Thread: BW 107 "Satoshi VS Kotetsu! Secret Weapon Sazandora!!"

Didn't someone predict that Kotetsu would forget to bring six pokemon? I gotta say, that's a cheap way to save time.

Also, how much damage did unfezant take?

If this episode doesn't prove that Ash's Unova team is crap, I don't know what does. Now that the league is over, most of Ash's Unova Pokemon didn't get a single win.

Pikachu carried Ash through this league, and only Pignite and the Krok did decently otherwise. Scaggy just got a simple throwaway battle. I just can't believe how bad this team is. They weren't prepared at all, even Oshawott and Snivy just got steamrolled over.

I mean WTF? I keep on thinking this is like the writers idea of a sick joke, giving Ash a pathetic team so he can lose early in a league to a guy who is only using 5 Pokemon.

What happened to the Ash of AG and DP? Bring him back. Even the Ash of Johto was smarter than this.

well atleast writers know that Nattorei doesn't really like fire.

Could Ash have picked a worse team for this battle? Okay, sure, Pikachu (mega duh) and Pignite were good ideas. Boldore is fair, but not the greatest. Snivy, Oshawott and Unfezant were the pits. Leavanny, Palpitoad, and Krookodile would've been much better choices. All three of them are much better battlers. Heck, Scraggy could do better than Oshawott or Unfezant. The writers spent too much time on marketing instead of giving Ash a decent party to use. Again, Leavanny, Palpitoad, Krookodile, Pignite, and Pikachu are proving to be his powerhouses of Unova, but it's still not great. His Sinnoh team, and even his Hoenn team were far better than this.

On top of that Kotetsu takes dense to a new level. Ferrothorn vs. Pignite? Anyone could see that result a mile away. Swanna vs. Pikachu? Ditto what was said about Pignite. If snapping his headband makes him smarter (supposedly), then even he should've realized they were terrible match-ups. But me thinks he snapped his headband too much, cause his brain seems to be nonfunctional. And on top of that, his Hydreigon is his "secret weapon"? Some secret weapon. Word of wisdom, Kotetsu, if you call something your "secret weapon", save it for the end, not the start. Then it makes it more impressive. Riolu/Lucario has proven to be a far better secret weapon than Hydreigon.

On a side note, I think Kotetsu may actually have a sixth Pokemon. According to the next episode, there is a Druddigon listed, but has no trainer (yet), so I'm guessing that it belongs to him. But I could be wrong on that.

Anyway, one of the worst league episodes to date. And I'm disappointed in both Ash and Kotetsu. I hope Ash wins, because this is becoming an embarrassment.

From what I've heard, Kotetsu sounds like the village idiot. How did we get from Ash losing to the strongest trainer in Sinnoh, to losing to this nimrod?

Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty

If this episode doesn't prove that Ash's Unova team is crap, I don't know what does. Now that the league is over, most of Ash's Unova Pokemon didn't get a single win.

Actually, half of Ash's pokemon didn't get a single on-screen win. Leavanny, Boldore, Oshawott, Unfezant, and Snivy. The others won at least one battle.

You'd be right if you did not count Palpitoad's tie over Zebstrika, but he still knocked it out.

Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty

What happened to the Ash of AG and DP? Bring him back. Even the Ash of Johto was smarter than this.

The writers had Ash win battles in past leagues using just one or two pokemon, too.

Ash vs. Macey- Two victories with a pokemon he caught from Kanto, one victory with a pokemon he caught in Johto (can be compared to Ash vs. Conway)
Ash vs. Jackson- One victory with a pokemon he caught from the same region, One victory with a pokemon he caught from Kanto. A tie. (can be compared with Ash vs. Maylene, or even Ash vs. Stephan)
Ash vs. Paul- Half of the battles were won by a single pokemon. Three other pokemon won one battle each. Two fall guys. (can almost be compared to Ash vs. Gary, except one pokemon won two battles each back then, and there were three fall guys.)
Ash vs. Katie- Two pokemon win a battle each. Two other pokemon won a single battle each. Two fall guys. (can almost be compared to this battle; Ash has two of his pokemon win twice here.)
Ash vs. Morrison- Three battles won by a single pokemon (albeit Ash's opponent didn't give his all until the end). One battle each won by three pokemon. Two fall guys. Ash probably would have lost this one if Morrison gave it his all at the start.
Ash vs. Tyson- Two battles won by a single pokemon. One battle each won by three pokemon. Two fall guys.
Ash vs. Drake (Orange Islands)- Two battles won by a single pokemon. One battle each won by four pokemon. One fall guy.

It's not a matter of Ash being a smarter or stupider trainer than he had been in the past. It's simply a matter of the pokemon that Ash has decided to use here when he faces his opponent's pokemon. How would Ash know that Kotetsu would send out a Hydreigon off the bat? At least Ash was being very smart with his battle choices when he had his Boldore (who knew Rock Smash) and Pignite (who knew Brick Break) to battle it. Hydreigon is a pseudo-legendary.

Ash fought two pseudo-legendaries in the past, and it nearly required half of his team to win those battles too. Ash had to give up Swellow, who was exhausted battling two other pokemon, and Grovyle just to have Pikachu stop Tyson's Metagross. Three of Ash's pokemon--Charizard, Squirtle, and Tauros--who were exhausted from battle lost to Drake's Dragonite so Pikachu could get a win.

I don't think Ash is the stupid trainer here. The writers didn't give him too many evolved pokemon off the bat this time, but it does not mean that his teams weren't treated as shoddy in the past. Half of Ash's victories in the past were won by one or two pokemon; many were fall guys, like some of Ash's pokemon are here.

I could complain, however, that Kotetsu only had five pokemon on him in the league. How did he even manage to get in to the league with just 5 pokemon? It's also stupid that Kotetsu sent out pokemon with type disadvantages against Ash's pokemon, which made his wins less deserving. Nevertheless, Hydreigon was a very powerful pokemon, and like those in the past, it required two or three pokemon to take it down.

Realistically, I could say that Ash was doing fine here.

Originally Posted by CynthiaLover

Could Ash have picked a worse team for this battle? Okay, sure, Pikachu (mega duh) and Pignite were good ideas. Boldore is fair, but not the greatest. Snivy, Oshawott and Unfezant were the pits. Leavanny, Palpitoad, and Krookodile would've been much better choices. All three of them are much better battlers.

It is a diverse team. Ash has an Electric-type, a Fire/Fighting type, a Normal/Flying-type, a Water-type, a Grass-type, and a Rock-type.

Ash thought it through when he saw the types of pokemon Kotetsu had in the past. He knew Kotetsu would use a Grass/Steel type (which would be weak against Pignite), a Water-type (weak against Pikachu and Snivy), and a Fighting-type (that's where Unfezant would come in). Ash had no knowledge of the Dark/Dragon-type Hydreigon, so he had to improvise here and decided to send out pokemon that he knew that would stand a chance against it.

Krookodile would have been weak against the three pokemon that Ash knew Kotetsu would have. Leavanny might have resisted Riolu and Samurott's moves, but Riolu's Copycat (which may allow it to copy X-Scissor, which Leavanny is weak against) and Ferrothorn might have been too risky. Palpitoad was weak against any Grass-type moves Ferrothorn would have used. Then again, Boldore would have been weak against all three pokemon too, so that is probably the only "fail" move on Ash's part when he was preparing against Kotetsu's team.

Maybe it was stupid of Ash to send out Oshawott second in this battle, but it is very likely that he prepared the battling order of his team beforehand and had to send it out at that time.

I would hardly give Scraggy points for defeating a Darumaka in a throaway battle that lasted five seconds.

I knew I'd be disappointed with this battle but I didn't think I'd be THIS disappointed, almost disgusted. First of all Oshawott loses again >:U, secondly how can the writers only give Pikachu and Pignite the victories in this battle, and lastly...I know the writers have been trying to push down our throats how much of an idiot Kotetsu is, but ONLY 5 POKEMON!? How is he even allowed to compete if he only has 5 Pokemon!? This is just ridiculous and I'm pretty sure he had to have heard it was 6 on 6 not 6 on 5....It feels like he's getting rewarded for his stupidity because of how the crappy writers are shoving these tough Pokemon onto him and he's just getting lucky. The battle was nothing exciting and why would Ash leave out Pignite out for Samurott and why would Kotetsu leave Ferrothron out for Pignite and Swanna for Pikachu? Plus really quick battles with no strategy involved what so ever. I don't think I've ever been so disappointed with the anime and I will be disgusted if Ash actually loses to this kid.

Originally Posted by Eitarou

Sending a Grass/Steel-type against a Fire/Fighting-type

Sending a Water/Flying-type against an Electric-type.

Not having a full team for a full battle.

How...how does Kotetsu win battles at all? How does he function?

Even more importantly, Pikachu beats Samurott with the only move that Samurott resists (Iron Tail). How do the writers function?

Wow. Wow. Wowowowowowowowowowow. Wow.

Of all ways to end Ash's Unova league journey, this is easily the worst since Kanto.

Four of Ash's Pokemon are fall-guys. Why is it that Pikachu and Pignite have to be the only ones who do anything? Oshawott and Snivy haven't had a decent victory in a long time. I thought the writers were supposed to be advertising the starters, not showing them to be weaklings. They may as well just evolved them. Poor Unfezant and Boldore turned out to be fall-guys, just as I predicted.

Kotetsu... jees louise, how does this kid even remember to get dressed in the morning? When I first saw this kid, I found him to be amusing and quirky, but the writers have stretched this to a ridiculous point. It doesn't help he was being rather arrogant in this battle, making me want to see Ash crush him. (Aren't overconfident, smug, non-major-rival characters supposed to lose in Pokemon world?) The worst part is Kotetsu's stupidity is somehow managing to make Ash look even weaker. He's about to lose a 6-5 match, with two of the Pokemon being knocked out because Kotetsu forgot about type disadvantages. It's like the writers are trying to outdo themselves in making Ash a weakling.

Anyone remember my comment about how badly crafted the 6-3 gym battle against Roxie was? How I said her giving him the badge was bad because he was clearly not prepared. Now we have this. Nice job sending Ash into a tournament he wasn't ready for Roxie, you'd probably make a perfect squad commander for a Predator movie.

My God that was terrible. Watching this battle was so cringe worthy. Rushed as fuck, just Attack Attack Attack. Stupid pokemon decisions by Kotetsu. Oh man, what an absolutely terrible way to end the league. Is this really how low the writers have gone.

also, did Unfezant even have a new move?

Originally Posted by Ash's Battle Coach

Did Unfezant even have a new move?

Nope, but we found out that Ferrothorn (ironically enough in its 30 second appearance) had its fourth move revealed: Mirror Shot.

Originally Posted by DynoStretch

The worst part is Kotetsu's stupidity is somehow managing to make Ash look even weaker. He's about to lose a 6-5 match, with two of the Pokemon being knocked out because Kotetsu forgot about type disadvantages. It's like the writers are trying to outdo themselves in making Ash a weakling.

Two of Ash's pokemon lost to Hydreigon, a pseudo-legendary pokemon. In past leagues, Ash has struggled to defeat pseudo-legendaries, and sometimes it took more than two pokemon to take them down. It is better that two non-fully evolved pokemon lost to a Hydreigon than to have two fully-evolved pokemon lose to something like Paul's Ursaring or Drapion, which were unbelievably overpowered. (Not even Barry was able to stop Ursaring with a type advantage.)

Another one of Ash's pokemon lost to a Samurott, with whom Pignite had a type disadvantage.

Two (probably three) of Ash's pokemon will lose to a pokemon that has been shown to be so powerful that it took down Bianca's Emboar all by itself. Riolu was built up as being the Pikachu of Kotetsu's team; it is a walking pokemon with as much experience and battling power as Pikachu. If Pikachu is able to defeat a Samurott with Iron Tail (a move that Samurott is supposed to resist due to her Water-typing), then Riolu should be more than capable of defeating Unfezant with a few Circle Throws and Vacuum Waves that Unfezant does not resist.

Wow, so I was actually correct in my prediction that Kotetsu only has five pokemon on him?

Dang, I wish I'd flaunted it a bit more.

Since everything that I wanted to say is already said, just paint me purple and call me names!!! This battle was as bad and shity as fuck! No strategy...no rhythm no whatsoever!

What the hell did not Satoshi send Chaoboo against Sazandora after Ganlte?
What did shithead send Nutrey against Chaoboo?
What did Shithead send Swanna against Pika?
What did Sato keep Chaoboo against Daikenki?
What did not Kenhallow at least land 1 god damn hit on Riolu?

This is so frustrating! why can't they do this right? The god damn league is supposed to be the god damn climax of the saga!!!!!

this is by far the worst battle I've ever seen and this is by far the worst league ever! Jesus Christ!
I so hope that Kotetsu beats Pika now just out of spite!

@Ampharos King; You fail to realize my point. For starters, if Ash had opted Oshawott and Snivy for Palpitoad and Leavanny, he'd still have a diverse team. He'd still have a Water-type and a Grass-type. The difference is Palpitoad would also give him a Ground-type and Leavanny would give him a Bug-type as well.

Leavanny could grant him super-effective damage against two of Kotetsu's Pokemon (Samurott, Hydreigon) and a neutral damage against three (Swanna, Ferrothorn, Riolu). While, yes, Leavanny is weak to Swanna's Flying-type and Ferrothorn's Pin Missile, so is Snivy, but she can only tackle Samurott for super effective damage and neutral to only two (Swanna, Riolu). On top of that, Leavanny can resist Riolu's Fighting-type moves due to his Bug-type, something that Snivy can't do. While Snivy's Attract is useful, she hasn't used it since, I believe, "Evolution by Fire" (I might be wrong, as I haven't watched the anime in a while, but still), and she hasn't used it here. Attract could've helped Snivy a lot here, but Leavanny has the advantage, not to mention a slightly better record. Remember, in his debut Gym Battle, he took down both Dwebble and Whirlipede, despite a double type disadvantage, just as a Sewaddle and Swadloon. So Leavanny would've been a better choice over Snivy.

Likewise, Palpitoad has move variety in his moves than Oshawott. While Oshawott probably resists more, Palpitoad has proven to be a far better battler. Able to take hits and deliver even bigger ones. On top of that, Oshawott has not proven to be the most reliable in tough situations, while Palpitoad has proven to be more than able to do the job, even though he has been handed a few defeats. Palpitoad's Mud Shot could deal super effective damage against Lucario while neutral to Ferrothorn, while Sludge Wave could easily turn the tables on one of Kotetsu's non Steel-types with the Poison status ailment. He is also shown to be more physically tough than Oshawott, and a lot more confident, which his strength backs up, unlike Oshawott, who is boastful, but can't back it up. Palpitoad would've been a better choice over Oshawott, both with battling skill and raw power.

Now, Scraggy or Krookodile would've been better than Unfezant due to a number of reasons. Scraggy's Fighting-type moves could easily put a bad dent in Lucario, Hydreigon, and Ferrothorn, something that Unfezant can't do. While, yes, Riolu/Lucario could use its Fighting-type moves over Scraggy's Dark-type, Scraggy can still do a lot to his team in return. Now Krookodile is a real powerhouse to begin with. Even if his types against Kotetsu isn't the greatest, he does have a nice selection of moves to use, which can easily compensate for that. Dig could deal with Lucario and, to a lesser extent, Ferrothorn, Dragon Claw against Hydreigon, Aerial Ace can deal neutral damage to Lucario and Ferrothorn, and Stone Edge could shut down Swanna. Either Scraggy or Krookodile would've been better choices over Unfezant, who could only hit Riolu with super effective damage and Ferrothorn and Lucario for neutral.

That's my argument. Pignite, Boldore, and, of course, Pikachu were good choices (though Boldore is a toss up here), the rest were not good ideas. He'd still have a diverse team, using pretty much the same types, it's just his other four Pokemon (Leavanny, Scraggy, Palpitoad, Krookodile) would've done much better over Oshawott, Snivy, and Unfezant, especially since they got their clocks cleaned pretty easily in this battle (though Snivy did fare fairly well until Lucario came into play).