pokedex 3D Pro, and is actually char-MEAL-ee-un). If we could put audio files on the wiki (which we can't for technical reasons) I would put both the Pokedex 3D Pro pronunciation and cry on articles.

    Also, I wouldn't say that Venonat/Venomoth's Pokedex 3D Pro pronunciation is that unnatural. It's also partly as a result of the tone in which the speaker is saying all of the names.

    I suggested in conjunction with, not over the official phonetics. If precision is an issue, we'd have to agree on a Handbook pronunciation first and then base the IPA on it. If you'd let me, I'd add the IPA text below it since I: can read IPA, am a phonetics enthusiast, always try to be perfectly accurate, have heard these names in plenty of English media to know what they are, and have read enough kids books to know what "Bell-LAHS-um" sounds like.
    It's funny that you use Bellossom as an example, because the handbooks phonetically spell it bell-AWE-some. If there is a single objective way to render the phonetic respellings as IPA, I suppose that they could accompany it.

    If arguments arise, or it proves to be problematic from the outset, we'll just stick with one of the official pronunciations. If multiple, I say we vote. Or, just omit that Pokémon's pronunciation until later publications/anime appearances/name-dropping consecutively confirm one (Kyurem comes to mind).
    I think it is better to list all the pronunciations rather than voting on one.

    If this is seriously being considered (please!), it would need its own thread.
    It probably would. These posts could be split out of this thread into a new one, but I don't have mod powers here. I'm also not sure if it is necessary.

  8. #2183
    Rocket traditionalist Hunter Blade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Xenidal View Post
    It's not like I'm requesting to change it willy-nilly "whenever I feel like it"... Xenidal is the name I go by now (here and on other forums) and I'd prefer it be the same on Bulbapedia. I'm not asking for a name change on Bulbapedia every time I change my name on here (which I haven't done except that one time)... surely a one-time name change is possible.
    And as for me not making many edits with it, that is true, but when I occassionally do use it then it'd be nice to go by the name I now use and not my old name. I guess it's not too big a deal but I'd still like a name change.


    Yeah, but all that stuff that's on my talk page is old (as in, the most recent post on that page was from March of last year). Maybe it's just me but I don't see the point in keeping useless clutter around that is no longer relevant (not even useful for "figuring out details of a conversation" since those conversations are long-since dead). If it were more recent I wouldn't care. But anyway, maybe I'll just archive it. Or leave it as it is, since I hardly use it.
    I understand, it was just a general explanation since there are people who wouldn't understand why they can't change their name. I'd rather get that out of the way sooner than later, even if it isn't a problem with you. Sorry if it seems like I'm trying to discourage you from asking, by all means go ahead and ask~ I just wanted to let you know ahead of time why you might not be allowed to.

    And basically, what I said for archiving your page was the same. Answering questions ahead of time, giving reasons as to why we have that rule... but honestly, I do know what you mean. My talk page is only used every half year or so, if even that much. Like with requesting for your name to be changed, go ahead and archive if you want. :) I'm not trying to stop you. I was just surprised that somebody wanted to archive when their talk has barely been used.

    Sorry if my first answer seemed a little harsh, I just reread it and it comes across that way a little bit.
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  9. #2184
    Fish fingers and custard Werdnae's Avatar Former Bulbapedia Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Xenidal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter Blade View Post
    Okay, to start off. The Pedia is different than the forums. Can't just have your name changed whenever you feel like you want to go by a different name. I'm not sure if you'd even be allowed to, since you've only made 3 edits since last March. If you're never around to use the account, why bother trying to change your Pedia name? Just a thought.
    It's not like I'm requesting to change it willy-nilly "whenever I feel like it"... Xenidal is the name I go by now (here and on other forums) and I'd prefer it be the same on Bulbapedia. I'm not asking for a name change on Bulbapedia every time I change my name on here (which I haven't done except that one time)... surely a one-time name change is possible.
    And as for me not making many edits with it, that is true, but when I occassionally do use it then it'd be nice to go by the name I now use and not my old name. I guess it's not too big a deal but I'd still like a name change.
    @Werdnae - you're an editor, so could you please do it (for the reason I just gave)?
    Can you leave a message on my talk page about this, so that I can be absolutely certain that I'm looking at the right account. I'd also appreciate it if you made a few more recent mainspace edits, it's actually a fair bit of work to rename a wiki account, and I'd need to know I'm not going to do it for the account to be basically abandoned.
    Thanks Jo The Marten for the avatar.
    Demons run when a good man goes to war.
    Night will fall and drown the sun,
    when a good man goes to war.
    Friendship dies and true love lies,
    night will fall and the dark will rise,
    when a good man goes to war.
    Demons run, but count the cost.
    The battle's won, but the child is lost.

  10. #2185

    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    I've noticed that, despite no actual policy, a lot of the Trivia entries that extend out of the pokemon universe and into other, real Life things get deleted. Often without a reason given. I know that sometimes, this is understandable when something is vague but...

    Well in my case, my edit to the Gothita page pointed out that its dressed like Klaus Nomi. Because, you know, its dressed like Klaus Nomi. But this was deleted, without response to my justification for its inclusion. But I'm not looking for disupte resolution, just using it as an example. This happens quite a lot, it situations where its impossible to deny the connection.

    Id really like to see a ruling on this, one way or another. Because it seems some people have taken it upon themselves to rid Bulbapedia of any such references, almost universally without stating why. In one case, the Trivia section was simply deleted without comment.

    So yeah, please, tell us how this is supposed to work. What criteria are required for a non-pokemon reference within a pokemon game to be included in a Trivia section, and what should be avoided.

  11. #2186
    Bulbapedia Administrator Force Fire's Avatar Bulbapedia Staff
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by deluachu View Post
    I've noticed that, despite no actual policy, a lot of the Trivia entries that extend out of the pokemon universe and into other, real Life things get deleted. Often without a reason given. I know that sometimes, this is understandable when something is vague but...

    Well in my case, my edit to the Gothita page pointed out that its dressed like Klaus Nomi. Because, you know, its dressed like Klaus Nomi. But this was deleted, without response to my justification for its inclusion. But I'm not looking for disupte resolution, just using it as an example. This happens quite a lot, it situations where its impossible to deny the connection.

    Id really like to see a ruling on this, one way or another. Because it seems some people have taken it upon themselves to rid Bulbapedia of any such references, almost universally without stating why. In one case, the Trivia section was simply deleted without comment.

    So yeah, please, tell us how this is supposed to work. What criteria are required for a non-pokemon reference within a pokemon game to be included in a Trivia section, and what should be avoided.
    I have a proposed trivia policy if you want to look at it, however, don't take it as official.

    Also, Gothita looks nothing like Klaus. nothing. It is pure opinion.

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  12. #2187
    A real monstrosity SnorlaxMonster's Avatar Bulbanews Deputy Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    To put what Force Fire said more broadly: opinions are not permitted in articles. As for the relevant policy, this is found below the editing box:
    Please only submit information you know to be accurate, and adhere to a neutral point of view. Do not misrepresent rumors, misconceptions or opinions as fact.

  13. #2188

    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    I like the idea of size comparison

  14. #2189
    Rocket traditionalist Hunter Blade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by crayzeerayquaza View Post
    I like the idea of size comparison
    Comparison of Pokemon to trainers? Or did I miss a post from the past few pages?

    That's a cool idea, but unfortunately GameFreak took out the size comparison feature from the Gen. V Pokedex, so we'd only have the Dex up to Arceus covered.
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  15. #2190
    A real monstrosity SnorlaxMonster's Avatar Bulbanews Deputy Editor-in-Chief
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    Default Re: Suggestions, ideas, and problems

    Quote Originally Posted by crayzeerayquaza View Post
    I like the idea of size comparison
    Veekun has a pretty cool system set up that does this. It's much harder to do on BP though.

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