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I finally understand Iris's Dragonite.

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by , 30th August 2012 at 05:54 AM (2824 Views)
When today's episode aired, I was confused as to why Dragonite was listening to Iris at the very beginning but then became his old self later on. Here's the explanation:



What does this mean?

It means that Dragonite is willing to listen to Iris when a weaker opponent is in question, he trusts her in those situations. However, when a worthy and strong opponent is involved, he succumbs to his wild instincts and listens to no one but himself. Naturally, this only became apparent today and the problem still hasn't been solved. That means, in my opinion, that this will lead to some further Dragonite development and hopefully, it will involve Drayden as well.

As this episode has showcased, Iris has a long way to go before she can become a Dragon Master and command over any dragon type with ease. Dragonite has set up an obstacle on her path towards reaching her goal of becoming a Dragon Master so I'm truly looking forward to seeing how Iris will overcome it and grow even more.

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Updated 30th August 2012 at 06:34 AM by Tsutarja

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  1. Bubble Frog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion
    I'm sorry, where exactly in BW027 or in the Don Battle tournament is she actually portrayed as someone that still has a long way to go to reach her goal of becoming a Dragon Master? In BW027, she knows everything there is to know about dragons, can turn Crimgan into a battling machine and Emmy into a competent battle despite not really having met either before, she's already able to read Kibago and Crimgan's hearts, can sense Kibago over great distances and finally sees the previous "obstacle" that was set up for her disappear in smokes despite her being previously portrayed as being frustrated and not understanding why Kibago didn't get it. But no, she was right all along with her vast amount of Dragon knowledge that she just needed to sit on her hands, wait for Kibago to miraculously get it and then wham, it happens.
    Actually in the Emmy episode, her goal of wanting to be a Dragon Master is established, saying it's not just her dream to be a Dragon Master, but her goal as well. Crimgan wasn't a crappy battler by any means, Emmy and her Crimgan just needed a little help and Iris gave a little mime-battling advice when it came to using Crimgan against Satoshi's fairly average-powered(at the time) Pokabu who was still relying mainly on Ember and Tackle and didn't have the stronger moves, competence, and prowess he has now. Crimgan was a Pokemon trained by Emmy's father that Emmy traded her starter for it's only natural it would be strong and defeat Pokabu, under Iris' command or Emmy's and this is shown later on when Desmas shows up Emmy and Crimgan are ready to roast Desmas until Koromori enters the scene and uses Gust, taking them off guard. She helps Crimgan and realizes that it has an embedded rope around its neck, this is the physical side of "understanding the hearts of Dragons" being able to understand their behavior is important. Iris' bond and connection to Kibago was established in BW9 and the two have shown to have nice synergy, it's natural. Kibago's Dragon Fail He's all the Dragon RAGE XD wasn't something that was not bothered with and solved out of nowhere, in fact I'm willing to say the opposite that, given BW's amount of devotion toward training Pokemon,(which isn't nearly as massive as DP's amount of episodes) that Iris actually was shown to try with Kibago and work with it. In its debut episode, in Kibago and Zuruggu's little battles, in Hiun City Fushide infestation episode, these are the times where Kibago's D-Rage was mounted up toward the inevitable mastery and imo that's not Iris doing nothing.


    Then there's the Doryuuzu episode where her 8 year old self just beat everyone in the Dragon Village who are close with their Dragon with her unevolved Mogurew.
    Iris and her Mogurew didn't beat every single person in the village, she and her mini mole beat a bunch of wild Pokemon and some trainers, as evidenced by the flashback, 99 specifically. How many of each is up in the air, but it seems to be pretty much mostly wild Pokemon. The only Dragon Pokemon Iris and Mogurew are seen defeating is a trainer's Crimgan, whether this kid has a close a connection to his Crimgan is unknown since he's filler fodder trainer, so that's more so an assumption.

    Not much flaw there, but wait she gets to battle Shaga, a real Dragon Master. He beats her, because it takes that level of badass to even get a shot at beating 8 years old Iris and her Doryuuzu.
    I don't see what's so bad about this. Iris was shown defeating mostly wild Pokemon and a few trainers. Shaga is probably the first true, strong trainer she had ever faced in her life, so it's only natural Shaga would beat her and Doryuuzu

    Does the battle establish a flaw in Iris? No, not really. She and Doryuuzu both want to battle Shaga, in the battle, Doryuuzu realizes his opponent is very strong and loses the battle, but nowhere is Iris portrayed as disregarding her Pokémon's safety (she stops the battle the minute it received its first hit) and she actually tries to comfort Doryuuzu, encourages him, pretty much putting all of this on Doryuuzu.
    Yes, it does indeed. They both want to battle Shaga, the Dragon Master, but Doryuuzu after getting smacked a bit soon realizes the pair might be in over their heads. Iris didn't understand her Pokemon's wishes and the fact that the battle would be in vain and continues and Doryuuzu is hurt by her inconsideration for him during the battle. This is during the time where they've probably faced their strongest opponent yet, this is a crunch time moment in their partnership and if Iris could understand her mole's wishes and the shows establishes this as Iris being in the wrong and even Dento calls out Iris on this, then of course it is a flaw. Like I said before, the severity of flaws are subjective. Favorites are subjective. But canon is objective, and no matter how hard you try, you can't argue against the concrete a.k.a canon.

    Then, of course, the Don battle where all the previous issues she had with her team are flung out the window, she wins two battles with an Emonga whom she didn't train and didn't obey her until the tournament.
    No, not really. Emonga's just a lazy Pokemon, not disobedient. Emonga's a diva and will battle when ever she wants to. Laziness is a personality trait not a flaw. Emonga has shown she's willing to battle when she has to.(Baokkie's going to roast you alive) She also has shown to be okay with obeying and battling alongside her trainer like she did against Bel's Chaobu, but she decided to leave after she didn't want to anymore, when Chillarmy came and tickled her. Take Hikari's Pachirisu for example, in its capture episode Pachirisu runs around and plays around hyperactively as always. It doesn't listen to a word Hikari says, it doesn't care what else happens, it doesn't consider anyone else at all and Hikari's is frustrated and decides to release it and it mischievously tricks TR and blows up their balloon and is caught by Hikari and listens perfectly fine in future appearances. It's quite obvious Pachirisu and Emonga can both be pegged as "disobedient" but these are nothing more than simple personalities these respective Pokemon have and that's that really. Of course her laziness was mainly when she was first captured, after around fifteen episodes under Iris' care it's natural. Like someone else put it, in the clutch of an official battle Emonga will come through for Iris because they are friends, trainer and Pokemon, and partners. and acrobats XD

    Her Kibago can't battle to save its life? That's okay, she'll hax her way out of this.
    This isn't the first time a Pokemon has learned a new move and saved itself from a likely loss out of the blue. Satoshi's Zuruggu Kiai Dama and Jumping Knee Kick :P But, it's only happened to Iris' Kibago once and that was only in one battle against Gobitto. Kibago wasn't portrayed as a helpless Pokemon in any regard, compare this to his first battle against Yanappu and how he was being defeated by 10 percent power Seed Machine Guns and he couldn't even Scratch Yanappu, but is able to knock out Desmas and at least handle himself decently. It's actually too bad Kibago can't use Outrage anymore.

    And then the finals where Satoshi is out strategizing her, but it doesn't matter, her Doryuuzu is so much stronger and can take any hit, so of course she wins the tournament despite doing the least amount of battling and the least amount of working towards her goal.
    Iron Tail and Quick Attack aren't going to be doing too much damage to a Doryuuzu in game or anime, I'm actually surprised the writers amped up the power by that much in that battle. But yeah, I'm willing to argue that Dento hasn't done anything to help his goal of becoming a S-Class Sommelier, aside from food pun commentary time every battle :P We actually physically see Iris work toward her goal and actually develop as a character and aren't interpreting what she does as development, and that's canon for ya.

    This was followed by 50 episodes of Iris sitting on her hands doing jack and then poof... Kibago suddenly can use Giga Impact and her Pokémon stagnated while everybody else improved? Who cares, we'll just give her a Kairyu on a silver platter that can go toe-to-toe with legendaries and be portrayed as being stronger than all the other Pokémon in the tournament put together.
    Not really, we actually see Iris training Emonga, Doryuuzu, and Kibago some throughout the saga. I say Iris' training for her Pokemon is going alright, given the amount of time BW devotes to training episodes compared to DP's constant episodes and scenes that were completely about or mostly always about training. It's quite obvious BW is being written differently in that regard where episodes aren't focused toward training nearly as much.

    Flaws? Development? Not quite...
    iyo :P

    Did she actually get better as a Dragon trainer throughout the show to warrant a Kairyu? Did she gain skills and learned more and more things? No, therefore, there was no reason to give her a Kairyu in the first place.
    Actually in the Monozu episode, the writers outright have the narrator say that "This experience has brought Iris one step closer to understanding the hearts of dragons and by virtue of that bringing her one step closer to obtaining her goal of Dragon Master status. So yes she did learn to understand a Dragon's heart better, and like I said canon is objective and you can't argue against the concrete and what actually happened.

    Giving Iris another dragon is a valid choice on the writers' part, but somewhere the choice that was made wasn't say... a Vibrava or a Miniryu, but a Kairyu that was stronger than pretty much everybody else's Pokémon while Iris didn't put a tenth of the effort, of the battles, of anything.
    Kairyu was for marketability sake, imo. That's just my theory XD But, while I was irritated with Kairyu at first, I'm now seeing how Kairyu could help Iris in her goal. It's a large, angry, flying fire-breathing Dragon beast. Those are typically how Dragons are portrayed in many fiction books and in mythological. By learning to connect to Kairyu's heart and gain its trust and become completely at one with it in battle, Iris can get development in learning to understand a Dragon's heart better, since she did it from the physical side(embedded rope on Crimgan) and once again from the emotional side(Monozu), learning and resolving Kairyu's problem without a doubt help her in her goal and aspiration. Kibago is where the training aspects of her goal come in hand, she must bring up Kibago's power level.

    Kairyu, as a whole, never should have happened to begin with, especially since the whole purpose of the journey is to evolve Kibago, i.e. to get a fully evolved dragon through training him, through battling alongside him and bonding with him, etc. Now, she got the results without any of the effort.
    Kibago isn't gonna be ignored in favor of Kairyu, Kairyu is the emotional side and Kibago is the training side. These two things connect, a Dragon Master is someone who can attune to the hearts of Dragons and raise their power to a strong-high. She didn't do that with Kairyu, again that's where Kibago comes in.

    At the end of the day, Iris still made it to the Top 4. What Langley said, what everyone realized, what Iris felt after the battle was because of the loss which could have happened in round 1 and have the same effect, the same results and not throw characters under the bus in the process. Bonus. The two wins served absolutely no purpose but to hype Kairyu some more and have Iris get the achievement of making Top 4 over characters who were more deserving.
    Iris made it to the semis, but the results weren't at her own accord. Kairyu won the battles and it is pointed out. Langley wasn't thrown under the bus, her whole loss meant nothing. The wins don't mean a thing if it isn't a team winning it. The fact Iris the whole time throughout the whole tournament was helpless and screaming her head off like a raging lunatic while Kairyu did all the work shows that she isn't portrayed as amazing as you say.



    Winning the Don Battle took three Pokémon, two of them were derailed to make the final happen. Again, Iris and Doryuuzu getting a great battle that showed how close they were could have happened early in the tournament, Iris could have won the first two rounds with Doryuuzu and lost because her Kibago wasn't on par with the rest of the competition. But once again, somewhere along the way, the decision was taken to throw all her issues out the window, have them resolved just because Iris said they should... Right...
    Eh, not really. I already answered the parts regarding Emonga and Kibago.

    But to answer your question, getting the Don Battle isn't the only achievement she has. Kibago learning Outrage, Kibago learning Giga Impact, Iris getting Kairyu, Iris making it to Top 8 of the Donamite (over a more deserving Cabernet), Iris making it to Top 4 of the Junior Cup (over more deserving Langley and Hikari) are all achievements for which she did little or nothing to warrant and yet got. She's consistently been portrayed as being stronger and better than pretty much every other character on the show despite not putting in a tenth of the effort they put in.
    Kibago can't use Outrage anymore. In the episodes where Shirona debuts when Kibago uses Dragon Rage and Scratch and they do nothing, Dento says "Kibago is out of moves to help him against Gaburias!" showing that Kibago can't use Outrage anymore and only had Dragon Rage and Scratch under his wing. So, I'm guessing Outrage was a case of "fight or flight". Kibago was training against Shirona, not only that but the battle showcased how much the both of them want to improve and how Iris wants to challenge Shirona because she wants to be a Dragon Master and move closer to her goal as well as their bond and how Kibago's strength and Iris' belief in his strength can keep him going and moving forward. Compare this to the Don Battle Tournament where Kibago is a crying sniveling mess when Gobitto smacks him around and Iris is equally screaming her head off and they're both pretty helpless the whole time. Staying calm in cool in the heat of battle is essential. Cabernet losing in the first round was natural, she's not going to win battles or improve as a Sommelier until she learns to start judging peoples' Pokemon fairly and Iris and Doryuuzu have a strong connection, it wouldn't make sense to reward Cabernet with a win when she gave another unfair evaluation toward the two prior to the match, plus Cabernet did only become a Sommelier out of spite for Dento. Those wins in the JC meant nothing, Iris and Kairyu didn't earn them, Kairyu did. Iris without a doubt earned Kairyu, she stood up not just for him, but for all Dragon Pokemon and helped him because she likes Dragons. This along with Dento helping find the camera, Hikari and Satoshi using their water mascots to keep her from being flame-broiled, and her trying to understand its heart connected to the resolution of the plot and whether or not she connected to its heart or not, Dento would have came with the camera eventually and proved Junsa-san wrong.
  2. Hellion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Human
    They're booooorrrrriiiiing.
    Then don't read them or better yet put me on your ignore list. XD

    bait us in preview threads about the "Iris show"
    Paranoid much? I'm saying a joke that's also a comment on the lack of interactions between Satoshi and Hikari in last week's episode in a review thread. You're assuming I'm baiting you when I haven't quoted or mentioned you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tsutarja
    walls of text
    Well, what can I say, there was so much wrong in what you were saying, I felt compelled to show you the truth. XD

    It was an episode that established that Iris does know something about the dragons. A character doesn't have to be a complete idiot to learn his way towards the top.
    I have never said they needed to be a complete idiot, all I'm saying is that this episode established what dragon masters were and then established that Iris already possessed all of those qualities and skills.

    Which is no different than Ash's Gible.
    LOL, once again, throw some blame at every other character to not talk about Iris. I'm always impressed at how one person can complain so much about their pet character being "hated" and about all the "haters" that they're going to go on and on hating other characters to defend them. Dent, Cabernet, Satoshi, Fukumaru, nobody's safe if they can be used to defend Iris. XD

    But to answer your question, both storylines were built differently. First of all, Satoshi was shown to learn about Draco Meteor from someone else, then bonded with Fukumaru throughout the episode and helped him which led to Fukumaru succeeding in doing the move properly at the end of his debut. He was inconsistent with it and needed more practice with it until he got it right. We also saw some improvement during his training under Satoshi and more importantly, we saw how both of them were truly committed to make it work so that when it did, it felt earned. With Iris, it was treated as a problem not just with Kibago not being strong enough to handle the move, but with Iris not understanding really how she could help Kibago. Iris wasn't really committed at doing much of anything with it, just kinda happy to use Kibago has a She was portrayed as being frustrated with the lack of progress, frustrated that it was still a sneeze, but did nothing to change her approach and just practiced... 3-4 times... I mean... yeah...

    Iris knew that she was pressuring Excadrill in the battle against Haxorus by telling him they can win
    Iris and Doryuuzu both equally wanted to battle Shaga and both were fired up, Doryuuzu hesitates when he sees how strong Shaga was but maybe it was the 99 wins, maybe it was that Doryuuzu had no visible damage, maybe it was the fact that Iris had just won a tournament beating a bunch of Dragons from people in the Dragon Village who know a lot about them, maybe it was that the second she realized that Doryuuzu was in over his head she called off the battle... but I didn't see that much flaw in how they portrayed Iris there, nor do I actually felt bad for her. They never had her cross the line that would have warranted a break in the trust of Doryuuzu, they immediately had her trying to encourage Doryuuzu after the battle and say how much she believed in him, trying to be his friend.

    Nowhere in the episode was she ever shown to put victory above her Pokémon, so the idea that she developed by saying to Doryuuzu that she didn't care if he battled or not, that she only wanted to be its friend was is just her admitting to a flaw the episode went out of its way to show she didn't have in the first place. Maybe that was the point, Iris being portrayed as soooooooo selfless that she'll take the blame of things she didn't do to make others feel better is something that is definitely within the writers' "Iris is a pure radiant saint that can do no wrong" MO.

    Besides, laziness isn't a huge issue
    LOL, nothing ever is when Iris is concerned. Can't get your Pokémon to listen to you? Ignore the problem, show up in a tournament, and then they obey through magic.

    Yeah, let's nag Axew about the moves he can't even use himself. Outrage and Giga Impact, when will we ever see those again?
    Then what was the point of giving him those moves in the first place? To hype Iris some more, give her a win in the Don Battle she didn't deserve, to make up for the dozens of episodes where she does nothing while everyone else progresses so she can still be leagues above them. Wouldn't want Iris to be weaker than another character, or have Iris actually do stuff to earn that status...

    Iris actually deserved this Dragonite.
    LOL, she deserves a Kairyu by sitting around doing jack. I can only imagine what the characters who work hard, battle regularly, actually grow deserve... If Iris deserves a Kairyu then I guess Satoshi deserves a Rayquaza and Bel deserves Arceus. Cabernet and Mewto. XD

    In addition, her skill of reading dragon hearts improved.
    How can you say that when it was never shown to be lacking in the first place.

    Axew was never gonna evolve in the first place. And you know why? Because the animation directions said so, due to animation difficulty and stuff like that, you know, due to marketing, which happens to be whole damn concept behind this show.

    And do you seriously think this is the last we've seen of Axew? Do you think he's just going to get ignored? That her goal of raising into Haxorus is going to get ignored?
    It's already ignored. It's ignored now, it has been ignored It's been stated that she wants to evolve it, that it's the reason she's traveling, cut to her doing jack about it. Also, I fail to see you point. You say that Kibago was never going to evolve, but then ask me if I think the goal of evolving it is going to get ignored? Hum... your logic does not resemble our Earth logic.

    Nope. We have yet to get to the Opelucid/Dragon Village arc.
    The fabled Shaga "arc" (which is looking more and more to just be one episode with the League looming on the horizon), the arc that's going to contain all of Iris' development and make up for all the previous episodes of shitty Iris writing. LOL

    Obstacle, development, set up for more development. She tried helping Dragonite, bonded with him slightly, we got to see how strong he really is and yet how much work he and Iris have to go through before becoming a team. The bottom line is, if she were a Dragon Master, she would have Dragonite under control.
    Again I have no problem with how Iris was portrayed in last week's episode, I actually like it. There they set up a storyline for her, there they didn't portray her as a Dragon Master that can do no wrong and is a pure radiant saint. Finally, they actually treated her as a compelling character, finally, they're giving her a reason to be on the show.

    Was this how she was portrayed in the 91 episodes prior to this? Absolutely not and it's a shame cause it makes moments like this week's episode mean nothing. And that's what I have a problem with, with other characters being derailed and thrown under the bus to make her look good, with her getting a free pass to the semifinals of this tournament when she had no business making it past round 1.

    Yeah, Cabernet was far more deserving. I do think Cabernet had potential, but she's treated bad only so Cilan can be this perfect little character.
    Gasp. Bias. XD Cabernet was more deserving, she had some killer strategies, she's getting stronger, but alas, she was made to plateau just so Iris could have gotten a good win before being defeated by Masaomi just so she didn't look so bad when she had spent the 30 episodes prior to the tournament doing nothing.

    She only won the Don Battle tourney, the rest is bonus and it came along with her development.
    Funny how Iris keeps getting these bonuses for free and everyone else has to, gasp, earn them. XD

    Um wow, Iris is such a goddess. She has these heavenly powers that allow her to summon moves out of nowhere. And guess what else? Iris is the reason why Ash's team was badly handed. Her almighty presence led to Ash's skills to regress and his stupidity to increase as well as lack of rivalry between him and Trip. Oh boy, she's a witch I tell ya, a witch!
    LOL, putting words into my mouth now? You do know you can debate with someone without attacking them directly? XD Satoshi's team was handled badly because he got too many damn mons and some of them are just boring and unnecessary (Hahakomori, Gamagaru, Gantle...) and split the time that could have gone to other mons. Satoshi and Shooti don't have much of a rivalry, because there wasn't enough contrast between the two, not enough interactions, and not enough conflict.

    That being said, you can clearly see instances where Iris actually aggravated those situations. On Satoshi's team, Zuruggu is steadily getting stronger and stronger but still seems to be held back because of Kibago won't evolve. The same way, Shooti being so fascinated with Iris early on as opposed to Satoshi made it seem like he didn't care about Satoshi and saw Iris as more important to defeat. Her presence did hinder some scene because the writers used her as a crutch to prompt conflict between Satoshi and Shooti as opposed to craft some between the two of them.

    Iris does the least amount of training and battling and bonding with her Pokémon despite this being what her goal is, and gets better results than everyone else. Other characters are derailed to make her look good and glorify her... She's just not a compelling character.
    Shinneth likes this.
  3. Tsutarja's Avatar
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    @Hellion;

    Well, you sure use 'LOL' a lot. And, oh my God, are using those arguments, AGAIN? Do you honestly expect me to waste my time quoting your repetitive arguments while knowing you are only doing this to get a rise out of Iris fans? xD

    w/e, man.

    I hope you had your share of fun in this blog.

    Good luck in your future "endeavors" as I'm sure we'll see more of them. And lastly, none of the stuff you wrote changes the fact that Iris, who certain people called Mary Sue, clearly isn't one. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion
    Gasp. Bias. XD Cabernet was more deserving, she had some killer strategies, she's getting stronger, but alas, she was made to plateau just so Iris could have gotten a good win before being defeated by Masaomi just so she didn't look so bad when she had spent the 30 episodes prior to the tournament doing nothing.
    Yeah, I can see how she's getting stronger. From completely ignored development (and apparent respect towards Cilan developed at the end of Don Battle) to her lame skills leading to numerous losses.

    Cabernet clearly sucks as characters up for revenge will never get anywhere.
    Updated 2nd September 2012 at 12:47 AM by Tsutarja
  4. HumanDawn's Avatar
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    Then don't read them or better yet put me on your ignore list. XD

    Paranoid much? I'm saying a joke that's also a comment on the lack of interactions between Satoshi and Hikari in last week's episode in a review thread. You're assuming I'm baiting you when I haven't quoted or mentioned you.
    That sounds like a bad idea. Paranoid? You don't need to quote or mention me to bait me. Musashi even called you out on it.
  5. Hellion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsutarja
    Well, you sure use 'LOL' a lot.
    Well, what can I say @Tsutarja; ? Your attempts to deflect any Iris criticism by throwing mud at every character under the sun are funny. XD

    And, oh my God, are using those arguments, AGAIN?
    Considering they're still incredibly relevent...

    Do you honestly expect me to waste my time quoting your repetitive arguments while knowing you are only doing this to get a rise out of Iris fans? xD
    Oh, how I missed the claims of martyrdom and persecution. Why, you would never write something just to get a rise out of anyone. XD

    Quote Originally Posted by Tsutarja
    Though I can see certain people ignoring it. xD
    Quote Originally Posted by Human
    Somebody thought that Iris was a Dragon Master already?

    Who would think such a thing?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsutarja
    I don't know, the same people who call her Mary Sue?
    I keep wondering why you guys feel that every negative things said about Iris is directly aimed at pissing you off and won't even own up to actually aiming comments at people in an effort to piss them off. But you're clearly above that... not. XD

    And lastly, none of the stuff you wrote changes the fact that Iris, who certain people called Mary Sue, clearly isn't one. :P
    Looking beyond the term itself that can mean a wide variety of things, she wasn't a totally overglorified, flawless and overpowered character last week, unlike how she was portrayed for the 91 first episodes of Best Wishes. The idea that this one episode makes Iris a well-developed character and completely eclipses the last 2 years of shitty writing, overglorification, throwing characters under the bus to make her seem good is ludicrous.

    Yeah, I can see how she's getting stronger. From completely ignored development (and apparent respect towards Cilan developed at the end of Don Battle) to her lame skills leading to numerous losses.
    Actually, you're kinda proving my point here. Cabernet started out very misguided and took too much to heart the criticism that Dent gave her during their gym battle and had a warped idea of what sommeliering was about and how to bond with her Pokémon. She realizes that in the Don Battle, adopt a different approach while still being competitive towards Dent. Come the Donamite, she's appearing more composed towards Dent, she says she's trained a lot and had a shot to show that in battle. Which she does, she's outsmarting Iris, she's displaying new and stronger moves with her Futachimaru, she's leading the battle from top to finish, except.... she's not allowed to get the win because the writers felt the need to glorify Iris and threw Cabernet under the proverbial bus to do so. Iris had done nothing, hadn't developed at all and stagnated since the Don Battle, and had no reason to get that win. It made Cabernet look like a joke as opposed to allow her to really show growth as a character. Those kind of instances (and it's not an isolated one by a long shot) is why some people called Iris a Mary Sue in the first place, and you're confirming that it was the case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Human
    That sounds like a bad idea.
    Why not? My posts seem to cause you such boredom and distress, why not spare yourself the agony to read me?

    Musashi even called you out on it.
    If you only knew...
    Shinneth likes this.
    Updated 2nd September 2012 at 12:48 PM by Hellion
  6. HumanDawn's Avatar
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    I keep wondering why you guys feel that every negative things said about Iris is directly aimed at pissing you off and won't even own up to actually aiming comments at people in an effort to piss them off. But you're clearly above that... not. XD
    I was only kidding around in the least harmful way possible :p

    But seriously. Double you tee eff?

    Why not? My posts seem to cause you such boredom and distress, why not spare yourself the agony to read me?
    Because the more I read them, the more I love Iris' writing and her character. Back in November I didn't care much for her, but you made me realize how brilliant her writing is. (btw this is not bait to piss you off)
  7. Hellion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Human
    Because the more I read them, the more I love Iris' writing and her character.
    Then what you like isn't Iris, but arguing. XD Seriously, numerous times you've admitted that Iris's writing was less than perfect and you've stated several things that I later said, but when I say it, poof, you miraculously disagree and circle the wagons around Iris. LOL
  8. HumanDawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion
    Then what you like isn't Iris, but arguing. XD Seriously, numerous times you've admitted that Iris's writing was less than perfect and you've stated several things that I later said, but when I say it, poof, you miraculously disagree and circle the wagons around Iris. LOL
    Actually you made me more invested in her character. I've analysed her more and ended up liking her a lot more. Yeah I don't think that her writing is perfect xD. 99 straight wins... BULLSHIT! But what? I agree with many things that you say in the anime btw. But I don't go: "DAMN THIS SUX!" and then you go: "I KNOW RIGHT?" and then I go: "NO WAIT IT DOESN'T!".

    I admit that I changed my views sometimes like the Homika episodes, Pokabu episode and Kairyu episode but it wasn't because of you.
  9. Caseydia's Avatar
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    You finally understood Dragonite? That's great because I still haven't. I do however thought that maybe Georgia battling Iris in the Junior Cup later on would have been better for me. I just feel that Georgia's progress doesn't count towards Iris and that she's getting too far ahead of her in someway. I don't like how the rival girls in this saga are being pushed around. I bet if it was a boy, she would be getting beaten up pretty bad like May was from Drew.
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