well i dont know about the anime much since i stoped watching after johto but what you said apply to the pokemon community in general.
ever hear of the term genwunner? thats the term some "pokemon fans" use to refer to people who doesnt like other generation other than the first one.
and this "pokemons fans" dont consider the genwunner "pokemons fans", but the real question is, what is a real "pokemon fan"?
the answer is simple, anyone can be a pokemon fan, the problem is that people have a set of white and black mentality, in reality this is a grey area, if you only like gen 1 you are a pokemon fan, if you only like gen 6 you are a pokemon fan, if they want to make divisions between them thats alright but i find annoying that people NEED to say "you are not a pokemon fan"
I can recall a few reasons such as those for why I started falling out of Pokémon for a while.
- The 4Kids voice actors definitely. Watching dubs of the anime didn't feel the same anymore after they left, and I think it was one of the things that encouraged me to start watching the anime more in Japanese for having better consistency with their voice cast.
- The repetitive formula that the anime seemed to be having now and how it seemed like the show was never really going anywhere from when it started. At the start of every new series, Ash usually leaves the Pokémon he caught and friends he made in the last series behind before traveling to a new region, gets some new clothes for that region, makes newer friends (usually a new Gym leader or the female trainer of the current games), catches at least one of the new starter Pokémon from the current gen the series is in, and then by the time they get ready to start another new series for the next set of games this whole formula is recycled once again. It's made the anime all too predictable now.
- The loss of Misty and Brock as regular characters in the anime when they still kept things feeling familiar when at least one of them was with Ash. When the Best Wishes series started we suddenly had to adapt to all of Ash's traveling partners being new, unfamiliar faces like Iris and Cilan. The current cast in X & Y however is very appealing to me (one of the things that's helped grab my interest with the anime again), and it especially helped to know that Serena has some sort of childhood history with Ash.
- I didn't see this mentioned here, but a loss of interests in the current games is also something to consider. I personally think that the first two generations of games had the most appealing Pokémon in the entire series, but now I feel like newer Pokémon started becoming progressively less interesting and appealing ever since Gen 3 or 4. It also doesn't help that I found Black & White to be the least appealing new gen of Pokémon yet with hardly any new Pokémon to really captivate me, except maybe Genesect. However, Pokémon X & Y really rekindled my interest in the series again by introducing Mega Evolution and putting a new twist on old favorites. But it isn't just older Pokémon, as once again I've started finding some of the newly introduced Pokémon in those games appealing again, even if there aren't as many of them this time.
I agree with @Glitchipedia; that the game stories are better, but my main problem with the anime was really that it lacked an overall story arc that covers at least an entire season (excluding Ash's "journey to become a Pokemon Master", which is more of an excuse to keep the anime going) and its excessive use of filler, and because of that, I felt no need to continue watching.
I mean, think about how other shows/anime work. Usually, each season, if not the entirety of the show itself, will have a story arc that each episode will advance. Sometimes, the episodes will focus on character relationship building instead of the story, but this is allowable. But, what makes you want to continue watching the show? That is the story. I like to think of it as the "Next time on DRAGON BALL Z" effect, since most episodes of DBZ end with a cliffhanger, and then they show you some clips from the next episodes to make you want to keep watching. But with Pokemon, a lot of the episodes are stand alone, and after finishing an episode, there is rarely a feeling of "Oh my god, what's gonna happen next?"
And my bigger problem is that the anime does have potential, it just isn't used properly. Instead of having the Legendaries' main appearances be in the movies, their stories should be intertwined with the story of the anime, just like the games. For example, the GS Ball storyline that was discontinued. Or the fact that the Groudon vs. Kyogre battle (which only lasted two episodes) featured no Rayquaza. I feel like the anime has missed so many opportunities to be the very best, like no on ever was,, and that's why I don't watch it.
(Note: I heard that the BW anime was actually better and had a good story, and I don't know much about how good the XY one is either, so this comment doesn't apply to them.)
The reason I stopped watching the anime is mainly because I decided I like the games' story better. Looking back, I feel the anime has always been a rather poor adaptation of the games, even from the very beginning. Is it a good story in its own right? Eh, it entertains, but it definitely has room to improve.
The biggest problem I have with it, besides Ash Ketchum, is the focus on the relationship between humans and Pokémon. I mean, it's nice and all, but simply not applicable in a real world situation. As I understand it, the catalyst that ignited the idea for the games was that moment when Satoshi Tajiri first laid eyes on a link cable and conceived in his mind the concept that became Pokémon trading. Because of this, I feel the most important point of the franchise is the way it was designed to bring people together over a common interest. In short, the way that Pokémon help strengthen the relationships between human beings. Now that's a concept you can apply to real life.
Oh, so there was an actual study using Pokemon characters? This sounds fascinating, could you send a link to this? I wonder if they examined Brock as well.
No Misty does not need to come back to the show.
I expected Scott to post here. I am disappoint. Whenever either you or Scott posts something about Misty, the other is instantly drawn to it. :P
Ouch, that's really sad. Thanks for the link! Misty is great, and she definitely had given the show some good appeal.
Originally Posted by Garren College students describing a 12-year old girl as "romantic", I guess this pretty much proves what we all realized long ago about Misty fans. That decription from students contains quite alot of truth actually. Misty was definitely romantic talking quite a few times about love. Romance, relationship between boys and girls trying to pair others like Nidoran kids or Jenaro and Ariene from Whirl Islands., Fantasized over being in France and teaching Brock how to approach other girls(i remember one especially memorable moment frpom Johto when Temaku wanted to marry him) being angered by his pasiveness. @HumanDawn: Well according to this novelizations from Takeshi Shudo blogs Misty parents left their kids going who knows where, just like it was situation with Brock parents. New Old School
Granted not everything what mr. Shudo stated there counts as canon(in fact many or most things dont), but in Misty case this remark could very likely hold truth to it. Since whenever she was at Cerulean only Daisy and other two sisters were present with no signs of parents. Whenever there was flashback of her childhood(like getting ruptured dolls and left overs), or when being almost eaten by Gyarados as baby only her older sisters were shown taking care of her. Or better say not taking much care at all with Misty quite a few times through confession to Ash and Brock stating how she lived in their shadow not getting much attention at all telling how they don't know how its like to be youngest among siblings.
Making pretty strong case accompanied with what was showed in novelizations of Misty and her older sisters having to take care of themselves on their own.
Wait, where was it stated that Misty grew up without parents? It's been a long while since I've seen the OS(I've been rewatching some episodes though) and I don't recall such a thing ever being stated. Thanks in advance.
College students describing a 12-year old girl as "romantic", I guess this pretty much proves what we all realized long ago about Misty fans.
Good find! I already knew about the quoted portion, but your insight on this is interesting.
Well, growth and family might be a plausible reason. But we have to keep in mynd that the directors do not take in count the old viewers (even though, the fact that there still are should, i think, ring a bell in them), so they surely don't really care about them watching the anime, since it's well-known that their target audience goes from 7, or 8 years old up to puberty (it used to start at the age of 14, but they have lowered it even more now. 12 i think i'm not sure)
As they are firmly aiming for those kids around that age, the anime is even more "easy" to follow; with deconstructed plot-line and sporadic adventures it shouldn't be hard for young children to follow its "progress" (even if they are fully capable and at some point do want to watch a little more complex anime)
The thing is that a good anime, no matter how "old it gets", as long as its quality or that characteristic that makes people want to watch it, shouldn't have such drastic and long-termed rating drops. I think that what he's trying to show is that all these changes that have been made to the anime in order to middly satisfy little children, ended up erasing some (or most) of Pokemon's most appealing particularities. Is true that things are nost as they used to be, but i assure you that people have not stopped watching tv or decreased on the periodiciy of this act. As a matter of fact, the waste of resources is a common- and dangerous- matter, the rate of people that waste electricity trough electronic devises such as the tv, air conditioner, etc by letting them on when they don't use it is higher. And personally, even though i myself am quiet more busy than i was when i was a kid who loved pokemon, i still watch and look forward to watching things that i like on tv; and lack of consistency in story-line, a shallow scrypt, cero character's developing are not things the things i look for in a tv programme. But belive me, when i find one that does have these characteristics, i gladly arrange my schedule in order to watch at least some of the episodes.
And the worst part is that Pokemon used to be like that.
Maybe the reason why the ratings are declining is that people have jobs and school.
For example, let's say a Japanese citizen was 8 in 1997, when the anime first aired. In 2013, (s)he would be 24, maybe now with a job, and a possible wife/husband, and maybe even a child to take care of.
As for the Japanese kids of today? Well, they've just found other things to do, watch other anime, play more games (Monster Hunter, Dragon Quest - two of the most popular RPG franchises in Japan), and more, including schoolwork.
In other words, maybe the ratings are declining because everyone is more busy nowadays, or they have other things to do, and have more entertaining things to do.
Serena isnt much eyecandy now if only they used her game design...
Originally Posted by The Fighting Misty Just because the writers *can* bring back any old character means little if they don't have an interest in doing so. The show now is so far removed from what it was 16 years old that the writers could simply never have any of Ash's older friends show up again and it really makes no difference anymore. But that's entire point. Even if they didn't had interest in doing so in past doesn't have any bearing on future ad how will things play out. Writers plans and decisions change constantly as they continue to write for series and 90% of return from previous characters, pokemon etc happen spontaneously as they go on with various factors and variables such as anime current popularity, games, current characters for which writers find presence of previous one would be applicable to help move story forward , or increase of interest to do more with older one determining whether someone will be returned or not.
I believe BW2 showed how writers have no qualms in reviving popular previous character and pokemon, regardless of how absent they may have been if they find their presence and formed popularity and iconic status could help increase already staggered ratings, create hype and excitement to lure in more fans toward this show and do more with its story giving to watchers sequel and chance to see those they like in action again.
And as such they could likely decide to use Misty again at some point due to amount of hype, positive reception and popularity her presence could extract.
Yes it may have passed a lot of time and things aren't same anymore, but being old doesn't really prevents writers from making something significant with previous characters becoming vital part of story again.You can always incorporate previous companion in story again playing valuable role, while making sure that his own story/career receives benefit from it as well.
It only depends on having right vision through which character could go forward.
I agree that a character can appear at any time, but that doesn't mean its going to happen.
The DP saga went on for 4 years and 191 episodes. Yet in that entire timeframe the writers decided not to bring Misty back for even a single episode. There were so many DP fillers that could have been cut and turned into a short 4-episode arc for Misty, but it didn't happen.
Now with Best Wishes, the whole "reboot" aspect ignored all old characters till BW2 started. Then of course Dawn appeared because everyone knows the last gen girl will come back for another appearance. But now we're almost at the end of this gen, and even Brock wasn't brought back for a visit.
Just because the writers *can* bring back any old character means little if they don't have an interest in doing so. The show now is so far removed from what it was 16 years old that the writers could simply never have any of Ash's older friends show up again and it really makes no difference anymore.
I didn't ignore it, but i believe this was already covered in previous posts being showed how in comparison to other companions which left cast Misty still got more references and appearances than others rally did. When comparing number of references and throwbacks to Cerulean gym and misty in AG compared to amount of references to May and Max in DP after departure, or Brock and Dawn in BW numbers are more than enough self explanatory.
Regardless like i covered before both in Misty or any other character case as long they are referenced chances for return are up in air.
So you just ignored how I proved to you that every character has been referenced after they left the show? Tracey's appeared in at least one episode every region since Orange. May's been referenced in both DP and BW. Dawn just got the longest cameo return of any past character regardless if it wasn't anything special.
As the show progresses however outside of ending themes like the one we have now there's not much reason to bring this up.