REVIEW: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!" - Page 3

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  1. #31
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    I kind of wish Dawn would've gone to Hoenn, which is what I'd originally assumed. Not only would it have been a fresh change since Hoenn really hasn't been mentioned in awhile, but maybe she could've experienced what the original, toned-down contests were like. Excuse me if I'm wrong because I didn't watch with subs, but I wonder why they made the Wallace Cup in Johto...did Dawn explain anything about that? Just curious.

    Also, does anyone know what Burgundy said to Cilan before she left? And are she and Georgia gone for good, or just for this season?

    I pretty much agree with everyone else about this arc; Dawn's cameo was nice and expected but I really wish they would've done at least something with her! They should've featured an episode with her catching a Unova pokemon; that would've been cool. After all, even though May didn't catch any Sinnoh pokemon, she got the chance to show off newly-evolved Glaceon, Venusaur, and Wartortle. The Quilava appearance was okay, though...but the battle really wasn't that great. =/ Sigh; sometimes I feel like the only reason Dawn was even there was to provide the comic relief between Piplup and Oshawott...

    Speaking of which, that was a cute ending. ^_^

    Not to be off-topic or anything, but I reached 151 posts...hehe... XD
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    MEGA F'ING AMPHAROS!!! Ampharos King's Avatar
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    At the very least, this episode's title was appropriately named after its central theme: farewells and meetings. Unfortunately, the debut of Ash's "new rival," as well as the set-up for the big two-parter coming up in a few weeks, took a very large chunk out of what was supposed to be Dawn's final farewell episode.

    And as I expected, the Junior Cup ended in nearly the same way as it had started. The first major battle of this episode, Trip's Serperior vs. Alder's Bouffalant, concluded relatively quickly. Judging by how Trip calmly discerned Bouffalant's ability as Sap Sipper, I was under the impression that he wanted to defeat Alder using a pokemon that he knew would have a disadvantage against it. Of course, Trip had been playing this exact card throughout this tournament, so I wasn't shocked or anything.

    The only element of this battle that really surprised me was that Alder was actually serious throughout the entire battle. As opposed to his debut episode in which fought Ash, Alder wasn't sleeping or focusing his mind on other things during this battle. This was a surprise because Alder's inattentiveness and carefree nature was what pissed Trip off during BW052, and what caused Trip to become even more obsessed in surpassing Alder with his own power. So basically, it felt like Alder's strategy in this battle was the same as the one from when he fought that trainer during the Nuvema Town Festival back in Trip's childhood. If it were not for Trip witnessing the events in BW052, his reactions throughout the entire tournament might not have been as emotional or tense. It felt that most of Trip's complaints about Alder stemmed from the Champion not being serious all of the time, even though Alder actually had been during their battle.

    I was also disappointed that Trip "changed" his attitude so suddenly after Alder informed him where his true strength lied. This circumstance felt like a cop out from the writers in character development considering how egotistical and smug Trip has been throughout the entire series. Alder getting the upper hand, and eventually, winning this battle without receiving any true damage didn't indicate a serious blow to Trip's pride as a battler or anything. What stemmed from the Trip and Alder battle greatly contrasted with Paul's situation when he fought Brandon back in DP, in which Brandon's words actually appeared to shake Paul a little bit and caused him to gradually alter his battling style later on in the series.

    Here it felt that Trip had already accepted Alder's advice about loving his pokemon, and that power and strategy were not enough in deciding the results of the battle. Trip didn't attempt to argue with Alder or prove to Alder at all that the latter's strategy was wrong, despite his dislike of the Champion's carefree attitude stemming most of the tension he had during the series so far. Trip casually left the tournament after saying a few words to Ash related to the Unova League coming up. There was no connection between Ash and Trip that makes me believe that they actually do have a rivalry with one another, even at this point in the series. It feels that Ash had already respected Trip as a trainer and simply wants to improve his skills as well. Ash's presence simply felt out of place here, and many characters have noted that battling Alder was really the only thing that Trip had on his mind during the entire tournament.

    Oh, and speaking of rivals, this episode featured the debut of Ash's newest "rival," Kotetsu. My impression of Kotetsu is not certainly one of praise at the moment. Kotetsu seems to be an amalgam of Barry's hyperactivity and Morrison's obsession with competition. Kotetsu also has some of Stephan's lack of common sense of practical knowledge, such as when he assumed that he only needed seven badges to compete in the Unova League, and that the league took place in Johto. Really, the only aspect of Kotetsu that really stood out in my mind was that he had a Riolu, a pokemon that only appeared very rarely in the DP saga. It's such a shame that all this Riolu did in this episode was imitate its less than competent trainer. One last note about Kotetsu: He somehow earned a badge from Lenora from crying out loud. How did he even find the gym hidden in that place?

    And finally, this episode was notable in that Dawn's guest role in BW Season 2 was ending and that she was moving on with her life as a coordinator. Once again, Best Wishes fails to deliver anything spectacular with its departures. Aside from the two-minute "training battle" that Pikachu and Dawn's Quilava had outside of Cynthia's villa, this episode didn't cover anything that we hadn't already seen back in DP191.

    Dawn's departure from Ash and co. this time might have left a bigger impression on me if the writers had actually did more for her character during the guest star appearance. Dawn really had a starring role in just two out of the nine episodes that she appeared in, and most of the screentime that she had in the other episodes were allotted to the other characters (Cilan, Iris, Trip, Alder, Cynthia, etc.) Of course, it certainly wasn't helped that the writers actually spent more time in this episode introducing a new character or continuing with the Meloetta storyline than to give Dawn a proper sendoff.

    This episode felt average for me. I'm glad that the Junior Cup has finally ended, despite all of the controversies that I felt that it was characterized by.

    Quote Originally Posted by L-05308 View Post
    Your right, I was also annoyed when Dawn's Quilava first lerned the same move that Ash's did. But Flamethrower? Why? Why not, Extracensory, Wild charge or even Blast Burn?
    Quilava can't normally learn Blast Burn; the only exception to the rule was by evolving the Cyndaquil from XD.

    Quilava can only learn Extrasensory as an egg move, and since it did not have that move from when it was a Cyndaquil, there was no reason for Quilava to learn the attack here in its evolved form. With the exception of three notable cases, all in the AG era, the writers don't really have pokemon learn egg moves as attacks.

    And Wild Charge wouldn't do that much against Pikachu, anyway.
    Last edited by Ampharos King; 6th September 2012 at 06:31 PM.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Lackluster end to a lackluster tournament and cameo.

    Really, Dawn presence felt like she was only really there to be BFF's with Iris. Her interaction with Ash was rather dull, and her inclusion in this tournament felt pointless. Ash, and Dawn tie/get interrupted in their battle...yet again. I still don't see why Ash said he hadn't battled Dawn yet..when they had the Mamoswine/Pignite battle not too long before the tournament. I guess this anime really doesn't count training battles as actual battles.

    Also, Trip's shift in personality seems rather...sudden.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    To me, this entire tournament has been one big letdown.

    From my prespective, Dawn was just in this season for fan-service and nothing more, her interactions with Ash were just dull (more rather, she barely interacted with anyone), her Quilava only learned a single new move, which was Flamethrower, which replaced Eruption, while the rest of Dawn's Pokemon were simply pushed to the side like they were nothing, and she never even MENTIONED anything about her journey in Hoenn, or her old rivals such as Nando and Ursula, not to mention her battle with Ash ended with a tie. Essentially, they basically hyped her up on the promotional posters, and then have her stay for about 8 episodes, then basically put her on a ship to Johto, never to return, since that is basically what happened to May, as @Hellion put it earlier, Johto is where coordinators go to die.

    Even moreso is that they focus a lot more on Iris and Trip than on Ash or anyone else, like Ash isn't the main character anymore, this is essentially what they did to Dawn was downplay her character to a bare minumum, and basically make it like she was just THERE with no real purpose, while Iris got all the attention, all which was just unnessicary. Speaking of Trip, his sudden change in his attitude really bothered me, compared to Pauls battle with Brandon in DP, this change just came out of the blue.

    Already, I'm starting to dislike Kotetsu, basically, he's the child of Barry and Morrison on more caffiene, he seems to be abscent minded, and rather obsessed with competition. Probably the one thing I both like and dislike is that he owns a Riolu, which in previous seasons, never got that much coverage in the anime, but what's annoying is that his Riolu always mimics Kotetsu's actions, like it seems that the writers are too lazy to give Riolu a personality, that's what it seems like to me.

    Probably the only good thing to come out of this tournament was Krokorok evolving, and that's pretty much it as far as I can tell.
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampharos King View Post
    At the very least, this episode's title was appropriately named after its central theme: farewells and meetings. Unfortunately, the debut of Ash's "new rival," as well as the set-up for the big two-parter coming up in a few weeks, took a very large chunk out of what was supposed to be Dawn's final farewell episode.

    And as I expected, the Junior Cup ended in nearly the same way as it had started. The first major battle of this episode, Trip's Serperior vs. Alder's Bouffalant, concluded relatively quickly. Judging by how Trip calmly discerned Bouffalant's ability as Sap Sipper, I was under the impression that he wanted to defeat Alder using a pokemon that he knew would have a disadvantage against it. Of course, Trip had been playing this exact card throughout this tournament, so I wasn't shocked or anything.

    The only element of this battle that really surprised me was that Alder was actually serious throughout the entire battle. As opposed to his debut episode in which fought Ash, Alder wasn't sleeping or focusing his mind on other things during this battle. This was a surprise because Alder's inattentiveness and carefree nature was what pissed Trip off during BW052, and what caused Trip to become even more obsessed in surpassing Alder with his own power. So basically, it felt like Alder's strategy in this battle was the same as the one from when he fought that trainer during the Nuvema Town Festival back in Trip's childhood. If it were not for Trip witnessing the events in BW052, his reactions throughout the entire tournament might not have been as emotional or tense. It felt that most of Trip's complaints about Alder stemmed from the Champion not being serious all of the time, even though Alder actually had been during their battle.

    I was also disappointed that Trip "changed" his attitude so suddenly after Alder informed him where his true strength lied. This circumstance felt like a cop out from the writers in character development considering how egotistical and smug Trip has been throughout the entire series. Alder getting the upper hand, and eventually, winning this battle without receiving any true damage didn't indicate a serious blow to Trip's pride as a battler or anything. What stemmed from the Trip and Alder battle greatly contrasted with Paul's situation when he fought Brandon back in DP, in which Brandon's words actually appeared to shake Paul a little bit and caused him to gradually alter his battling style later on in the series.

    Here it felt that Trip had already accepted Alder's advice about loving his pokemon, and that power and strategy were not enough in deciding the results of the battle. Trip didn't attempt to argue with Alder or prove to Alder at all that the latter's strategy was wrong, despite his dislike of the Champion's carefree attitude stemming most of the tension he had during the series so far. Trip casually left the tournament after saying a few words to Ash related to the Unova League coming up. There was no connection between Ash and Trip that makes me believe that they actually do have a rivalry with one another, even at this point in the series. It feels that Ash had already respected Trip as a trainer and simply wants to improve his skills as well. Ash's presence simply felt out of place here, and many characters have noted that battling Alder was really the only thing that Trip had on his mind during the entire tournament.

    Oh, and speaking of rivals, this episode featured the debut of Ash's newest "rival," Kotetsu. My impression of Kotetsu is not certainly one of praise at the moment. Kotetsu seems to be an amalgam of Barry's hyperactivity and Morrison's obsession with competition. Kotetsu also has some of Stephan's lack of common sense of practical knowledge, such as when he assumed that he only needed seven badges to compete in the Unova League, and that the league took place in Johto. Really, the only aspect of Kotetsu that really stood out in my mind was that he had a Riolu, a pokemon that only appeared very rarely in the DP saga. It's such a shame that all this Riolu did in this episode was imitate its less than competent trainer. One last note about Kotetsu: He somehow earned a badge from Lenora from crying out loud. How did he even find the gym hidden in that place?

    And finally, this episode was notable in that Dawn's guest role in BW Season 2 was ending and that she was moving on with her life as a coordinator. Once again, Best Wishes fails to deliver anything spectacular with its departures. Aside from the two-minute "training battle" that Pikachu and Dawn's Quilava had outside of Cynthia's villa, this episode didn't cover anything that we hadn't already seen back in DP191.

    Dawn's departure from Ash and co. this time might have left a bigger impression on me if the writers had actually did more for her character during the guest star appearance. Dawn really had a starring role in just two out of the nine episodes that she appeared in, and most of the screentime that she had in the other episodes were allotted to the other characters (Cilan, Iris, Trip, Alder, Cynthia, etc.) Of course, it certainly wasn't helped that the writers actually spent more time in this episode introducing a new character or continuing with the Meloetta storyline than to give Dawn a proper sendoff.

    This episode felt average for me. I'm glad that the Junior Cup has finally ended, despite all of the controversies that I felt that it was characterized by.

    Quote Originally Posted by L-05308 View Post
    Your right, I was also annoyed when Dawn's Quilava first lerned the same move that Ash's did. But Flamethrower? Why? Why not, Extracensory, Wild charge or even Blast Burn?
    Quilava can't normally learn Blast Burn; the only exception to the rule was by evolving the Cyndaquil from XD.

    Quilava can only learn Extrasensory as an egg move, and since it did not have that move from when it was a Cyndaquil, there was no reason for Quilava to learn the attack here in its evolved form. With the exception of three notable cases, all in the AG era, the writers don't really have pokemon learn egg moves as attacks.

    And Wild Charge wouldn't do that much against Pikachu, anyway.
    Knew someone would pick me up on that ¬¬

    But why Flamethrower? Why not Inferno, Overheat or better yet Lava Plume?

    If I have to say somthing positive I'll say that Flame Wheel looked kind of cool o_0

    Just a bit down in the dumps really, most of Best Wishes, the anime forums has been a bitter pot of despair. I've stayed happy though, I like all the episodes that people were not thrilled with; Castelia gym, Don battle, Kami Trio two parter, even the Tiritouga/Carracosta episodes were good to me, but these last 4 episodes hit me with the cold truth that the best part of the entire series has been written poorly :( sigh I'll probaly blogg about this, hard knowing pokemon has gotten so much worse in so little time, AG was brilliant, DP was magnificent but BW dosen't continue the tridition of topping its predecesor. And in the intrest of staying on topic, that's how this episode makes me feel.
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  6. #36
    Registered User The Fighting Misty's Avatar
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    The problem is the episodes were overhyped to be something they weren't. When we first heard about the World Tournament we assumed it would be something big like in the games, but instead it was just a Don battle tournament. If they simply said that from the beginning it wouldn't have been a big deal.

    Lastly, Dawn should not have gotten all that promotion if her cameo was going to be so low-key. They actually treated her (on the TVTokyo website at least), as if she was returning to the main cast. We all knew she would leave anyway, but the least they could have done is made her the focal point of some of these episodes. I truly wonder if she's going to be removed from the opening after this episode.
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  7. #37
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Well I like Kotetsu. I can probably see him becoming tiring though; however, I did think the same about Dent at first, but I haven't tired of him, so we'll see. If he's set to become a regular I think the whole *pulls headband away from head* *snaps headband back* *lightningbolt strikes* might become a... "thing".

    The episode wasn't that great on the whole imo, since it was just wrapping up a few things.

    Alder ROFLstomped Trip after Bouffalant decided to do some acrobatics.

    The little scene with Piplup and Oshawott was hilarious yet cute. awww.

    And bye, Dawn! >:P I won't particularly miss her since she hasn't really done much, to be honest.

  8. #38
    Registered User hhhhdmt's Avatar
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    i missed the episode. was the battle between trip and alder a six on six battle? how badly did trip lose? did he manage to hurt any of alders pokemon?

  9. #39
    H.M
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Quote Originally Posted by hhhhdmt View Post
    i missed the episode. was the battle between trip and alder a six on six battle? how badly did trip lose? did he manage to hurt any of alders pokemon?
    1-on-1. Not that badly imo. And somewhat(?).
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  10. #40
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    1 on 1 seems disappointing to me

    The writers have not really demonstrated the full power of a champion. Sure, Cynthia is a very powerful trainer but we have mainly seen her Garchomp in battle and Gastradon once or twice. But we haven't seen her overall team and she seems overly reliant on Garchomp

    I was hoping to see what Alders full team looked like and how powerful he is. Its disappointing to hear it was only a one on one battle. I hope one of these days we can see either Cynthia or Alder's full team.
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  11. #41
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Oh dear lord, I hope that "Johto is where coordinators go to die" doesn't become a "thing".
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  12. #42
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Episode was mix between decent and mediocre in my opinion. Alder whooping floor with Trip was expected from start, but im glad something positive came up from Trip dominance in Junior Cup with this defeat judging by reactions humbling him down a bit not being so overconfident and egoistic anymore. Which is you could say of character development, teaching him nice lecture how love and strong bond with your pokemon is important ingredient if you want to be successful trainer.

    Alder change of attitude being a lot more serious was unexpected too, but like they say first impressions can sometimes fool you with Alder regardless of carefree attitude being a lot more competent than some would thought.

    Dawn battle between Ash to describe with one sentence left a lot more to be desired. I was glad when i found out how Quilava against Pikachu is going to be used, instead of predictable Oshawott vs Piplup clash. And yet again battle ended in draw with Cynthia stopping duel, just about when it started to be interesting.

    Whole departure was ok i guess but i expected more meaningful departure from Dawn side, although it was a bit touching to see Piplup and Oshawott growing so close to each other being upset when they had to say goodbye.

    I wish writers gave us some update on Hoenn journey and progress she made as coordinator during departure too, but i presume since Unova didn't had contest writers probably felt it wasn't relevant to bring it up much since it wouldn't play role in anime plot anyway. Like it was situation with May and Wallace Cup.

    However i still don't think her appearance was pointless.
    She returned for more episodes than May and Misty , had enjoyable dynamic with cast and interactions with Ash weren't too shoddy either showing that same friendship she established with him in DP. There was entertaining rivalry between Piplup sand Oshawott over Meloetta adding to comedy.
    Admittedly i expected more from her performance in Junior Cup but it was pretty clear since start how it will be mostly focused on Trip sand Iris development. However she still played some role in issue between Iris and her pokemon showing to us how much she improved since last time. Which can be noticed in Mamoswine being one of rare pokemon which actually damaged Iris Dragonite.

    As for new rival Kotetsu, honestly i expected a lot more. He is just another generic shonen character which is absentminded and clueless. However he adds a whole new dimension to this archetype being incredibly ignorant, considering he actually thought how league will be held in Johto and how 7 badges is enough to qualify for tournament. Good luck with that buddy.

    I can understand appeal behind such characters, but less hyperactive characters which don't reveal all cards on table immediately can have charm too. Oh well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion View Post
    Hikari's gone forever, oh well, still better than the Kasumi cameos. XD
    If you ask me Misty cameo was better having creative story which focused on her(wrapping up Togepi), great villain colonel Hanson, and enjoyable interactions between characters .Same goes for second where she helped Max about issues with older sister.

    Please, Kasumi's in Kanto and lord knows she ain't never coming back. XD So is Masato in Hoenn or Brock, also in Kanto. The correct moniker for Johto would be, "Where Coordinators go to die" XD
    We don't know if they will return or not in future. I say Brock and Misty might have chance in BW filler arc, if expansion of World cup happens.
    Last edited by pokemon fan 132; 7th September 2012 at 03:04 AM.
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  13. #43
    Caught in a lab romance~ Araragi-hakase's Avatar Head Administrator
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    I've been excited to see Shooti battle Adeku for a few weeks now, and while at the time I was pretty disappointed in the battle (and freaking out on Skype a little because "aDEKU WHY ARENT YOU DOING ANYTHING NOOOOO") but after I watched it again, I think the battle was just what Shooti needed to put him in his place. He went the entire tournament one hit KO'ing all of his opponents, and having studied Buffron, probably thought this was going to go the same way. Did he know that his ability was Sap Sipper? (legit question, was that mentioned?) I don't know what any of their dialogue was during the match, but it seemed like Shooti was pretty sure he was going to win, watching Buffron just take hit after hit and not doing anything. So, for Adeku to one hit KO his Jalorda showed he still had a lot to learn, as tough as he thought he was.

    The battle between Satoshi and Hikari was pretty meh, as was their goodbye. I don't know what I was really expecting, but it seemed pretty rushed. There was a lot crammed in to this episode.

    I'm not all that fond of Kotetsu from this episode, either. So dumb, so dumb, so dumb, for real

    But can we just take a moment and appreciate these


  14. #44
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion View Post
    Shirona's talking... crap... Somebody please shut her up... Jeremy, shove a Pokéball down her throat and shut her up... No she just keeps going and going... and she stops the battle... like what? First of all, for the first time since Hikari arrived, we had Satoshi and her legit interacting, so why shut them up just so Shirona can steal some screen time... again.
    Don't say such a bad thing!
    I'm sure Cynthia said very wise words that gave the whole episode maturity and depth. Just because you apparently didn't understand what she said, there's no reason to jump to conclusions and judge her the way you did. If it hadn't been for Cynthia's appearance, the whole Junior cup arc would have been a waste of time and lost potential. Or let me put it more poetically: If the Cup itself was darkness, Cynthia was the light.

    Something that interests me: Did Cynthia comment on Alder's Bouffalant in some way? In one scene she seemed to look at it kind of sceptically. Or did she expect this had been Alder's strategy all the time?

    Farewell my Queen! I know for sure we'll see you again and God, am I waiting for that day!
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  15. #45
    Princess of Sinnoh martianmister's Avatar
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    Default Re: BW 093 "The Junior Cup of Farewells and Meetings!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Moe View Post
    Dawn was just there - like a Brock who can't cook.
    She can cook. Does that makes her the third Takeshi on BW group? :P
    1. Satoshi/Ash Ketchum: 801 episodes
    2. Team Rocket: 736 episodes
    3. Takeshi/Brock: 633 episodes
    4. Kasumi/Misty: 282 episodes
    5. Hikari/Dawn: 201 episodes
    6. Haruka/May: 197 episodes
    7. Masato/Max: 192 episodes
    8. Iris: 141 episodes
    9. Dent/Cilan: 138 episodes
    10. Kenji/Tracey: 44 episodes

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